I read an interesting article today about how men and women's attitudes have changed over the years for dual-career couples (that is both husband and wife working full time outside the home). It was started off by a pregnant woman being appointed CEO of Yahoo.

http://blogs.hbr.org/cs/2012/10/new_research_on_working_parent.html?referral=00563&cm_mmc=email-_-newsletter-_-daily_alert-_-alert_date&utm_source=newsletter_daily_alert&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=alert_date

What I found most interesting was this comment: There is now a greater sense of shared responsibility for domestic life. Young men are realizing they have to do more at home than their fathers did, and today's young men want to do so. Ellen Galinsky's research on the "new male mystique" affirms this trend.


That got me thinking - Are Nigerian (or African) men actually changing as described above or are we still stuck in the 'traditional' idea of the woman doing most/all of the domestic work regardless of whether the wife works or not?

A lot of them have changed I think. There was this guy that oved here from Nigerian. I remember the first time my husband met him , he still had that traditional mentality in him. Fast forward nearly two years later, this guy has become professional in house chores.

Some parents instill that traditional mentality in their male kids whilst some, like mine made sure the boys were good cooks and house cleaners before they left home

^^^
Always good to read something positive about men.

I think there may be a difference between the Nigerian men living in Nigeria and those living in the West.

The rate of change within Nigeria is probably slower. In the West, it's a necessity as there are fewer opportunities for househelps or younger live in relatives, so all domestic chores are on the heads of the husband and wife. Men in the West (Nigerian or otherwise) therefore tend to take domestic responsibilities a lot more seriously.

True @ Claus

Location is the key word in your post. I for one think,its mostly because they have more support system in Nigeria as opposed to the west were take for instance, we pay 70 dollars per day on child care. The men here tend to adjust in a way that, they are taking care of the kids when wife is at work and vice versa.

Yea, especially in child care. I duff my hat for some of them, its no longer sit and read newspaper, a lot of them understand Madam now works, no more child slaves so for an efficient home they have to chip in.
Hubby is wonderful with child care, waving meals and laundary, His Mother when she visits makes him even more domestic, she had all boys and had to raise them well
. So I was lucky not to have the tradition stuck in him.
However he can be annoying sometimes, he doesn't get it done exactly how I want, I have learnt to bite my tongue and say "Thank you Baby/ Welldone baby"
We have help during the week when we are both at work, weekends its just us, we share responsibilities just as we share bills. Same way I don't fall back on my share of the bills same way he does his share of work with pride and joy. He always says to his friends who mock him; My house is my heaven, if I make it nice na me go stay enjoy am

^^^
Hahahaha.. classic case and same in my house. My wife's domestic standards are so much higher than mine.

A lot of the things I do, it's because I know it'll keep her happy (and therefore allow for peace in my home ). If it was entirely up to me, we would be doing a lot less domestic work. I'm quite lazy in that regard.

@ debrief which one is exactly the way you want again? Appreciate and praise him with oriki Abeg... Many men don't do squat!

jidegirl12: @ debrief which one is exactly the way you want again? Appreciate and praise him with oriki Abeg... Many men don't do squat!

Didnt you read the part where i wrote that i say thank you and well done? What other women accept has nothing to do with me, If I also did things he didnt like he would complain, me and my husband are open with each other and it works for us, but at the same time we try not to nag too much or be too critical, we learn and grow everyday

debrief08:
Didnt you read the part where i wrote that i say thank you and well done? What other women accept has nothing to do with me, If I also did things he didnt like he would complain, me and my husband are open with each other and it works for us, but at the same time we try not to nag too much or be too critical, we learn and grow everyday

Lucky you...I'm not talking bout what other women accept ( whatever rocks anybody's boat meern) ...my post was directed to you that's all....

debosky: I read an interesting article today about how men and women's attitudes have changed over the years for dual-career couples (that is both husband and wife working full time outside the home). It was started off by a pregnant woman being appointed CEO of Yahoo.

http://blogs.hbr.org/cs/2012/10/new_research_on_working_parent.html?referral=00563&cm_mmc=email-_-newsletter-_-daily_alert-_-alert_date&utm_source=newsletter_daily_alert&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=alert_date

What I found most interesting was this comment: There is now a greater sense of shared responsibility for domestic life. Young men are realizing they have to do more at home than their fathers did, and today's young men want to do so. Ellen Galinsky's research on the "new male mystique" affirms this trend.


That got me thinking - Are Nigerian (or African) men actually changing as described above or are we still stuck in the 'traditional' idea of the woman doing most/all of the domestic work regardless of whether the wife works or not?

Well technically, women still do MOST of the work most of the time.

But the change is unavoidable . . I think most men are begining to realize they don't have a choice. Things are no more the way it used to be.

Back in the days, men go to work all day while women stay home and do the chores. But today, women work equally and sometimes more than the men!

But still when a man does chores, he expects to be thanked because he thinks he's 'helping'. It really shouldn't be that way. Men need to start seeing these things as part of their own responsibilities rather than a favour to their wives.

We still have a loooooooog way to go here in Nigeria.

jidegirl12:

Lucky you...I'm not talking bout what other women accept ( whatever rocks anybody's boat meern) ...my post was directed to you that's all....

Lol, no be fight my sister, you said "some men" thats why I responded that what happens in their own marriage dey different.
I understand your point and if you had read my first point you will see that I stated that i bite my tongue and say "thank you", in my house when you state your disapproval once or twice you let it be, and hopefully the person makes small changes.
Secondly if we dont like something we dont keep it we say it to each other, in the beginning I would keep quiet but hubby and I had a family meeting and worked on those issues and opening communication lines between us. We disagree to agree but never nag or hide things we dont like

Ujujoan:

But still when a man does chores, he expects to be thanked because he thinks he's 'helping'. It really shouldn't be that way. Men need to start seeing these things as part of their own responsibilities rather than a favour to their wives.

Slight generalisation there. Your statement is true of the "old guard", but with the "new guard" the attitude is different. I caveat that by adding that the new guard in Nigeria are behind their Western counterparts.

In any case, being thanked is a healthy part of marriage as it stops people being taken for granted. Anyone that throws down a good meal etc should be thanked.

Claus:

Slight generalisation there. Your statement is true of the "old guard", but with the "new guard" the attitude is different. I caveat that by adding that the new guard in Nigeria are behind their Western counterparts.

In any case, being thanked is a healthy part of marriage as it stops people being taken for granted. Anyone that throws down a good meal etc should be thanked.

And besides I strongly believe 'MEN' are lazy in nature when it comes to house chores, they just do these things to please their spouses otherwise .,

they are naturally built or should I say have a mentality of being financially responsible for their family...

Things are changing now and that's a good thing

however we women should appreciate every little they do as long as they're responsible at home in crucial areas.,..

I've been to a friend's house and her husband cooked everything we ate( egusi, iyan, soup).... but honestly that's a big turn off for me.... nah not to that extent ...child care is enough for me... But that's me

Claus:

Slight generalisation there. Your statement is true of the "old guard", but with the "new guard" the attitude is different. I caveat that by adding that the new guard in Nigeria are behind their Western counterparts.

In any case, being thanked is a healthy part of marriage as it stops people being taken for granted. Anyone that throws down a good meal etc should be thanked.

When I said 'Being thanked' in this context, I was referring to being praised for 'helping'.

Since you claim to be a new 'guard', I have a couple of questions for you . . .


1. If someone had to stop work and be a stay at home parent, who would it be? You or your wife?

2. If someone had to go to the kitchen and micro wave dinner when you both came home from work AT THE SAME TIME, who will it be?

jidegirl12:

And besides I strongly believe 'MEN' are lazy in nature when it comes to house chores, they just do these things to please their spouses otherwise .,

they are naturally built or should I say have a mentality of being financially responsible for their family...

Things are changing now and that's a good thing

however we women should appreciate every little they do as long as they're responsible at home in crucial areas.,..

I've been to a friend's house and her husband cooked everything we ate( egusi, iyan, soup).... but honestly that's a big turn off for me.... nah not to that extent ...child care is enough for me... But that's me

What about when the couple splits bills down to the middle? Should the Wife still be responsible for all chores?
Secondly saying men are naturally lazy with chores is like saying women are naturally lazy in having careers, how did the man survive before he married? How will the wife provide for her self before she married? I believe every one of every gender is capable of performing every task, there is no role selection, I can be just as good as a provider as my husband in case of Job loss, sickness and death and He can be just a good a home maker in case I die, i am sick or unable to perform roles I normally perform. No one should be totally dependent on another.
Like you said whatever works for each couple.

jidegirl12:

And besides I strongly believe 'MEN' are lazy in nature when it comes to house chores, they just do these things to please their spouses otherwise .,

they are naturally built or should I say have a mentality of being financially responsible for their family...

Things are changing now and that's a good thing

however we women should appreciate every little they do as long as they're responsible at home in crucial areas.,..

I've been to a friend's house and her husband cooked everything we ate( egusi, iyan, soup).... but honestly that's a big turn off for me.... nah not to that extent ...child care is enough for me... But that's me

Men are not 'lazy', they just dont think they should be the ones doing the chores. They think it's someone else' responsibility, like their wife . . . People like you arew the ones encouraging them!

What's wrong with a man cooking? But then again like you siad, that's you!

Ujujoan:
Since you claim to be a new 'guard', I have a couple of questions for you . . .


1. If someone had to stop work and be a stay at home parent, who would it be? You or your wife?

2. If someone had to go to the kitchen and micro wave dinner when you both came home from work AT THE SAME TIME, who will it be?

Good questions!

Ujujoan:

When I said 'Being thanked' in this context, I was referring to being praised for 'helping'.

Since you claim to be a new 'guard', I have a couple of questions for you . . .


1. If someone had to stop work and be a stay at home parent, who would it be? You or your wife?

2. If someone had to go to the kitchen and micro wave dinner when you both came home from work AT THE SAME TIME, who will it be?

Apologies, when I saw "being thanked", I interpreted it to mean.. being thanked. A simple mistake that anyone can make.

1) If someone had to stop work permanently and be a stay at home parent, it would be my wife. It's a very logical decision. I earn almost triple what my wife earns. It would be a foolish financial decision if we decided it should be me that stays at home. If the incomes were reversed and someone HAD to give up their job it would surely be me.

On a related matter, our daughter was ill yesterday, so after discussing our current workloads in the office, we decided that I would stay at home to look after her. As an aside, my wife thanked me, although inside I didn't feel it was necessary.

2) My wife and I have both have different specialisations when it comes to domestics. On the cooking front she takes the majority, so on any given day it's likely she'll do the cooking. If it's microwaving, then it could be either of us. I normally do weekend breakfast. I also throw down some of our nice Naija meals occassionally (my wife's from Zim).

On a few other fronts, I take the majority e.g. she HATES cleaning the toilet/bathroom, so I always do it. I can't go into too much detail so it doesn't appear formulaic, but we share.

PS: I didn't actually claim to be new guard, but I do now.

debrief08:
I believe every one of every gender is capable of performing every task, there is no role selection, I can be just as good as a provider as my husband in case of Job loss, sickness and death and He can be just a good a home maker in case I die, i am sick or unable to perform roles I normally perform. No one should be totally dependent on another.
Like you said whatever works for each couple.

I agree to a large extent, but I do feel there should be degree of selection when it comes to roles - either due to upbringing/social conditioning or just natural interest. E.g. I can cook way better than me/my partner is a terrible cook, then it's foolish for both of us to suffer eating salty/poorly cooked food just to prove a point on gender roles. Likewise, if she's better at cooking and I'm better at DIY, or if we prefer/agree to split those tasks in that way then it works as well.

I like to think of it in terms of efficiency - let each person do what they are best at (without overburdening their partner)for the benefit of the home. However I definitely agree that both parties should be able to do the basics.

The key like you said is what works for every couple.

debosky:

I agree to a large extent, but I do feel there should be degree of selection when it comes to roles - either due to upbringing/social conditioning or just natural interest. E.g. I can cook way better than me/my partner is a terrible cook, then it's foolish for both of us to suffer eating salty/poorly cooked food just to prove a point on gender roles. Likewise, if she's better at cooking and I'm better at DIY, or if we prefer/agree to split those tasks in that way then it works as well.

I like to think of it in terms of efficiency - let each person do what they are best at (without overburdening their partner)for the benefit of the home. However I definitely agree that both parties should be able to do the basics.

The key like you said is what works for every couple.

I agree. Hubby Has always been a mediocre cook, i on the other hand love to cook. He cooks some weekends but most week nights I cook and bake. sundays we make soup, thats our fun family time even the older boy pitches in doing something small to contribute.
However he doesnt like us spending too much time cooking so sometimes he brings back something from work, no packed lunches, when we are free we have lunch during the day and have fun exploring new restaurants and giving them stars.
On child care he has an A, much better than I am maybe because he has a large family, he has the energy for the boys, is up most feeding times at night, heats the milk and gives them so like you said what everyone is good at.

debrief08:
What about when the couple splits bills down to the middle? Should the Wife still be responsible for all chores?
Secondly saying men are naturally lazy with chores is like saying women are naturally lazy in having careers, how did the man survive before he married? How will the wife provide for her self before she married? I believe every one of every gender is capable of performing every task, there is no role selection, I can be just as good as a provider as my husband in case of Job loss, sickness and death and He can be just a good a home maker in case I die, i am sick or unable to perform roles I normally perform. No one should be totally dependent on another.
Like you said whatever works for each couple.

@ debrief you are very funny? Are you splitting responsibilities now cos of house chores?

Bills has to be paid no matter what , as long as you're a career woman , you must assist.( I know I'm pissing you off now but it's true)

Bills and house chores are totally 2 different things( give me examples of your own chores that has to be split)

Child care is totally understandable when it comes to a vital responsibility a spouse must help with.

That's just me tho

Ujujoan:

Men are not 'lazy', they just dont think they should be the ones doing the chores. They think it's someone else' responsibility, like their wife . . . People like you arew the ones encouraging them!

What's wrong with a man cooking? But then again like you siad, that's you!

@ Uju I don't want my man cooking period!

jidegirl12:

@ debrief you are very funny? Are you splitting responsibilities now cos of house chores?

Bills has to be paid no matter what , as long as you're a career woman , you must assist.( I know I'm pissing you off now but it's true)

Bills and house chores are totally 2 different things( give me examples of your own chores that has to be split)

Child care is totally understandable when it comes to a vital responsibility a spouse must help with.

That's just me tho

My dear it takes a lot to piss me off, I may disagree but get pissed off for having a different opinion, No Nah. We are different.
Well to us bills and chores are on the same level, we actually stayed up one night and shared bills and chores, we each try not to fail in our respective responsibilities. If I cant do something i inform him ahead of time and vice versa
Lol, you use words as "must" making it compulsory then you end with "thats me though" lol.

Claus:

Apologies, when I saw "being thanked", I interpreted it to mean.. being thanked. A simple mistake that anyone can make.

.

I guess I should have explianed it better . . .

1) If someone had to stop work permanently and be a stay at home parent, it would be my wife. It's a very logical decision. I earn almost triple what my wife earns. It would be a foolish financial decision if we decided it should be me that stays at home. If the incomes were reversed and someone HAD to give up their job it would surely be me.

On a related matter, our daughter was ill yesterday, so after discussing our current workloads in the office, we decided that I would stay at home to look after her. As an aside, my wife thanked me, although inside I didn't feel it was necessary.

Good answer . . . make a great deal of sense, logically!

But then again the idea that you would quit your job if the tables were turned is easier said than done. Highly unlikely!

When you stayed home to take care of your lil girl, why do you think your wife 'thanked' you? It's because she thinks you are doing her a favour? She really shouldn't think that way cos it should be your responsibility as well as hers . . .

.

2) My wife and I have both have different specialisations when it comes to domestics. On the cooking front she takes the majority, so on any given day it's likely she'll do the cooking. If it's microwaving, then it could be either of us. I normally do weekend breakfast. I also throw down some of our nice Naija meals occassionally (my wife's from Zim).

On a few other fronts, I take the majority e.g. she HATES cleaning the toilet/bathroom, so I always do it. I can't go into too much detail so it doesn't appear formulaic, but we share . . .

Still didn't answer my question . . .

Okay to put it in another way . . . If you both stayed home all day, doing nothing, and someone had to go vacuum the house, who would it be

Maybe you should give more instances . . . cos I think cooking is generally seen as a female role, just like cleaning bathrooms is a male's role!

PS: I didn't actually claim to be new guard, but I do now

LMAO . .

Well from your post you appear to be, but I seriously doubt it!

debrief08:
My dear it takes a lot to piss me off, I may disagree but get pissed off for having a different opinion, No Nah. We are different.
Well to us bills and chores are on the same level, we actually stayed up one night and shared bills and chores, we each try not to fail in our respective responsibilities. If I cant do something i inform him ahead of time and vice versa
Lol, you use words as "must" making it compulsory then you end with "thats me though" lol.

Interesting! bills and chores in the same category... Ummmm .

But it's true if you work you must help with the bills , and he must help with child care too , there are some things that is a must. It's a no brainer

jidegirl12:

Interesting! bills and chores in the same category... Ummmm .

But it's true if you work you must help with the bills , and he must help with child care too , there are some things that is a must. It's a no brainer

My Sister nothing is a must oh between couples, each has a system that works for them. No one is right or wrong as long as they both agree

debosky:

I agree to a large extent, but I do feel there should be degree of selection when it comes to roles - either due to upbringing/social conditioning or just natural interest. E.g. I can cook way better than me/my partner is a terrible cook, then it's foolish for both of us to suffer eating salty/poorly cooked food just to prove a point on gender roles. Likewise, if she's better at cooking and I'm better at DIY, or if we prefer/agree to split those tasks in that way then it works as well.

I like to think of it in terms of efficiency - let each person do what they are best at (without overburdening their partner)for the benefit of the home. However I definitely agree that both parties should be able to do the basics.

The key like you said is what works for every couple.

This still doesn't solve the problem!

I think roles should not olny be defined but also inter-changed! E.g you baby-sit this week, I cook . . . I cook next week you babysit . . .

That way everybody's happy and one doesn't take the other for granted. I mean what happens if both husband and wife are good cooks

Okay I'll give you an instance . . .

My hubby is a good cook, can make any meal as good as I can . . . We have a very active baby and it's actually easier to cook than to baby sit her!

It'll be unfair for me to pass her to my hubby everytime we get home from work using cooking as an excuse . . .

Long after dinner is over, she's still up and looking for someone to throw her up in the air! So we rotate . . . Today I cook, tommorow I babysit!

But then again, I think whatever works for each couple!

PS: Can I also add that he does that only on weekdays when we both come back from work. Most times on weekends I'm left alone to fend for myself!

debrief08:
My Sister nothing is a must oh between couples, each has a system that works for them. No one is right or wrong as long as they both agree

I don't agree with that..... some things are must either way you want to slice it , agree or whatever... it's a must.

Ujujoan:

Men are not 'lazy', they just dont think they should be the ones doing the chores. They think it's someone else' responsibility, like their wife . . . People like you arew the ones encouraging them!

What's wrong with a man cooking? But then again like you siad, that's you!

so u will like ur hubby cooking 4 u while u cross ur legs watching movies abi. Its like u want to marry a dummy husband. He can help if he chooses, but 2 cook 4 d home, na woman work be dat

jennykadry: A lot of them have changed I think. There was this guy that oved here from Nigerian. I remember the first time my husband met him , he still had that traditional mentality in him. Fast forward nearly two years later, this guy has become professional in house chores.

Some parents instill that traditional mentality in their male kids whilst some, like mine made sure the boys were good cooks and house cleaners before they left home

Lmfao, Jenny I have a story similar to that. About 6yrs ago, my older brother had this school mate, who had just arrived from Nigeria, over for a weekend visit. Throughout that weekend, the guy watched in shock as my brother did domestic chores. You could tell he wanted to slap my brother upside the head when he watch him deftly change his baby's diaper. . .with one hand. He all but called my brother a sissy and anyone who has met my brother knows he is anything but a sissy.

Sure he is very particular about what the temperature of the bottle is before feeding the baby, he can tell you off the top of his head how many diapers a day his baby uses on average, Yeah he can tell the difference between a teething ring and a pacifier or a onesie from an overall but that does not make him a sissy because as soon as he's done with that he is jumping on his bike (which his wife hates) to go meet his club members for whatever it is they do there and when he gets back home, he is rewiring the sound system all over the house because one time he heard a cracking sound when the music was playing and his weekends are spent playing or refereeing one football league or the other.

The nature of his job allows him to work from home, so it is not uncommon to come home and see him with a bluetooth his ears, his mini pad in his hand conducting a meeting while warming his children's meals. I swear the two days a month he has to travel to his office in NY for their monthly meeting his kids and wife miss him so much. . .you'll think he's been gone for months on end.

Anyway, his friend was all over the place telling people how the thug they knew in secondary has become something else oh. Ah, come and see him doing laundry and feeding baby. . .how he feels sorry for him and he can't believe my mom allowed her son's head to be "exchanged" blah blah blah.

Well in August, we all met at a party and guess who is seeking opinion on what kinda diaper rash cream works because the one he used previously seem to compound the issue. . . Mr. Macho Friend!!! He went on about how they wash their baby's clothes separately because he has found out the regular laundry detergent is too harsh for their baby's skin. He even went on to advice another dad to air dry baby clothes instead of using the dryer and then said proudly how his baby only used the size two diaper for like 3 weeks.

It was the funniest convo I had eavesdropped on in a long time. . .these were all men and see my brother feeling cool with himself because he is like the sage in the group. . .his kids (3) are all grown now. See him telling the other guys how girls are easier to potty train than guys blah blah. . .I swear you woulda thought they were discussing hedge funds or something.

What I have learnt is that it is not about the chores themselves, it is about how you see them. . .If you see domestic chores as chores for women alone, then doing it becomes a big deal but if you see domestic chores are just that. . .domestic chores and they need to be done, then it becomes a none issue.

The biggest misconception out there is that once men start doing these things, their wives will take advantage of them and start disrespecting them. That is funny to me because I can't count how many times my SIL pushes my brother out of the kitchen if he wants to start cooking or mircowave something to eat. She still has that old school mentality of setting table for her husband's food when dude is just okay eating over the kitchen sink (The fights they have over that ehn. . .Lol). The truth is women are generally easy to please. . .the best way to get away with not doing much is to show you are willing to do a lot (Please Cabal don't kill me for letting the secret out ).

Life can really be simple and hassle free. . .I don't understand why some like to complicate it with unnecessary turf wars.

Ujujoan:


Still didn't answer my question . . .

Okay to put it in another way . . . If you both stayed home all day, doing nothing, and someone had to go vacuum the house, who would it be

I did though. I said if it's microwaving, it could be either of us. It's somewhere there in my post.

On the vacuuming front, it is extremely rare for one of us to be doing something while the other is just lounging. So if she had to vacuum, I'd be doing something else (probably cleaning the toilet ) and if I had to vacuum, she'd be doing something else.

Ujujoan:
Good answer . . . make a great deal of sense, logically!

But then again the idea that you would quit your job if the tables were turned is easier said than done. Highly unlikely!

When you stayed home to take care of your lil girl, why do you think your wife 'thanked' you? It's because she thinks you are doing her a favour? She really shouldn't think that way cos it should be your responsibility as well as hers . . .

On the job front, we are both quite career minded, so it's highly unlikely either of us would quit a career to stay at home. It was a hypothetical question and therefore a hypothetical answer.

On my wife thanking me, I think the issue has now been reversed. The original issue was about men expecting to be thanked. That wasn't the case. My wife thinking I was doing her a favour is now from the woman's perspective of which I have little control. I know my wife though and I don't think she felt I was doing her a favour, she is just naturally quite expressive like that.

Ujujoan:
LMAO . .

Well from your post you appear to be, but I seriously doubt it!

OK ma! I take back my claim to being a new age guy. LOL!

Choi! My bad! I didn't realize how long it will be oh!

bjcole: so u will like ur hubby cooking 4 u while u cross ur legs watching movies abi. Its like u want to marry a dummy husband. He can help if he chooses, but 2 cook 4 d home, na woman work be dat

Thank you for bringing us down from the euphoric high we were all on thinking Naija guys are slowing become more aware.