deSika: oboye! see what i missed. just a few days away.

anyways i wud like to say thanks you all for your wonderful contributions. yes this includes the derailers, accusers and the off topics. thanks once again

but one thing i would love to confirm is this:
has any muslim being able to answer the op
as in show us where and how early muslims worshipped their God. how they engaged the 5 pillars of islam.

thanks once again. love you all

alexis:

Water and Atom are analogies for you to understand the God-Head, it appears you ignored the Atom and concentrated on the water. That is good enough for me because I don't expect you to BELIEVE it but you UNDERSTAND it. Christians believe in ONE GOD. The idea of Christians having 3 Gods is blasphemy.

There is one and only one living and true God. He is an intelligent, spiritual, and personal Being, the Creator, Redeemer, Preserver, and Ruler of the universe. God is infinite in holiness and all other perfections. God is all powerful and all knowing; and His perfect knowledge extends to all things, past, present, and future, including the future decisions of His free creatures. ... The eternal triune God reveals Himself to us as Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, with distinct personal attributes, but without division of nature, essence, or being.

I don't need to say more

alexis:

The god you serve doesn't know if he created the world in 2 days, 4 days or 6 days - As if God can't be consistent. The god you serve doesn't know who the first muslims was - if it was Mohammed, Moses, The 12 disciples of Jesus or Adam?

The God in the Bible and Allah are radically different. Allah was always nearby to approve whatever Mohammed wanted - when he wanted his adopted son wife's - "Gabriel" was standing by to send a "hot" revelation from "Allah" to approve it.

Allah cursed Jews and Christians - how can that be the same God in the Bible. Allah said Jesus spoke on the first day He was born - Which kind Jesus be that - not Jesus in the Bible. Clearly, Allah is seems to always change His mind whenever Mohammed wanted - Na wa for this Allah oh!

If you think Christians believe in 3 Gods - that is your problem. One can't educate an individual with consistent and constant indelible memory loss

alexis:

You should know, tell us!

LordElNou: you lie! "Abdul" means servant or slave

tintingz: Lolz... You dont have to repeat the questions you already know the answer, do you know that Jesus(as) cursed the jews adulterous generation and even called peter satan?

When Allah(swt) is talking to each prophet in the Quran, he will not forget to mention and reminding them of the prophets before them and their books to worship one God as they do before each of the prophets...

You have been served bro

Father

^

Son

^

Holyghost

^

Holy mother of god

Family circle!

deSika:
its agood thing that you saw the truths in my first points about not using bible examples as early muslims and my point on the hindu/budha and as such you could not say anything on them. atleast i am making some progress with you.


the christian translation of hebrew God to Allah is clearly misguided.
The arabs before Mohammed knew their Allah as one that had relations(daughters and sons) with other gods even though they gave him a higher status. he was one of their gods. what Muhammed did was to repackage Allah as monoeisthic and referring to the creator.He fought against the use of relating Allah the cheif god with other gods. Mohameds influence was far reaching and so Allah came to be known as the creator God. so that is wat it is now to all Arabs. so there is the original initial meaning and the present day meaning. But Muhammad did not completely eradicate the rituals associated with these idols.. He allowed for the circumbulation of the kabba, kissing of stone, pilgrimage etc as was used by the pagans to be used by his followers

let me say it like this.
there is a particular village that worships so many gods but they refer to one particular idol as the cheif of these gods. they call this cheif god Sango. In their dialect Sango means cheif god but this cheif god was the father of other gods who had diferent other roles such as fertility, war, success etc. This cheif gods particular role was protection of the village. With time, someone came to the village and started telling them of an almighty God(not a small god) remeber this village refers to Sango as almighty since he is the chief. as people began to accept this visitors God. they began to refer to this new God as Sango since to them Sango represents cheif. so now they call this new God cheif/Sango. as generation pass by Sango is now generally accepted as the Almighty God. they replaced the Sango(idol)whose primary role is protection with Sango (God).creator God

the igbos are a clear example to this. Initially Chi was an igbo god. when christianity came the igbos now refer to Almighty God as Chi. when they say Chi ukwu(chukwu) it means big God to diferntiate him from other chis/gods. They also say chi neke (God that creates) to refer to this particular God that creates. The former diety was never worshipped as a creator.. so you see Chi has not always being used to refer to a creator God but a diety who had its main function and never claimed to create. but now Chi is being used as to refer to God the creator.

its just a situation of change in representations.

so Allah changed from a chief god with relations to Al Uzat etc to a monotheist creator God. but even this new concept of Allah as used by Muhammed does not fit into what Elohim/Yahweh represents.
there are so many reasons why i say this. but i will just give a few
1. Elohim is refered as father but Allah as represented by quran does not beget
2. Allah contradicts many things Elohim said.
3.. Allah seemed to endorse lust to his prophet by allowing him marry several wives. a prophet is supposed to be more sober and restrictive than ordinary followers.
4. Allah's worshippers still engage in rituals engaged by pre islamic pagans.


so the arabs used to refer to a cheif god hubal as Al-ilah(the god). but now they refer to a creator God as Al-ilah(the god) due to influence of islam. but the deity being refered to as a creator God is not the same as the creator God that has being known before. it seems to me that some other diety is impersonating, using the creator God title to attack the real creator God that has being before.(this explains why this impersonator is almost totally against the creator God that has been before and his worshippers. this explains why this impersonator has taken the holy site of the creator God that has been before. this explains why this impersonator has commanded his followers to curse, bomb, subject to second class status by paying jizyah the worshipers of this God that has been before).

like i told you in the other thread. you and Mohamed are not in the right religion the religion as practised by Moses and Aaron. You are not doing so many things Moses and Aaron did. They washed themselves yes but they also used arks, alters, anointing oils, Bread, incense, burnt offerings in their worship and this you are not doing. It means you have missed it.

Allow me to direct you to the people who still follow Moses. Yeah the Jews. We will begin with their religous books. Then from then we can move on.

After all i have said. Pls dont stay back in a wrong religion. I know it may be difficult but its a worthy price to get the real deal..

CHEERS.
$&¤~ deSika .....gladly at your service

nagoma:

Thank you for you patience brother Ayenny02. But this fellow deSlika is not worth your time. He is not out to learn but to ridicule and enhance hatred. His religion of 3 gods cannot answer even one of similar questions. You are too good for him.

druid06: When it comes to religion, I have learned from other peoples experience to keep my mouth shut but this dude Desika has really enlightened my mind and filled some hole in my heart about Christianity and Islam. I already know Christianity started as a cult most of it's worships were derived from other religion like the sun god and others. I now know islam too was derived from idolatory so my question is, which religion is the true religion. Is there nothing like religion as it was made by man? Maybe there's no religion at all and our almight father just wants to keep a relationship with his as Moses, Abraham and Adam did.

me_for_you: Why do muslims always quote the Bible when preaching while christains don't quote Quran when they do

soft-touch:


My ideals came from relationship i got with people. I have Muslim friends, Christian friends, Hindu and few Chinesse.
I met people (Nigerian and non-Nigerians) that i can never trust, even with their Holy "books"in hand.

So, it is not what you say "you are", but what you do in action.

talk2me006:
READ LUKE 19:27 YOU WILL UNDERSTAND BETTER

mobi5592:
.
That's because they use the bible to validate the quran. Even though they deny the bible, it's supperiority over the quran is burried deep in their hearth.

mobi5592:
.
Well, if truth be said, the guy desika has been patient instructing, answering with love and above all willing to accept a mistake (something you muslims would never do)

Now he asked a simple question: did abraham and adam perform the 5 pillar ritual of islam? Non of you could answer him. Instead you rivert to branding names.

mobi5592:
.
While You sound plausible, and i commend your willingness to judge and rationalize, i beg you to at least throw in some research around these fact.
The apostles of christ were called christians because they were like christ. Christianity holds just one fundamental testimony - that's christ died for us, that he rose again and that through his death and resurection we are reconciled back to God. This is how we identify true christians.
While i agree with you that some pagan tradition crept into some churches, the true christian creed is still tot in many churches.
.
That's why we say: a bible believing church, not just any church. If jesus and the apostles warmed of these false teachings that are to come. But the truth is there for anyone who cares to seek the truth.
.
In your quest for greater, i'd like you to visit the site www.y-jesus.com. It could be the best thing that ever happened to you this year.
. Thanks and gudluck

lanrexlan: Brother,i have answered all your questions just go back and check the thread.Let me proof the 5pillars of islam from the bible
(1)Shahadah(oneness of God)-deuteronomy 6;4,mark 12;29.
(2)SOLAT(prayers)nehemiah 8;4-6,exodus 31;8,numbers 20;6,genesis 17;3,matthew 26;39,revelation 7;11.
(3)Zakat-mark 12;41
(4)Fasting-Jeremiah 36;9
(5)Hajj-isaiah 2;2,galatians 4;22-25
Feel free to read my posts about your questions....Peace brother.

lanrexlan: Then explain the concept of trinity? Just explain,I haven't find a christian to explain that to me.

maclatunji:

Anybody that died before Jesus is therefore condemned to hell with this submission. Hahaha!

Your submission is dead on delivery.

Thousands of people were crucified before the attempt to crucify Jesus (AS), it has no bearing on your salvation.

adeola555: My fellow muslims pls let's end dis topic.the non muslims will never learn. We hv quoted deir books 4 dem but dem no gree. Wat else do dey want. Na only boko haram be deir reference. The greatese terrorist of al time is the USA.. Pls we all should go and watch loose change. Just go 2 google nd type loose change den watch

lanrexlan: Then explain the concept of trinity? Just explain,I haven't find a christian to explain that to me.

maclatunji:

That is the best way to relate with you. 99% of you don't read the Qur'an even the likes of Desika.

It is fundamental for a Muslim to believe in Jesus' scripture which is not the Bible, it is called the Injeel. For Muslims, the Bible is a document that mixes fact with fiction. Where it contains fact, we point it out to you, where it contains fiction we sometimes also point out to you.

We definitely don't go to the Bible for religious rulings and edicts. If we did, there would not be Sharia law.

That 'superiority' of the Bible you speak of only exists in your imagination not in reality.

sakaguchi:
Ehm! Before you go and watch loose change, I asked a simple question earlier, how many warriors do moslem women get in paradise if their male counterparts get 72 virgins?

mobi5592:
.
Well, just to educate you, the bible said when he (christ) will come down in glory, those who have died before him will rise and they shall be judged according to their work while living. you can hit like if that answers your question

alexis:

Where is this Injel since the bible is not an authority?

mobi5592: just to help the muslims understand the trinity, i want you to pay attention to this:
.
We have just one matter, solid, liquid and gas. All existing as different form but just one matter.
.
We have one time, time past, time present and time in the future. One time, but different form of time.
Now let me ask you: how much do you think you know about the universe? Science with all its advancement has been able to uncover less than one percent of the physical universe - how much more spiritual matters?
because you dont understand a thing doesnt invalidate it.
If you did physics, you know the dual nature of light, existing as both wave nature and particle nature. even though its one light, but exhibiting two distinct nature. Just pointing these real life examples to show you that it is not impossible for God to exist in 3 form, only you dont understand it, but you can if you so wish.