Dear Alex, With reference to your thread on the following link I beg to differ:

https://www.nairaland.com/1373248/double-standard-displayed-past-lazarus
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First of all I will like to commend your efforts to point out errors in churches but appeal that we leave out bias & major focus on chosen alone.I agree that chosen has a number of things that are not in perfect order but I have strong objections on an all out branding chosen as from the devil.Here are my observations & please PATIENTLY read:-
-I am not aware of linda's 'first' revelation that was accepted & distributed by members of deeper life,Chosen & others.I need proof to agree that happened because I follow activities in these ministries & have no evidence of that.
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-This acclaimed second testimony of Linda ngaujah according to you claimed satan told pastor Lazarus to preach holiness all he wants but....!! How can satan support holiness preaching that has led to countless hardened criminals,fraudsters,prostitutes,native doctors,wicked men & women repenting with total surrender & zealously preaching & saving souls for Christ.
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-You seem to agree totally with this testimony of linda about the chosen while holding that Christ & the bible are your only guide.Why didn't you at least pray till CHRIST HIMSELF shows you the truth on this matter.
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-When you were also shown a testimony by one Sister Joy David that linda Ngaujah was directed by satan to present that revelation to pull down the chosen church which has been massively disturbing & depopulating satans kingdom you immediately gave it your own interpretation that Pastor Lazarus directed Joy David to give that testimony as a cover up to his hidden agenda.Where you there when that happened or did Christ tell you this?
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-It is a fact that it is hard to find any church on earth today that has the volume of revelations recorded or witnessed in the chosen confirming that the church & the pastor is of God.Countless people have testified in the past & in the present that Jesus appeared to them & told them to go to the the chosen & countless people from other churches have testified that they prayed or fasted to find out about chosen & christ appeared & told them & showed them that He called the pastor & that the pastor is His faithful searvant & He established the chosen.There's the remarkable one about pastors that gathered in the east with prayer & fasting to pull down the chosen but God told them that He is behind the chosen.How then can we throw away all these multitude of testimonies & believe only the one presented by Linda ngaujah against the chosen as true even when a former agent of satan Joy David has declared that she was there when satan & many demons commissioned linda ngaujah to go & present a false revelation from christ against churches & specially to pull down the chosen.
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- It is also a fact that chosen is a combination of members of watchman,MFM,Deeper life & many other churches that left for chosen after recieving one revelation or the other confirming the call of God on the chosen.How can all these people from these strong churches be wrong & only linda alone is to be believed.
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-Besides the chosen has recorded a lot of churches with branch networks both within & outside Nigeria coming to hand over their entire church & branch networks to the chosen after revelations from God & deliberations with church elders.I was a live witness of two white pastors that came from pakistan to hand over their church to chosen & a ghananian pastor & representatives that did the same.How can all these people be wrong & linda alone is right.
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-It is also a known fact & can be cofirmed that its hard to find a pastor that CONSISTENTLY & openly binds satan,lucifer,queen of the coast,queen of heaven,belzeebub & diverse demons taking dilligent care & time in hours to call them each by name.. Commanding fire & jugdment,destruction & the blood of Jesus upon them & their entire kingdoms with instant results of counless number of longtime insanities,madness,demonic possessions being delivered,stubborn terminal sicknesses being cured & satan agents confessing & repenting with evangelical zeal & fervency.It is forbidden for anybody operating under satans power to vocally & openly bind or curse satan.It carries strong life terminating retribution.Ask if you don't know & check past known demonic pastors or ministers.
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-In this thread many have claimed that the Lord's Chosen worship aprons & their pastor but the much I know is that I have never seen a chosen member worshipping apron whether in their houses or in the church or teaching such.The apron is a means of advertising their numerous church crusades.That claim is totally false.Besides every man of God that was mightily used of God since church history till now is greatly revered by his congregation members to the point of deifying & glorifying them.God perhaps allows this to see if that man of God will be puffed up and take the glory that belongs to God.But in chosen pastor Lazarus is overtly conscious & sensitive to this so much that he has suddenly appeared countless times on the pulpit to seriously caution people to give all the glory to God & not him.His slogan ever remains that "God cannot share his glory with any man".Infact at a point he mentioned he shouldn't even be called a pastor but rather a brother in christ.
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-As for me, if the Lord's chosen is not from God,then its easy to agree that the Deeper life,Watchman & other holiness preaching churches are not from God according to popular claims of critics & if they all are not from God then which church again is from God.Is it these new generation charlatans that are parading the liberal gospel of "live anyhow you like"?.
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I agree with every campaign to expose errors in churches but not when its appears to be full of bias.By the above volumes I've written, I do not persuade you to believe that Pastor Lazarus or the chosen is called of God but rather I beg you to set aside whatever linda Ngauja or even Joy David has said & cast away strong personal bias & pray & if possible fast & let Christ Jesus himself reveal to you his stand on the chosen.Also you can choose to pray that prayer some have dared to pray while in doubt i.e. if chosen is not from God let it fall & viseversa.If the chosen be not of God then it is the greatest deception & hoax in the history of mankind.
STAY BLESSED.

Good arguments, can you comment on the issue of god of chosen, god of my pastor, baba ijesha etc like some mentioned earlier, is it true members of the church pray in these names?

@OP,
thanks for your response. What I am condemning is the practices in Lord's Chosen and am not saying its not good to preach holiness. I am also not carried away by casting and binding of demons and stuff because even false prophets do same. Remember the scripture that says that on the last day some people will tell our lord Jesus that they have cast out demon and did mighty works in his name but he will tell them to depart. It is not works that confirms the genuineness of a man of God. Moreover somebody can start well and derail along the line so if your pastor started well, thank God, but that doesnt make him permanently on the right track. Sometime ago in a thread about Lord's Chosen i condemned the same thing am condemning now. It is not because of Linda(her testimony wasnt out as at then), however I am saying that the manner in which Lord's chosen reacted to that testimony shows that what Linda said may not be wrong.
I still dont agree that the zeal with which your members call on your god of chosen is normal.
I still dont agree that the zeal with which your members call on god of my pastor's power is normal.
I still dont agree that the zeal with which your members wear your apron is normal. Worshiping an apron is not only when you bow down before it and pray. When you make use of it as if your whole life depends on it you are worshiping it. When you go everywhere with it as if without it you can do nothing you are also worshiping it. Jesus told us that without him(not apron) we can do nothing.
Let me tell you my brother, true holiness preaching pastors dont allow their members to do anything that will portray them as being worshiped. They discourage such things.
True holiness preachers never allow anything that will share the place of Jesus in the lives of their members such as the god of my pastor's stuff.
For true holiness preachers, every attention MUST focus on Jesus and anything that seeks to exalt them they reject it totally.
For them, Jesus must increase while they decrease.
But when we begin to see the manifestations of the flesh such as the god of my pastor's power thing(you say it in your prayers and sing it in your song to my hearing), My pastor did this, my pastor did that. god of chosen stuff and every praise you give to God becomes routed through your pastor and your pastor keeps quiet and enjoys these things then there is problem. This has always been the problem of one man churches. They are run like a political camp where the leader must be praised every now and then for all the achievement of the party. Every attention must be on the party leader. We have not learned so of Christ.
Why we are discussing these things is for those of us here go back and educate our brethren rightly concerning some of these unnecessary practices which they are even doing out of ignorance. not to kill the church and we are not advocating that people should leave their churches. I ve always rejected practices that are not good in my church. there are some that frosbel pointed out here too and i saw reasons with what he said and started orientating our members. I ve learnt somethings from goshen360(concerning grace), from annony and davidylan(especially their testimonies which was given in a thread sometime), from you, from Olaadaegbu and others. What am saying is that you should keep a free mind and pick things here that are right and orientate your brethren. We are all preparing for heaven so vital info that will help us in our preparations must not be discarded. I dont advocate that people should leave their churches. if we all keep leaving our churches when we receive some exposures then who will help our brethren who are not opportune to be here and get the exposure?

I still dont agree that it was God that tormented those of your members who said they were beginning to run mad when they threw away your apron and other materials. This cannot be from God my brother.
I understand how it feels to hear our church practices being criticized but we also cant keep quiet and allow our brethren wallow in ignorance. No church is perfect and no human being is perfect too. We keep learning. God bless you my dear.

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superior1: Good arguments, can you comment on the issue of god of chosen, god of my pastor, baba ijesha etc like some mentioned earlier, is it true members of the church pray in these names?

To my knowledge,the chosen pray only in the name of Jesus Christ the living son of God.It is true that the members of the chosen by the reason of the unprecedented & dumbfounding salvation testimonies,miracles,revelations,revivals in the chosen are fully persuaded that the God & Father of our Lord Jesus Christ is the God working in the chosen.So they choose to call him the God of the Chosen & I don't see any harm in that though many people condemn it.In deeper life some say the God of Kumuyi,in winners the God of oyedepo.Same with many other churches.But all prayers in the chosen is done in the name of Jesus.Every true christian in prayer & praising God has named God so many wonderful names including the God of Abraham,Isaac & Jacob.I was there during a testimony when a ritualist tagged a chosen member "omo baba Ijesha" before releasing the chosen member.Since then the baba Ijesha name has been making rounds.But Pastor Lazarus stood up abruptly one time & told members that God alone is the baba Ijesha.My brother critics will use irrelevant things to try to run down a ministry.

we should all becarefull hw we talk especially when it comes to men of God,judge not so u wont be judged @ most pray for them moreover a kingdom divded against itself cant stand.watch and pray so u dont fall into temptation of speaking against Lords annointed,again i say watch for our adversary is roaring like a hungry lion will u let him devour u brother,will u let him devour u sister.we dont have all d time,if i may ask hw many souls have u won over to Gods kingdom.behold i come quickly and my reward with me to give evryone according to his deed,come Lord Jesus

What really is baffling is why should sound grounded Holy Ghost filled Christians be depending on this former prostitute from sierra leone testimonies about hell rather than believing the Bible which is the final authority on such matters.We Christians have resorted to believing mystical experiences which are demonic doctrines from hell rather than the Word.It's really pathetic sha..

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alexleo: @OP,
thanks for your response. What I am condemning is the practices in Lord's Chosen and am not saying its not good to preach holiness. I am also not carried away by casting and binding of demons and stuff because even false prophets do same.............

Alex, believe me I totally agree with you on condemning & correcting unwholesome practices in churches including chosen but go back to that thread you created & read it all over again & read the replies that follow & you realise that thread wasn't seeking to correct.I summarise it as a thread that held what Linda Ngaujah said as supreme & pastor Lazarus summarily labelled an agent of satan that covenanted with a so called demon called the god of the chosen.On the issue of members hailing the pastor & other issues u just mentioned, I fully addressed them in the OP when I mentioned that pastor Lazarus till tomorow consistently warns that nobody should glorify him as God is the maker of the miracles.I agree there are flaws in the church & that a pastor that started well could derail but that should not amount to trying to portray Pastor Lazarus as an agent of satan based on Linda's testimony alone & neglecting hard evidences as I presented in the OP.Besides we both know that chosen is a youngest among all the mega churches presently & many of these other mega churches than have been there also have even more serious errors.Even though they are advanced, they're still learning but chosen that is just a toddler must be destroyed before they dare to start? What do you say about anointing oils in churches as if peoples lives depend on it.What of the beating of drums as if church can't do without it.What of sensual Makosa & reggae dances & songs in mega churches that long existed before chosen.What of holy kisses,& hugs & valentines.What of birthday parties with loud sensual worldly music & alcohol drinking in churches,what of church member coming half naked,micro mini skirts,"show me your brea'st & pan'ties" wears to churches.I could continue on & on and you'll see such stuffs you either won't see in chosen or seem to make what we yell as errors in chosen seem insignificant even though they are also errors themselves.

bizmahn:
To my knowledge,the chosen pray only in the name of Jesus Christ the living son of God.It is true that the members of the chosen by the reason of the unprecedented & dumbfounding salvation testimonies,miracles,revelations,revivals in the chosen are fully persuaded that the God & Father of our Lord Jesus Christ is the God working in the chosen.[b]So they choose to call him the God of the Chosen & I don't see any harm in that though many people condemn it.In deeper life some say the God of Kumuyi,in winners the God of oyedepo.Same with many other churches.But all prayers in the chosen is done in the name of Jesus.Every true christian in prayer & praising God has named God so many wonderful names including the God of Abraham,Isaac & Jacob.[/b]I was there during a testimony when a ritualist tagged a chosen member "omo baba Ijesha" before releasing the chosen member.Since then the baba Ijesha name has been making rounds.But Pastor Lazarus stood up abruptly one time & told members that God alone is the baba Ijesha.My brother critics will use irrelevant things to try to run down a ministry.

It is true i use God of Abraham, Isaac etc in my worship (those names are revealed in the bible) but i only pray in Jesus Name. I have problem with folks praying in the name of the god of my pastor, the name of baba ijesha, god of chosen, god of adeboye, there is none of these names in the Bible referring to God. If folks will strictly without waivering stay only with the bible, Christianity will have no problem with heresy.

Some of the possible excesses in the chosen is largely due to overexitment & overzealouness by a young church that witnessed unprecedented move of God as of old & as at its fourth year they have become the fastest growing church worldwide with branches all over the world & many churches handing over their churches to chosen.
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If you study history of church revivals you discover than when people encounter unusual move of God they overreact many times from exitment.Kumuyi had to do a lot to correct members at the height of deeper life revival fire still ablaze in the 80's & 90's.
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My point of this thread is to try to correct the impression that because a young church is getting overexcited doesn't mean the allegation that the pastor is a satanic agent that covenanted with satan is correct.Yet I agree fully that the chosen has a lot of clean up to do.

bizmahn:
Alex, believe me I totally agree with you on condemning & correcting unwholesome practices in churches including chosen but go back to that thread you created & read it all over again & read the replies that follow & you realise that thread wasn't seeking to correct.I summarise it as a thread that held what Linda Ngaujah said as supreme & pastor Lazarus summarily labelled an agent of satan that covenanted with a so called demon called the god of the chosen.On the issue of members hailing the pastor & other issues u just mentioned, I fully addressed them in the OP when I mentioned that pastor Lazarus till tomorow consistently warns that nobody should glorify him as God is the maker of the miracles.I agree there are flaws in the church & that a pastor that started well could derail but that should not amount to trying to portray Pastor Lazarus as an agent of satan based on Linda's testimony alone & neglecting hard evidences as I presented in the OP.Besides we both know that chosen is a youngest among all the mega churches presently & many of these other mega churches than have been there also have even more serious errors.Even though they are advanced, they're still learning but chosen that is just a toddler must be destroyed before they dare to start? What do you say about anointing oils in churches as if peoples lives depend on it.What of the beating of drums as if church can't do without it.What of sensual Makosa & reggae dances & songs in mega churches that long existed before chosen.What of holy kisses,& hugs & valentines.What of birthday parties with loud sensual worldly music & alcohol drinking in churches,what of church member coming half naked,micro mini skirts,"show me your brea'st & pan'ties" wears to churches.I could continue on & on and you'll see such stuffs you either won't see in chosen or seem to make what we yell as errors in chosen seem insignificant even though they are also errors themselves.

Ok bros am sorry where i offended you in my presentations about chosen. But i still stand against those ugly practices and traditions i mentioned. You have a responsibility to educate your members on the need to drop all those things and focus on Jesus. Go through the new testament books the apostles focused on Jesus Christ and truly our heavenly race and christianity is all about Jesus. You can start from educating a few youths, when they are convinced they keep educating others and by so doing it spreads. Make the discussion informal and very friendly. Dont present it as if you are attacking the church. if you do it that way they will see you as an enemy of progress and you lose the mission. God bless you.

alexleo:

Ok bros am sorry where i offended you in my presentations about chosen. But i still stand against those ugly practices and traditions i mentioned. You have a responsibility to educate your members on the need to drop all those things and focus on Jesus. Go through the new testament books the apostles focused on Jesus Christ and truly our heavenly race and christianity is all about Jesus. You can start from educating a few youths, when they are convinced they keep educating others and by so doing it spreads. Make the discussion informal and very friendly. Dont present it as if you are attacking the church. if you do it that way they will see you as an enemy of progress and you lose the mission. God bless you.

bizmahn: Some of the possible excesses in the chosen is largely due to overexitment & overzealouness by a young church that witnessed unprecedented move of God as of old & as at its fourth year they have become the fastest growing church worldwide with branches all over the world & many churches handing over their churches to chosen.
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If you study history of church revivals you discover than when people encounter unusual move of God they overreact many times from exitment.Kumuyi had to do a lot to correct members at the height of deeper life revival fire still ablaze in the 80's & 90's.
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My point of this thread is to try to correct the impression that because a young church is getting overexcited doesn't mean the allegation that the pastor is a satanic agent that covenanted with satan is correct.Yet I agree fully that the chosen has a lot of clean up to do.

I think this settles the matter with me for now. We should let them know the name that chases satan, break bondage, destroy shackles is JESUS, no addition or afikun ( eg god of chosen, god of baba ijesha, god of my pastor). Beyond this, Chosen members should know they are not the only one going to heaven and should stop attacking other denominations they perceived 'unholy' compared to them as long as they preach the bible only. I will be taking a close look at this ministry henceforth

superior1:



I think this settles the matter with me for now. We should let them know the name that chases satan, break bondage, destroy shackles is JESUS, no addition or afikun ( eg god of chosen, god of baba ijesha, god of my pastor). Beyond this, Chosen members should know they are not the only one going to heaven and should stop attacking other denominations they perceived 'unholy' compared to them as long as they preach the bible only. I will be taking a close look at this ministry henceforth

Thanks dear. you cant imagine the stage they ve gone with their practice. A secondary School teacher close to me once told me how a student in her class finished writing her papers and came under the answer script and wrote- I AM A CHOSEN, WHO ARE YOU?

The teacher was so angry and even wanted to throw away the script but i advised she should rather call the student and warn her. This is not good at all.
Same statement that they claim they ask robbers and they run away? So is it for the teacher to mark them right where they are wrong or what? And if the teacher had thrown away the script in that anger would that have also been a miracle?

alexleo:

Ok bros am sorry where i offended you in my presentations about chosen. But i still stand against those ugly practices and traditions i mentioned...........God bless you.

You didn't offend me as you already know.I am not fighting for "church".I'm fighting for millions of former hardened sinners in that church that maybe couldn't have been converted any other place.Satan is fighting the chosen with a lot of malicious propaganda that can make these souls go back to their vomit.
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The truth is that Pastor Lazarus needs real wisdom & grace to manage the excesses in his church.Sometimes you can literally see the deep difficulty he's undergoing trying to figure out how to control the church.I heard he was crying & rolling on the floor at one time in the past just to show he's nothing.Remember he is not a university material like kumuyi,Adeboye or Olukoya that are well read,fully acquainted with church history,church mgt & first class holders.
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At the beginning of the chosen ministry pastor Lazarus english was so very poor but he had uncommon favour & anointing of God.Till present a lot of chosen pastors are so poor in english let alone in critical reasoning & comprehension of church dynamics & church history.The Lord himself is tutoring them.
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Personally, my church is whichever gathering people preach & are making serious efforts towards"sinless righteousness" & to make heaven ."Be ye holy as I am holy "is the totality of the bible.We are called to be like God who is sinless in totality.

alexleo:

Thanks dear. you cant imagine the stage they ve gone with their practice. A secondary School teacher close to me once told me how a student in her class finished writing her papers and came under the answer script and wrote- I AM A CHOSEN, WHO ARE YOU?

The teacher was so angry and even wanted to throw away the script but i advised she should rather call the student and warn her. This is not good at all.
Same statement that they claim they ask robbers and they run away? So is it for the teacher to mark them right where they are wrong or what? And if the teacher had thrown away the script in that anger would that have also been a miracle?

Can you imagine that?, that lady is poorly thought the word of God. A possible tragedy is if the teacher had thrown out her scripts and she stops believing in God altogether metamorphosing into another Logic boy (girl 3). Christian teachings should be balance and devoid of human ideas.

2 Timothy 2:15
New International Version
Do your best to present yourself to God as one approved, a worker who does not need to be ashamed and who correctly handles the word of truth

bizmahn:

You didn't offend me as you already know.I am not fighting for "church".I'm fighting for millions of former hardened sinners in that church that maybe couldn't have been converted any other place.Satan is fighting the chosen with a lot of malicious propaganda that can make these souls go back to their vomit.
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The truth is that Pastor Lazarus needs real wisdom & grace to manage the excesses in his church.Sometimes you can literally see the deep difficulty he's undergoing trying to figure out how to control the church.I heard he was crying & rolling on the floor at one time in the past just to show he's nothing.Remember he is not a university material like kumuyi,Adeboye or Olukoya that are well read,fully acquainted with church history,church mgt & first class holders.
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At the beginning of the chosen ministry pastor Lazarus english was so very poor but he had uncommon favour & anointing of God.Till present a lot of chosen pastors are so poor in english let alone in critical reasoning & comprehension of church dynamics & church history.The Lord himself is tutoring them.
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Personally, my church is whichever gathering people preach & are making serious efforts towards"sinless righteousness" & to make heaven ."Be ye holy as I am holy "is the totality of the bible.We are called to be like God who is sinless in totality.

Ok dear. Your points are noted and really calls for prayers for them that God should perfect there ways until the day of the glorious appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ. That we all may be counted worthy of him. Amen.

superior1:

Can you imagine that?, that lady is poorly thought the word of God. A possible tragedy is if the teacher had thrown out her scripts and she stops believing in God altogether metamorphosing into another Logic boy (girl 3). Christian teachings should be balance and devoid of human ideas.

2 Timothy 2:15
New International Version
Do your best to present yourself to God as one approved, a worker who does not need to be ashamed and who correctly handles the word of truth

We ll be remembering them in our prayers. Remain blessed.

@ all, I want to also councel that we all take time to read past revivals & divine visitations in nations & churches in the past e.g the indonesian revival,the full gospel revival,the evan roberts revival,the book 'God's generals' etc.You'll discover certain peculiarities in the workings of God in each of those visitations.
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Due to limited understanding of the things of God in those periods,you discover God at times uses methods that you can't call SIN to still visit those people."I am a chosen" is not literarily found in the bible but I can't ultimately call it SIN.There are things christ called the "weightier matters" in the bible.These are things that have to do with righteousness or outright wilful sin againt God.
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I will also remind you all that no believer repented with perfect knowledge of the things of God from day one including we all on this forum.Example is Alex that is fund of "everybody forgive me" in diverse thread on this forum (lol) because he made mistakes & he's still learning like we all even though we may be up to 20 or 30 years in christ plus all the academic exposure.
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What then do you expect when people are new in christ,can hardly read the english bible & rely solely on the little they grasp & yet are making better effort at living right within & without than so many that have been there? Yes they have mistakes but sincerely they are making efforts too.We can't identify their errors at the total neglect of their efforts.

bizmahn: @ all, I want to also councel that we all take time to read past revivals & divine visitations in nations & churches in the past e.g the indonesian revival,the full gospel revival,the evan roberts revival,the book 'God's generals' etc.You'll discover certain peculiarities in the workings of God in each of those visitations.
-
Due to limited understanding of the things of God in those periods,you discover God at times uses methods that you can't call SIN to still visit those people."I am a chosen" is not literarily found in the bible but I can't ultimately call it SIN.There are things christ called the "weightier matters" in the bible.These are things that have to do with righteousness or outright wilful sin againt God.
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I will also remind you all that no believer repented with perfect knowledge of the things of God from day one including we all on this forum.Example is Alex that is fund of "everybody forgive me" in diverse thread on this forum (lol) because he made mistakes & he's still learning like we all even though we may be up to 20 or 30 years in christ plus all the academic exposure.
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What then do you expect when people are new in christ,can hardly read the english bible & rely solely on the little they grasp & yet are making better effort at living right within & without than so many that have been there? Yes they have mistakes but sincerely they are making efforts too.We can't identify their errors at the total neglect of their efforts.

I ve always said that nobody is perfect. The problem with chosen people is that they don't even accept that they have a fault. @Peteregwu in the other thread never accepted any fault about chosen and that's very bad. That's what makes people appear as if they are caged by whatever.

See how true men of God react when people try to idolize them. 1 corinthians 1:12-13.

12 What I mean is this: One of you says, “I follow Paul”; another, “I follow Apollos”; another, “I follow Cephas[b]”; still another, “I follow Christ.”

13 Is Christ divided? Was Paul crucified for you? Were you baptized in the name of Paul?

Again 1 corinthians 3:4-7,21-23.

4 For when one says, “I follow Paul,” and another, “I follow Apollos,” are you not mere human beings?

5 What, after all, is Apollos? And what is Paul? Only servants, through whom you came to believe—as the Lord has assigned to each his task. 6 I planted the seed, Apollos watered it, but God has been making it grow. 7 So neither the one who plants nor the one who waters is anything, but only God, who makes things grow.
21 So then, no more boasting about human leaders! All things are yours, 22 whether Paul or Apollos or Cephas[c] or the world or life or death or the present or the future—all are yours, 23 and you are of Christ, and Christ is of God

But today, pastors enjoy being idolized under whatever guise. This not what it should be. God help us.

bizmahn: @ all, I want to also councel that we all take time to read past revivals & divine visitations in nations & churches in the past e.g the indonesian revival,the full gospel revival,the evan roberts revival,the book 'God's generals' etc.You'll discover certain peculiarities in the workings of God in each of those visitations.
-
Due to limited understanding of the things of God in those periods,you discover God at times uses methods that you can't call SIN to still visit those people."I am a chosen" is not literarily found in the bible but I can't ultimately call it SIN.There are things christ called the "weightier matters" in the bible.These are things that have to do with righteousness or outright wilful sin againt God.
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I will also remind you all that no believer repented with perfect knowledge of the things of God from day one including we all on this forum.Example is Alex that is fund of "everybody forgive me" in diverse thread on this forum (lol) because he made mistakes & he's still learning like we all even though we may be up to 20 or 30 years in christ plus all the academic exposure.
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What then do you expect when people are new in christ,can hardly read the english bible & rely solely on the little they grasp & yet are making better effort at living right within & without than so many that have been there? Yes they have mistakes but sincerely they are making efforts too.We can't identify their errors at the total neglect of their efforts.

Another good argument but then the onus lies on the Pastor of the ministry to do the needful and put internal mechanism in place to correct any misapplication of his teaching.

alexleo:

I ve always said that nobody is perfect. The problem with chosen people is that they don't even accept that they have a fault. @Peteregwu in the other thread never accepted any fault about chosen and that's very bad. That's what makes people appear as if they are caged by whatever.

hmmm...actually I didn't want to join in this room but because you mentioned my name, I decided to tip in this. When people become jealous and envious of a ministry and a man of God, believe me that is when they will start looking for a fault in the church an in the life of that man of God. this is just the fact! if you like agree or not.

Believe me if you are far from chosen, you will neve know the truth about the chosen or the pastor. the point is Satan is using so many people most especially the so called Christians to work against the chosen and the pastor so that we will become cold and lukewarm like others, but never it won't happened. Many are ashamed to preach the raw message of GOD in the buses an on the streets today, hut when they see chosen doing it, they become angry and start looking for fault. My friend let us alone and allow God to keep pushing us forward. You think God dore not know about the Apron or the use of the name "I am a chosen" or "God of my pastor" or even "God of chosen." "But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light: [10] Which in time past were not a people, but are now the people of God: which had not obtained mercy, but now have obtained mercy." 1 Peter 2:9-10 KJV.

they say God of chosen is not in the bible. God is the God of the chosen ones.

if the names does not work, why then do the arm robbers, ritualist, or one chance people and occultic men tremble at the name. it is a prove that the name is highly consecrated by God. if you mention the name of your church in time of danger, maybe before ritualistic or arm robbers, believe me they will deal with you. I don't pray that happems to you any way. but if it does, please say, "I am a chosen" then you will realise what makes chosen people zealous and crazy for Jesus.

let me you tell friend, you do not understand the spiritual, you just a baby for now or even like somebody that is yet to be a Christian. you read the bible or believe the bible as if it is a novel or fiction, you don't understand the works of God or how He works. the ways of God is too deep and you never fathom everything about God no matter how old you are in Christianity.

your words in every tread against the chosen and the pastor is enough to discourage sinners from coming to chosen. well, what I believe is that, one day just like my pastor used to say, "the greatest exodus is coming, God of chosen will empty so many churches that are not standing into the chosen to be saved."

bizmahn: Dear Alex, With reference to your thread on the following link I beg to differ:

https://www.nairaland.com/1373248/double-standard-displayed-past-lazarus
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First of all I will like to commend your efforts to point out errors in churches but appeal that we leave out bias & major focus on chosen alone.I agree that chosen has a number of things that are not in perfect order but I have strong objections on an all out branding chosen as from the devil.Here are my observations & please PATIENTLY read:-
-I am not aware of linda's 'first' revelation that was accepted & distributed by members of deeper life,Chosen & others.I need proof to agree that happened because I follow activities in these ministries & have no evidence of that.
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-This acclaimed second testimony of Linda ngaujah according to you claimed satan told pastor Lazarus to preach holiness all he wants but....!! How can satan support holiness preaching that has led to countless hardened criminals,fraudsters,prostitutes,native doctors,wicked men & women repenting with total surrender & zealously preaching & saving souls for Christ.
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-You seem to agree totally with this testimony of linda about the chosen while holding that Christ & the bible are your only guide.Why didn't you at least pray till CHRIST HIMSELF shows you the truth on this matter.
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-When you were also shown a testimony by one Sister Joy David that linda Ngaujah was directed by satan to present that revelation to pull down the chosen church which has been massively disturbing & depopulating satans kingdom you immediately gave it your own interpretation that Pastor Lazarus directed Joy David to give that testimony as a cover up to his hidden agenda.Where you there when that happened or did Christ tell you this?
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-It is a fact that it is hard to find any church on earth today that has the volume of revelations recorded or witnessed in the chosen confirming that the church & the pastor is of God.Countless people have testified in the past & in the present that Jesus appeared to them & told them to go to the the chosen & countless people from other churches have testified that they prayed or fasted to find out about chosen & christ appeared & told them & showed them that He called the pastor & that the pastor is His faithful searvant & He established the chosen.There's the remarkable one about pastors that gathered in the east with prayer & fasting to pull down the chosen but God told them that He is behind the chosen.How then can we throw away all these multitude of testimonies & believe only the one presented by Linda ngaujah against the chosen as true even when a former agent of satan Joy David has declared that she was there when satan & many demons commissioned linda ngaujah to go & present a false revelation from christ against churches & specially to pull down the chosen.
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- It is also a fact that chosen is a combination of members of watchman,MFM,Deeper life & many other churches that left for chosen after recieving one revelation or the other confirming the call of God on the chosen.How can all these people from these strong churches be wrong & only linda alone is to be believed.
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-Besides the chosen has recorded a lot of churches with branch networks both within & outside Nigeria coming to hand over their entire church & branch networks to the chosen after revelations from God & deliberations with church elders.I was a live witness of two white pastors that came from pakistan to hand over their church to chosen & a ghananian pastor & representatives that did the same.How can all these people be wrong & linda alone is right.
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-It is also a known fact & can be cofirmed that its hard to find a pastor that CONSISTENTLY & openly binds satan,lucifer,queen of the coast,queen of heaven,belzeebub & diverse demons taking dilligent care & time in hours to call them each by name.. Commanding fire & jugdment,destruction & the blood of Jesus upon them & their entire kingdoms with instant results of counless number of longtime insanities,madness,demonic possessions being delivered,stubborn terminal sicknesses being cured & satan agents confessing & repenting with evangelical zeal & fervency.It is forbidden for anybody operating under satans power to vocally & openly bind or curse satan.It carries strong life terminating retribution.Ask if you don't know & check past known demonic pastors or ministers.
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-In this thread many have claimed that the Lord's Chosen worship aprons & their pastor but the much I know is that I have never seen a chosen member worshipping apron whether in their houses or in the church or teaching such.The apron is a means of advertising their numerous church crusades.That claim is totally false.Besides every man of God that was mightily used of God since church history till now is greatly revered by his congregation members to the point of deifying & glorifying them.God perhaps allows this to see if that man of God will be puffed up and take the glory that belongs to God.But in chosen pastor Lazarus is overtly conscious & sensitive to this so much that he has suddenly appeared countless times on the pulpit to seriously caution people to give all the glory to God & not him.His slogan ever remains that "God cannot share his glory with any man".Infact at a point he mentioned he shouldn't even be called a pastor but rather a brother in christ.
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-As for me, if the Lord's chosen is not from God,then its easy to agree that the Deeper life,Watchman & other holiness preaching churches are not from God according to popular claims of critics & if they all are not from God then which church again is from God.Is it these new generation charlatans that are parading the liberal gospel of "live anyhow you like"?.
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I agree with every campaign to expose errors in churches but not when its appears to be full of bias.By the above volumes I've written, I do not persuade you to believe that Pastor Lazarus or the chosen is called of God but rather I beg you to set aside whatever linda Ngauja or even Joy David has said & cast away strong personal bias & pray & if possible fast & let Christ Jesus himself reveal to you his stand on the chosen.Also you can choose to pray that prayer some have dared to pray while in doubt i.e. if chosen is not from God let it fall & viseversa.If the chosen be not of God then it is the greatest deception & hoax in the history of mankind.
STAY BLESSED.

well, u tried speaking well. God bless u. although you are not a member, you have a true discerning Spirit of God. Linda is an agent of darkness, her confsession is backed by the powers of darkness. any church or person that patronize her mestage is bound by the ppower of darkness, their is a spell on it. if they like let them believe or not.

people don't lov to here the glorious testimonies of what God is doing in chosen, what they want to here is fault about chosen, but unfortunately their is no fault.

2 Thessalonians 2:11-12 KJV
"And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: [12] That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness."

peteregwu:

hmmm...actually I didn't want to join in this room but because you mentioned my name, I decided to tip in this. When people become jealous and envious of a ministry and a man of God, believe me that is when they will start looking for a fault in the church an in the life of that man of God. this is just the fact! if you like agree or not.

Believe me if you are far from chosen, you will neve know the truth about the chosen or the pastor. the point is Satan is using so many people most especially the so called Christians to work against the chosen and the pastor so that we will become cold and lukewarm like others, but never it won't happened. Many are ashamed to preach the raw message of GOD in the buses an on the streets today, hut when they see chosen doing it, they become angry and start looking for fault. My friend let us alone and allow God to keep pushing us forward. You think God dore not know about the Apron or the use of the name "I am a chosen" or "God of my pastor" or even "God of chosen." "But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light: [10] Which in time past were not a people, but are now the people of God: which had not obtained mercy, but now have obtained mercy." 1 Peter 2:9-10 KJV.

they say God of chosen is not in the bible. God is the God of the chosen ones.

if the names does not work, why then do the arm robbers, ritualist, or one chance people and occultic men tremble at the name. it is a prove that the name is highly consecrated by God. if you mention the name of your church in time of danger, maybe before ritualistic or arm robbers, believe me they will deal with you. I don't pray that happems to you any way. but if it does, please say, "I am a chosen" then you will realise what makes chosen people zealous and crazy for Jesus.

let me you tell friend, you do not understand the spiritual, you just a baby for now or even like somebody that is yet to be a Christian. you read the bible or believe the bible as if it is a novel or fiction, you don't understand the works of God or how He works. the ways of God is too deep and you never fathom everything about God no matter how old you are in Christianity.

your words in every tread against the chosen and the pastor is enough to discourage sinners from coming to chosen. well, what I believe is that, one day just like my pastor used to say, "the greatest exodus is coming, God of chosen will empty so many churches that are not standing into the chosen to be saved."

You have once again represented your shallow background of white garment church in your post. God cannot support ugly practices no matter how you twist the bible to support it. Again I have no reason to jealous any church. Am not into church business so nothing concerns me. I ve also no need to call the name of my church when I see danger. I will only call the name of Jesus.

One day I was going along my street to buy something in a supermarket, the owner of that supermarket started chatting about the Lords Chosen. they know me very well to be a chosen in my area. he told me that He loves my church and my pastor, but that their is one thing he does not like about my pastor. I asked him what? I thought he would say something about the apron, but he said pastor is a politician. I was surprised. he said that pastor is not preaching to the politicians. I told him the purpose of Christ death is not for politicians alone but all. that the preaching of the pastor is to save sinners(politicians included). I also told him testimonies of how sinners(armed robbers, prostitutes, occult men etc) are giving their lives to Jesus, but he told me I should forget about that one and that the pastor is a politician. I asked if he had listened to pastoes message before, he said yes. and i knew when the problem is. I replied by saying, "a man that stole one cube of Maggie in the market and the one that stole one billion naira in the government are both thieves before God, and they will be cast into hell fire.

hmmm...na wa o..you see human beings, from one fault to another. when I decided to ask him where he worships, he said, "amadioha". I kept quiet and I left him.

I hav cone to understand one thing about all the persecution about the chosen below.

2 Timothy 3:12 KJV
"Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution."

peteregwu: One day I was going along my street to buy something in a supermarket, the owner of that supermarket started chatting about the Lords Chosen. they know me very well to be a chosen in my area. he told me that He loves my church and my pastor, but that their is one thing he does not like about my pastor. I asked him what? I thought he would say something about the apron, but he said pastor is a politician. I was surprised. he said that pastor is not preaching to the politicians. I told him the purpose of Christ death is not for politicians alone but all. that the preaching of the pastor is to save sinners(politicians included). I also told him testimonies of how sinners(armed robbers, prostitutes, occult men etc) are giving their lives to Jesus, but he told me I should forget about that one and that the pastor is a politician. I asked if he had listened to pastoes message before, he said yes. and i knew when the problem is. I replied by saying, "a man that stole one cube of Maggie in the market and the one that stole one billion naira in the government are both thieves before God, and they will be cast into hell fire.

hmmm...na wa o..you see human beings, from one fault to another. when I decided to ask him where he worships, he said, "amadioha". I kept quiet and I left him.

I hav cone to understand one thing about all the persecution about the chosen below.

2 Timothy 3:12 KJV
"Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution."

When you suffer for doing something wrong it is not persecution. Please dont mix the two things.
The man's point is different from the apron thing and god of chosen and god of my pastor thing that we are talking about. The ones we are talking about are so glaring to the public. Nigerians are miracle seekers and they behave like mumu in order to get the miracle. Tell a Nigerian to chop em mama hair and receive miracle em go do am sharp sharp. Those miracle seekers cannot see anything wrong with your apron and god of my pastor stuff provided they will get miracle. its those of us that are not crazy about pursuing miracle that will reject the practices. Keep on with your effort in defending such ugly practices while we continue to kick against them.

peteregwu:

well, u tried speaking well. God bless u. although you are not a member, you have a true discerning Spirit of God. Linda is an agent of darkness, her confsession is backed by the powers of darkness. any church or person that patronize her mestage is bound by the ppower of darkness, their is a spell on it. if they like let them believe or not.

people don't lov to here the glorious testimonies of what God is doing in chosen, what they want to here is fault about chosen, but unfortunately their is no fault.

2 Thessalonians 2:11-12 KJV
"And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: [12] That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness."

The worst thing that can happen to anybody or institution is to believe they are without fault. Even Jesus said its only our heavenly father that is perfect and you are here claiming perfection for your church. That is the greatest demonic bondage and may God deliver you. Amen. Now people can see what am saying about you and your chosen in the bold.

peteregwu:
well, u tried speaking well. God bless u. although you are not a member, youhave a true discerning Spirit of God. Linda is an agent of darkness, her confsession is backed by the powers ofdarkness. any church or person that patronize her mestage is bound by the ppower of darkness, their is a spell on it. if they like let them believe or not.
people don't lov to here the glorious testimonies of what God is doing in chosen, what they want to here is fault about chosen, BUT UNFORTUNATELY THERE IS NO FAULT.

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Dear Peter, In as much as I respect the ACTS OF GOD in the chosen through its pastor I will not be swayed to agree with you that THERE IS NO FAULT.This statement is devoid of christlike nature of humility in acknowledging our frailties as fallible humans.Are you now saying pastor Lazarus or the chosen is infallible? At least pastor Lazarus himself HAS NEVER directly or indirectly tried to claim superhuman or infallible.This mindset is totally wrong.
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The chosen is making efforts but there are many things they still need to purge to clear every doubt of their allegiance to christ.Look at the attendance in the headquarter & branch NON-COMBINED services right now & compare it to what it used to be when the revival fire was still blazing high at onset & you realise that work needs to be done.
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There are a few other issues I may not name here since its not the right forum to reprove inadequacies cos people may misunderstand it.But please change is needed,prayer,fasting,consecration needs to be beefed up.Non essential practices need to be addressed & removed.Thanks

bizmahn:
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Dear Peter, In as much as I respect the ACTS OF GOD in the chosen through its pastor I will not be swayed to agree with you that THERE IS NO FAULT.This statement is devoid of christlike nature of humility in acknowledging our frailties as fallible humans.Are you now saying pastor Lazarus or the chosen is infallible? At least pastor Lazarus himself HAS NEVER directly or indirectly tried to claim superhuman or infallible.This mindset is totally wrong.
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The chosen is making efforts but there are many things they still need to purge to clear every doubt of their allegiance to christ.Look at the attendance in the headquarter & branch NON-COMBINED services right now & compare it to what it used to be when the revival fire was still blazing high at onset & you realise that work needs to be done.
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There are a few other issues I may not name here since its not the right forum to reprove inadequacies cos people may misunderstand it.But please change is needed,prayer,fasting,consecration needs to be beefed up.Non essential practices need to be addressed & removed.Thanks

Thanks a lot. Will @peteregwu agree with you and accept what you ve said? Hmmmm...let's see how the whole thing goes. I ve always prayed that God should destroy every false doctrine in me and in other individuals, in my church and in other churches, in nairaland and in other forums. Pls join me in this prayer when you are praying. God bless you my brother.

alexleo:

Thanks a lot. Will @peteregwu agree with you and accept what you ve said? Hmmmm...let's see how the whole thing goes. I ve always prayed that God should destroy every false doctrine in me and in other individuals, in my church and in other churches, in nairaland and in other forums. Pls join me in this prayer when you are praying. God bless you my brother.

Thanks, I've been praying & will ever continue.But I'm yet to find any trace of evidence that Linda's first testimony that you mentioned in your thread was accepted & distributed by the chosen,deeper life,redeemed etc.It appears that incident never occured.As you already know, its not good to give an account that is not confirmed true in something so sensitive that it can destroy the image of a person innocent of the allegation.Perhaps this is part of why Peteregwu is being so defensive to a "fault".Cos you folks really lashed Pastor Lazarus & Chosen in that thread. LOOOL!

My "guess" on the woman that claimed to be struck by thunder after burning chosen materials is this:- In the testimony of Joy David she claimed the aim of the devil through Linda is to pull people out of the chosen so that satan will strike them.If we are to agree with this testimony(which I counsel we rather pray God to show us) then its possible the sisters act of burning the materials was with a firm decision in her heart to backslide from serving God, giving room for satan to thunder strike her in the dream.Remember I said this is a guess & as such may be untrue since we don't know what really happened till God shows us.