| Re: Where Do People Go When They Die? by Freksy(m): 1:35pm On Oct 06, 2012 |
Rossikk: THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS DEATH
Whispers of the Soul
Josiane Antonette's near-death experience
Born in France and trained as a nurse, Josiane Antonette had a near-death experience in 1966 when she became aware of her ability to "communicate with the other side." For over 30 years, she has worked with the dying and the living, in hospitals as a chaplain, universities as a teacher, as a spiritual counselor, healer and ceremonial leader. Her understanding of living, dying and the spiritual realms has touched many people.
The following are short excepts from her most excellent book, Whispers Of The Soul. It is a book I highly recommend.
The Realm of Restless Spirits
My near-death experience shattered my world. It shook me into remembering spirit and other dimensions of life, which I had known as a child but had forgotten so that I could fit into society. I feel the jerking of the ambulance as it rushes me through the dark streets of Marseille to the hospital. Twenty-four hours have passed since my underground abortion with a feuseuse d'anges, an "angel maker." Abortion is illegal in France now, and many women die because of the unsanitary conditions of the procedure. I am only twenty-four years old, a young nurse. Am I dying? Am I outside myself observing? I see my body and its pain. I look at my feet; they are pale and lifeless. My legs cannot move. My face is white and drawn.
I watch as the walls of the ambulance dissolve. I see the lights of the city speed toward me. I can see the stars! What am I doing up so high? Why does everything look so small all of a sudden?
Memories pass before my eyes as in a movie.
(She momentarily returns to her body)
I see family members at the foot of my bed through a haze. Suddenly they disappear. From where they stood I see faces rushing toward me with incredible speed. They race toward my face, expanding then dissolving. Face after face washes over me! I am terrified. I'm drifting. I'm unable to keep my eyes open.
Who are these people? Some I recognize as people I've known who have died. Others I do not recognize.
"Stay away! Where is my family?"
Now the whole room is filled with spirits! They hover near me and look into my eyes. I try to push them away. I fight them. The experience seems to go on forever. These are spirits who are restless. Their faces are twisted with pain. They seem lost. It's frightening to see them walking back and forth around my bed. And now – spirits with glowing faces come close to me. They reflect a gentle and powerful light, reminding me of the pictures of beautiful angels that I love so much. I feel nurtured and loved by them, and enveloped by their luminescence. These beings are made of light, and even though their brilliance is intense, I am not blinded. Tremendous compassionate love surrounds me!
Now – I am filled with the essence of love and compassion. This magnetic power is filling every atom of me. I have never before experienced such depth and power of love. I am the power of love! Merging into an intimate dance wherein all boundaries have disappeared, I feel myself one with these beings of compassion.
No words or sounds are being exchanged, and yet communication is happening.
A strong presence assures me, "Yes, you are dying to the world of men. But to us you are being born. Do not be afraid. You have always been with us; we have always been with you. We know you. You just fell asleep during your time on Earth and forgot who you are. Now you are remembering."
Revelation fills my awareness – of course, yes! I am of the Beings of Light and they are of me! What is this new surge of energy? It begins as a very gentle vibration rising through the length of my body, from my feet to the top of my head, but now my whole self is vibrating. I hear buzzing. It is growing louder, and now the vibration and the buzzing are becoming one.
I feel such a wonderful release! I'm free! I can't resist this new and wonderful tide of energy sweeping my body upward. Now I'm on the hospital room ceiling gazing down! Everything appears so small: I see my bed; my body looks small and colorless; the people around the bed are tiny. Overwhelming grief and sorrow fill the room, and yet I feel completely disconnected from the scene below me. I hover nearer and look at the strange form lying on the bed. I feel compassion beyond words. I understand everything, but I have no feeling of attachment to anyone. I look at each person standing at the bedside and feel tremendous love.
I want to say to them, "I'm all right. You don't have to worry. I'm all right. Look at me! I'm fine!"
I am love; I am understanding; I am compassion!
My presence fills the room. And now I feel my presence in every room in the hospital. Even the tiniest space in the hospital is filled with this presence that is me. I sense myself beyond the hospital, above the city, even encompassing Earth. I am melting into the universe. I am everywhere at once. I see pulsing light everywhere. Such a loving presence envelops me!
I hear a voice say, "Life is a precious gift: to love, to care, to share."
Seeing a World of Darkness
Questions race through my awareness: Why is there so much pain in the world? Why are humans made of different colors? Why with different creeds? Why with different languages?
A vision appears. I see our world from the vantage point of a star, or another planet. Earth appears as a sphere cut in half. The surface of the planet is flat and colorless. The ground is bare. No living plant grows from the Earth. Tree branches are naked. There are no fruits, no flowers, no leaves. The barren hills are obscured behind a gray veil. It is a passionless place where no one rejoices at the sunrise, and no one knows when night comes. Naked phantom-like people stand on what seems to be a stage. All the actors are puppets animated by an invisible force. They move in unison and stop all at once.
On one side of half of the sphere, a sun attempts to shine upon the stage, but no one pays attention or makes a sound. Even the birds in the dead trees are silent and motionless. The other side of the half sphere is in darkness. I watch as the darkness grows with frightening speed and covers the whole planet. No one pays attention. Now the darkness covers the sunlight, and now it covers all the bright planets in the universe.
"This is the world with the absence of light, love, and free will," the voice states. "It is the people's choices that created the world you have just seen."
With these words, the nightmarish world begins to dissolve and is replaced by the other half of the planet – a place of vibrant, breathtaking beauty. I perceive how the Earth, the sun, the moon, the darkness, the light, the planets, and all forms of life – plants, rocks, animals, people – are interconnected; they come from the same source of light. Everything is united by a transparent net, or web, and each thread shines with great radiance. Everything pulses with the same luminosity – a magnificent light of unparalleled brilliance.
"From the light we have come, and to the light we all shall return," continues the voice.
I realize now I have been standing in the middle of the two worlds. And with this understanding, an image of the path I have been walking appears. It is narrow and rocky; I have the sensation of losing my balance. I grow afraid of falling into the darkened planet. Free will! With the remembering, I gaze at my invisible feet. The narrow path changes into a wide road. The darkness is replaced by light.
"Never, never forget." I hear the voice say.
Merging with the light, I am so overcome with gratitude and overwhelmed by the love that fills me that I cry.
Suddenly, time and space are different again, and I am momentarily aware of my body.
I am aware that the window to the left of my bed is filled with vibrant, powerful light. It seems to be calling me and pulling me toward it like a magnet. I hear the buzzing again, and ... Whoosh! I'm zooming through the window! I merge with the light! I am the light, and the light is me.
"From the light we have come, and to the light we shall all return," repeats the voice.
What a joy to bathe in this incredible all-knowing, all-loving...
I can travel through walls, ceilings, and space at amazing speed! I visit my son, Philippe, who is only four.
A tremendous power moves me. I am boundless, formless, no longer controlled by my emotions. I am everything. Everything is me!
I'm back in the hospital room. A mist coming from the door facing my bed attracts my attention. In the middle of the vapor is a being with the most heavenly smile. Jean Pierre! It is my cousin, Jean Pierre! I am overwhelmed with joy. As I gaze at Jean Pierre, the hospital room disappears. We are suspended in midair. There are no windows or doors, no ceiling or ground. A brilliant radiance fills all space. He slowly approaches my bed and bends to kiss me. I feel the moisture of his lips on my face, the weight of his body against mine, the gentle touch of his hands on me.
Jean Pierre is the brother I never had. After a long and painful battle with lung cancer, he died two years ago when he was only twenty-two. I am still grieving his passing. How wonderful to see him again! And what is this? He is wearing his butterscotch jacket. This jacket has been the subject of many discussions. He loves it; I hate it.
"How did you know I was here?"
My question is a thought not yet put into words as Jean Pierre answers, "We know everything about you, and we welcome you."
Such a warm feeling of peace! I am complete – whole! I am free of pain and fear. There is no past or future – everything is! There is no need to speak to be understood or to communicate. I feel serenity beyond anything I have ever known. And joy of joys: I can fly! I swirl easily and with great speed around my cousin in a playful way, expressing the ultimate joy that is me. Everything is the way it should be. Never have I felt so clear, so complete, so loved. I gaze at myself: I am whole and healed! I can interact and play with Jean Pierre with my natural vigor. Familiar Beings of Light are here, too. I immerse myself in their loving presence. It's as if they are protecting me and carrying me. We are all interconnected. I relax into the timeless joy. What a glorious feeling! I want to be here forever. Jean Pierre is gazing at me now as the other beings begin to depart. His dark eyes are filled with great tenderness and purity. He turns to leave with the others, and I plead with him to take me with him. His eyes fill with sadness.
"Not now," he responds. "There is much, much work for you. You have to go back and tell them. Life is a precious gift. Each moment is filled with great opportunities. Don't waste your time on Earth. Spread love and understanding. We will always be with you – guiding you, protecting you, awaiting the time when we will be reunited – when your work on Earth is over."
I watch as Jean Pierre dissolves into the same brilliant light with which he had entered. The light is fading away, too.
The room is empty now. My grief is intense. I start to cry out of desperation and loneliness.
Suddenly, I'm back in the hospital in bed. I am fully aware of my surroundings and my physical state of being. Tubes are implanted in my body. The pain is overwhelming. My sadness is intense. I am so weak I cannot speak. I have lost my voice, and the doctors are alarmed by the tears which are using up the strength I need to recuperate. Crying is all I want to do! My body feels like a suit that is too tight; the room is confining; the smell of sickness surprises my senses; the human condition saddens me.
"Josianne, you're back!" I recognize my sister's voice. I see her careful gaze. "You've been in a coma for three days. We didn't know if you were coming back."
"From the light we have come and to the light we shall return." - Josiane Antonette
http://www.near-death.com/antonette.html.
For more NDE accounts visit www.near-death.com Those who have been near death have, in other words, never actually been dead. They experienced something while they were still alive. A person is still alive even seconds before his death. They were near death but not yet dead. what Josiane Antonette experienced was not difference from what some of us experience whenever we have serious malaria. The published near-death experiences are almost always depicted as being positive, although it is known that negative experiences also occur. Many publishers often establish their church afterwards. The reason for doing so is always what has been highligted above in your quoted post. As for me, when you die, you return to dust, for from it you came to be. All the chemical elements that make up man is found in the dust 100%. The amount of information in your brain is more than what you can relate in your present lifespan. This explains why you can dream for just a few seconds, but relate same in minutes or perhaps hours. Whenever the body is at rest momentarily due to sleep, sickness, drugs intake and the likes, it presents an opportunity for the brain to give an infinitesimal release of astronomical amount of what it has in-stored. They are life but not afterlife experiences. |
| Re: Where Do People Go When They Die? by Kay17: 4:12pm On Oct 06, 2012 |
benodic: @ Kay 17
it is okay if you accept the materialist explanations of our beingness. for me my convictions rest on my personal experiences which of course no one can take from me. like i said earlier things of the spirit are not subject to scientific dissection because material scientists do not have the instruments to penetrate the spiritual worlds to record the events there.
the instruments that can penetrate the spiritual worlds are our spiritual ears and and spiritual eyes with which your real self, soul, uses to see into and explore the inner spiritual worlds. the experiences you have there are subjective and not open to objective analysis. you can only understand it when you have the experience yourself but until then you will never understand where i am coming from. A spiritual world built up by personal experience? The possibility of error is enormous. You could be insane, or mentally exhausted, or sick. Coupled with it is the lack of a common experience among all humans of this nature. One has to be skeptical and decipher this experience. |
| Re: Where Do People Go When They Die? by benodic: 6:22pm On Oct 06, 2012 |
@ kay 17
A spiritual world built up by personal
experience? The possibility of error is
enormous. You could be insane, or
mentally exhausted, or sick. Coupled with
it is the lack of a common experience
among all humans of this nature. One has
to be skeptical and decipher this
experience.
people of like minds and like experiences gravitate together. You would not know about that because you have not had the experience. There are thousands of people who have had and when we come together to compare notes we understand each other perfectly well. so i have nothing to prove to anyone. What matters is how has your believes and experiences changed you. Is it for the better or for worse. If for the better then you are on the right track |
| Re: Where Do People Go When They Die? by benodic: 6:47pm On Oct 06, 2012 |
@ freksy
Fallacy! It's a brain work, nothing really
leaves the body. Moreover, those who
believe in reincarnation say that the very
meaning of being reborn is to get a new
chance to better our situation.
If this is so, why in this day and age do
wickedness dominates the world scene
more than ever? If only good people are
reborn as humans, where did all the
wicked people come from? Should not
there be fewer and fewer wicked people?
Is the purpose of reincarnation not
defeated?
The truth is: Nobody, good or wicked, is
ever reincarnated to begin another life as
a human or anything else for that matter.
if that is what you accept as the truth it is very okay with me. I am not bothered in the least. We are here to say our side of the story of life. If my own side benefits you, then fine, you can make use of it. If it doesn't then you can drop it and move on, no problem at all. In due course of time, when you are ready, you will know what is the truth and what is not. |
| Re: Where Do People Go When They Die? by benodic: 6:47pm On Oct 06, 2012 |
@ freksy
Fallacy! It's a brain work, nothing really
leaves the body. Moreover, those who
believe in reincarnation say that the very
meaning of being reborn is to get a new
chance to better our situation.
If this is so, why in this day and age do
wickedness dominates the world scene
more than ever? If only good people are
reborn as humans, where did all the
wicked people come from? Should not
there be fewer and fewer wicked people?
Is the purpose of reincarnation not
defeated?
The truth is: Nobody, good or wicked, is
ever reincarnated to begin another life as
a human or anything else for that matter.
if that is what you accept as the truth it is very okay with me. I am not bothered in the least. We are here to say our side of the story of life. If my own side benefits you, then fine, you can make use of it. If it doesn't then you can drop it and move on, no problem at all. In due course of time, when you are ready, you will know what is the truth and what is not. |
| Re: Where Do People Go When They Die? by truthislight: 9:02am On Oct 07, 2012 |
benodic: @ freksy
if that is what you accept as the truth it is very okay with me. I am not bothered in the least. We are here to say our side of the story of life. If my own side benefits you, then fine, you can make use of it. If it doesn't then you can drop it and move on, no problem at all.
In due course of time, when you are ready, you will know what is the truth and what is not. why did you not say this from the start and you when you started instead you had wished that people followed you to that end? If someone that says he knows like in GENESIS 3:19 why then do you contradict him by starting your own experiences and those of the like.? Then someone that dreamed and saw himself as a king and servants can conclude that he was a king in his past life. No? Whats the difference? |
| Re: Where Do People Go When They Die? by eyenCalabar(m): 5:25pm On Oct 07, 2012 |
I think there are 3 kinds of people in the world: those that knows the TRUTH and are living in it, those criticizing the TRUTH (that means they know) and those that doesn't know the TRUTH. If you believe in God, you should be able to believe in His son, Jesus Christ. And this Jesus Christ said: I am the way, the TRUTH and the life. So why should a man spends his entire life studying his physical and spiritual operations rather than knowing and studying the TRUTH? I feel in a bit to knowing the TRUTH, all other things would be revealed to you rather than spending a short life that you have to live studying an imperfect man and his operations. So what are you going to do now? |
| Re: Where Do People Go When They Die? by benodic: 8:33pm On Oct 07, 2012 |
there is only one way to God and that is the Holy Spirit. it is through the agency of the Holy Spirit that soul is lead to all truth. all the masters who come to earth are only channels for the Holy Spirit at that point in time. as a channel for the Holy Spirit you are the way, the truth and the light. not you as an individual but the Holy Spirit that is now operating through you.
the Holy Spirit is a universal spirit and is not sole preserve of any religion. once soul comes into conscious contact with the Holy Spirit It becomes a changed being manifesting all the qualities of God. this contact is open to all souls be you a christian, moslem, atheist, buddhist etc. because in It we live, move and have our being. all it takes is the opening of your heart to love. |
| Re: Where Do People Go When They Die? by eyenCalabar(m): 10:48pm On Oct 07, 2012 |
benodic:
there is only one way to God and that is the Holy Spirit. it is through the agency of the Holy Spirit that soul is lead to all truth. all the masters who come to earth are only channels for the Holy Spirit at that point in time. as a channel for the Holy Spirit you are the way, the truth and the light. not you as an individual but the Holy Spirit that is now operating through you.
the Holy Spirit is a universal spirit and is not sole preserve of any religion. once soul comes into conscious contact with the Holy Spirit It becomes a changed being manifesting all the qualities of God. this contact is open to all souls be you a christian, moslem, atheist, buddhist etc. because in It we live, move and have our being. all it takes is the opening of your heart to love. Permit me to ask you this: What's your view about these three -God, Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit? What I mean is what's your definition for each of them? |
| Re: Where Do People Go When They Die? by benodic: 2:08am On Oct 09, 2012 |
@ eyencalabar
Permit me to ask you this:
What's your view about these three -
God, Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit?
What I mean is what's your definition
for each of them?
God is the Supreme being. The causeless cause. Jesus christ. A soul that reached the level of christ consciousness in which he realized his oneness with God and took the mission of letting his fellow souls know about their oneness withGod too. The Holy spirit: God in expression. The life force that gives sustenance to all life and encompasses all life. Can be seen as a light and heard as a sound. |
| Re: Where Do People Go When They Die? by Kay17: 6:05am On Oct 09, 2012 |
^^
What if a couple of people and mine experiences don't account for the above, will it still be valid. |
| Re: Where Do People Go When They Die? by benodic: 8:08am On Oct 09, 2012 |
@ kay 17
What if a couple of people and mine
experiences don't account for the above,
will it still be valid.
truth is never for the masses because really most people do not want it and most are not ready for it. So even when it stares them straight in the face they will not even recognise it. It is only the few who are bold and courageous can step boldly into the inner worlds and experience truth for themselves. there is no way you can judge whether it is valid or not until you experience it yourself. Otherwise you can continue with your arguments and counter arguments, proofs and counter proofs. Those who have had the experience knows and will never be bothered about what the majority who knows not think. |
| Re: Where Do People Go When They Die? by Kay17: 8:39am On Oct 09, 2012 |
Little bit of truth in that. However that increases the margin of error. Besides the most basic truths are universal. |
| Re: Where Do People Go When They Die? by truthislight: 7:38pm On Oct 09, 2012 |
Kay 17: Little bit of truth in that. However that increases the margin of error. Besides the most basic truths are universal. very apt. That pretty sums it all. In fact, you simply expressed my own thinking Kay 17: basic truths are universal.
absolutely. But fraud will want you to suspend your sense of reason so as to be open to manipulation. |
| Re: Where Do People Go When They Die? by benodic: 8:03pm On Oct 09, 2012 |
@ kay 17
the basic truths are universal indeed but the funny thing is that not many people are even ready to accept the most basic truths talk less of more advanced ones.
Talking about truth will never take you anywhere. You have to experience it to realize it in order to make it part and parcel of your life whereby you become the living truth. That step is what scares a lot of people.
Anyway there is no problem at all. Each soul will come into spiritual maturity when it is ready. It is just a matter of time. |
| Re: Where Do People Go When They Die? by eyenCalabar(m): 11:13am On Oct 10, 2012 |
benodic: @ kay 17
the basic truths are universal indeed but the funny thing is that not many people are even ready to accept the most basic truths talk less of more advanced ones.
Talking about truth will never take you anywhere. You have to experience it to realize it in order to make it part and parcel of your life whereby you become the living truth. That step is what scares a lot of people.
Anyway there is no problem at all. Each soul will come into spiritual maturity when it is ready. It is just a matter of time.
 |
| Re: Where Do People Go When They Die? by Kay17: 7:46am On Oct 11, 2012 |
benodic: @ kay 17
the basic truths are universal indeed but the funny thing is that not many people are even ready to accept the most basic truths talk less of more advanced ones.
Talking about truth will never take you anywhere. You have to experience it to realize it in order to make it part and parcel of your life whereby you become the living truth. That step is what scares a lot of people.
Anyway there is no problem at all. Each soul will come into spiritual maturity when it is ready. It is just a matter of time.
You are still using your personal experience as the ultimate authority for knowledge, rather than Reason. No one can say they don't exist, that's a fundamental truth. Likewise the strength of Reason. |
| Re: Where Do People Go When They Die? by haibe(m): 9:43am On Oct 11, 2012 |
@benodic since all religion can get in contact with the holy spirit and produce god-like characters, why did Jesus say we have to be born again to enter into the kingdom of heaven? |
| Re: Where Do People Go When They Die? by benodic: 8:37pm On Oct 11, 2012 |
@ kay 17
You are still using your personal experience as the ultimate authority for knowledge, rather than Reason. No one can say they don't exist, that's a fundamental truth. Likewise the strength of Reason.
my personal experience is my ultimate proof and authority that a truth is real or not. i will never just accept whatever is written in any book as truth without experiencing it for myself. reasoning can only take you as far as the mental plane beyond that in the worlds of pure spirit the mind ceases to operate. those are the worlds of knowingness and beingness where you exist as pure soul. |
| Re: Where Do People Go When They Die? by benodic: 8:49pm On Oct 11, 2012 |
@ haibe
@benodic since all religion can get in contact with the holy spirit and produce god-like characters, why did Jesus say we have to be born again to enter into the kingdom of heaven?
being born again is simply linking up with the Holy Spirit and being under its guidance. as the Holy Spirit flows more through the person he or she becomes more and more purified. the negative nature of that person starts falling away and the person becomes a new creature. this experience is privy to all souls that love God and love life. love and love alone is the key. the use of prayers like the Spiritual Exercises especially the singing of the HU has the power to open your heart centre to God's love enabling the Holy Spirit to start flowing through you gradually transforming you into an incandescent lover of God and all life. you no longer find it difficult to give love to all life because you have become love itself. It is through the agency of the Holy Spirit that soul is then taken step by step into the heavenly kingdom of God. |
| Re: Where Do People Go When They Die? by Kay17: 9:39pm On Oct 11, 2012 |
benodic: @ kay 17
my personal experience is my ultimate proof and authority that a truth is real or not. i will never just accept whatever is written in any book as truth without
experiencing it for myself. reasoning can only take you as far as the mental plane beyond that in the worlds of pure spirit the mind ceases to operate. those are the worlds of knowingness and beingness where you exist as pure soul.
BUT if one goes against reason, the irrational is unavoidable. I can't claim number one and number two are the same number. Reason is essential or else even your personal experiences must be interpreted meaningfully. |
| Re: Where Do People Go When They Die? by benodic: 10:23am On Oct 12, 2012 |
@ kay 17
BUT if one goes against reason, the irrational is unavoidable. I can't claim number one and number two are the same number. Reason is essential or else even your personal experiences must be interpreted meaningfully.
maybe i am not understanding you very well. what exactly do you mean by reason. can you back it up with a specific example so as to clarify it further. there is one thing i know and that is that in the search for spirituality you do not throw your common sense away, i do not know whether it is connected. |
