adepeter2027:

I quite agree with you that atheists can never flow with things of the spirit....

Just the same way a MUSLIM will never agree JESUS died for HIS SINS.

Our discussion has nothing to do with Islam.

butterflyl1on:


Here is another way to view faith and how tangible it is.

NEED

You have 2 million naira and you want to buy a car. You go online and search for one and you find the perfect one for you.

PRAYER

You call the seller and your communication with him shows that yes it is perfect for you then he says you can come check it out.

WORKS

you book an inspection appointment and on that day you go check it out physically and you like what you see. You then promise to come the next day to pay and pick it up which you do.

FULFILMENT or JUSTIFICATION

you pay and pick up the car keys and drive away with it. It is now yours.

Faith is the cash you have in exchange for the vehicle. FAITH REPRESENTS THE VEHICLE YOU ARE YET TO HAVE. FAITH IS THE VEHICLE!

you trade it in for the vehicle and then the vehicle becomes a reality.

We apply this physically daily in practically all areas of our lives. The difference is because we are physical so we relate more from the physical side which is why many can only see this side. God however is a spirit so would speak from the spiritual side but the application is the same.

in this case, you acted based on evidence you have SEEN online, or confirmed otherwise about the reliability of the seller. Faith is more like giving your money to someone you know nothing about ( things not seen) to get you a car and hoping he does...

adepeter2027:

LoL

You are wicked dalama-n

He is just talking NONSENSE. What has he been explaining to you since? If the spiritual can NOT be detected with any of our physical sense then how did he know about it and experince it and know that it's true? These guys love making bogus claims about things and events, but when you hold them to take they start crying and end up running away.

He is telling us that there is this spirit that exist and we can encounter. He is to show us this his spirit at work first so that we will know he is not making things up since making things up is the ONLY thing they are good at.

butterflyl1on:


Vaxx is right to an extent about love being likened to faith.

Can love by itself be seen? NO!

Can love by itself be touched? NO!

Can love be felt by the carrier? YES!
How? ONLY THE CARRIER CAN EXPLAIN HOW!

Can love by itself be measured? NO BUT WE CAN MEASURE ITS ACTIONS!

if we cannot see or touch love but can feel it in a non tangible way yet express it tangibly then what makes us so sure that love is real when in itself cannot be scientifically observed unless AFTER when acted upon.

Vaxx is right!

Bro, you Dae fall my hands the more óò. Why are you guys shifting the definition of faith to suit the topic on ground?

Okay, lemme ask you this;
Can gaseous oxygen be seen? No
Can oxygen be felt physically? No
Can presence of oxygen be experimented? Yes.
Can oxygen be quantified? Yes.

Does that mean OXYGEN evidence is accepted based on faith?

I want your own definition of faith, then we can continue because I'm not understanding comparing loving some as having faith that person LOVES you.

Morealso, like you stated above, faith is a thing of the spirit realm, can the love we have for some be equated to something of the spiritual realm?

gabe:
in this case, you acted based on evidence you have SEEN online, or confirmed otherwise about the reliability of the seller. Faith is more like giving your money to someone you know nothing about ( things not seen) to get you a car and hoping he does...

Wrong!

FAITH IS THE SUBSTANCE OF THINGS HOPED FOR

The car is the hope. The money is the reality of the car. The money is the car but in different values. Give one to get the other.

THE EVIDENCE IF THINGS NOT SEEN.

The hope (car) was First not seen but it was desired in absentia.

Faith is also a desire for something unseen yet known to be real. That is the evidence. It's the evidence for something you know even when not seen.

butterflyl1on:


Our discussion has nothing to do with Islam.

LoL

So you see. I only drifted so you were comparing two unequal stuffs together.

butterflyl1on:


I indeed wonder if you read what you write.

From your comment





The spirit isn't available to ANYBODY but to specific people who have first of all genuinely given their lives to Christ. Plus God isn't objective.

I know you will say I am still talking nonsense so kindly let my nonsense make sense to me alone.

Good afternoon

God isn't objective? That's a new one. The things you guys make up and throw around everyday. Enjoy your delusions.

dalaman:


He is just talking NONSENSE. What has he been explaining to you since? If the spiritual can NOT be detected with any of our physical sense then how did he know about it and experince it and know that it's true? These guys love making bogus claims about things and events, but when you hold them to take they start crying and end up running away.

He is telling us that there is this spirit that exist and we can encounter. He is to show us this his spirit at work first so that we will know he is not making things up since making things up is the ONLY thing they are good at.

I know because I am not carnal (something you still are). I know because his spirit is in me and has bonded my spirit with his own so his spirit takes from him and reveals to me.

Outside this then I would be like a man from the jungles of the Amazon being spoken Chinese to. I would never understand.

butterflyl1on:


Wrong!

FAITH IS THE SUBSTANCE OF THINGS HOPED FOR

The car is the hope. The money is the reality of the car. The money is the car but in different values. Give one to get the other.

THE EVIDENCE IF THINGS NOT SEEN.

The hope (car) was First not seen but it was desired in absentia.

Faith is also a desire for something unseen yet known to be real. That is the evidence. It's the evidence for something you know even when not seen.

Spiritually, I'm inclined to agree with you cos CHRISTIANITY IS FAITH BASED.

And faith is only useful when there's no EVIDENCE

bookmarked

adepeter2027:

Bro, you Dae fall my hands the more óò. Why are you guys shifting the definition of faith to suit the topic on ground?

Okay, lemme ask you this;
Can gaseous oxygen be seen? No
Can oxygen be felt physically? No
Can presence of oxygen be experimented? Yes.
Can oxygen be quantified? Yes.

Does that mean OXYGEN evidence is accepted based on faith?

I want your own definition of faith, then we can continue because I'm not understanding comparing loving some as having faith that person LOVES you.

Morealso, like you stated above, faith is a thing of the spirit realm, can the love we have for some be equated to something of the spiritual realm?

Let me go further! How sure are you that you would live for the next 1 hour and that your breathe would not cease?

@butterflylion,

I'm I right if I say by FAITH, my dad will/would be the president of NIGERIA tomorrow?

adepeter2027:

Spiritually, I'm inclined to agree with you cos CHRISTIANITY IS FAITH BASED.

And faith is only useful when there's no EVIDENCE

Faith isn't useful when there is no evidence (that is a comment from your human perspective)

From the spiritual perspective, FAITH IS EVIDENCE!

butterflyl1on:


Let me go further! How sure are you that you would live for the next 1 hour and that your breathe would not cease?

I don't know...

adepeter2027:
@butterflylion,

I'm I right if I say by FAITH, my dad will/would be the president of NIGERIA tomorrow?

You cannot say that as the fleshly man you are. What is your faith standing on for you to make such a declaration?

Faith spiritually for Christians rests on God. So where does your own rest on for such a declaration to be made?

What do you anchor your faith to?

butterflyl1on:


Faith isn't useful when there is no evidence (that is a comment from your human perspective)

From the spiritual perspective, FAITH IS EVIDENCE!

LoL

That's why I said we're two parallel lines that can never meet..

Anyways, I already dropped a question for you above concerning "post of a President"

adepeter2027:

I don't know...

Why don't you know?

butterflyl1on:


You cannot say that as the fleshly man you are. What is your faith standing on for you to make such a declaration?

Faith spiritually for Christians rests on God. So where does your own rest on for such a declaration to be made?

What do you anchor your faith to?

Very good. I'm enjoying the way you're responding.

As a Christian that you are, do you have the FAITH that your dad will be the president of NIGERIA tomorrow been 29th September 2017?

butterflyl1on:


Why don't you know?

Cos I don't know

dalaman:


God isn't objective? That's a new one. The things you guys make up and throw around everyday. Enjoy your delusions.

Dalaman objectivity aligns with the scientific. God does not submit to scientific scrutiny because science is based on human perception. True or false?

butterflyl1on:


I know because I am not carnal (something you still are). I know because his spirit is in me and has bonded my spirit with his own so his spirit takes from him and reveals to me.

Outside this then I would be like a man from the jungles of the Amazon being spoken Chinese to. I would never understand.

What can this your spirit do? Make you spew jargon on nairaland? Is that all this your elusive spirit can do? I don't care about the claims that people make all I care is what they can demonstrate to be true about their various claims.

butterflyl1on:


Dalaman objectivity aligns with the scientific. God does not submit to scientific scrutiny because science is based on human perception. True or false?

And God is based on humans delusions abi? Yimu there.

AgentOfAllah:

I don't think we can agree on that. Evolution is supported by a staggering body of evidence. Creationism is supported by staggering speculations.

evidence of creationist isn't only logical it also has a science base... I even suggest creationist and evolutionist should work together ...the see hole that evolutionist could not see and they point it to them not to ignore the basic scientific law... An authority on science a physician paul Davies said, “The appearance of design is overwhelming.”

Why the complex design is logical...

logic has it that nothing produces nothing. When you test nothing like zero… no energy,, no air othing comes from it. However, if you stick something into nothing and something comes out of it then it is solely because of the something that is introduced to the nothing. This is logical.

Nothing is not even testable base on science method

adepeter2027:

Very good. I'm enjoying the way you're responding.

As a Christian that you are, do you have the FAITH that your dad will be the president of NIGERIA tomorrow been 29th September 2017?

Why would I make such a declaration out of the blue? To what end?

My faith is for me. My dads faith is for him. If he says he can be president by faith then my faith cannot work where his faith cannot.

My faith is MY possession of exchange. His own is his own.

However we can both come together and agree based on faith that this is our desire but we do not just talk of faith. We also talk about faith with works.

Go back and read where I listed our NEED, PRAYER, WORKS, JUSTIFICATION.

works must accompany faith for it to become a reality. Faith alone is dead.

adepeter2027:

Cos I don't know

You should know. Afterall you get up everyday and eat and take a bath and go to work so why do all these things if you do not know or are not sure.

dalaman:


And God is based on humans delusions abi? Yimu there.

Answer my question. True or false

dalaman:


What can this your spirit do? Make you spew jargon on nairaland? Is that all this your elusive spirit can do? I don't care about the claims that people make all I care is what they can demonstrate to be true about their various claims.

Since you do not care then let it be. If you do not care then why bother everyone day in day out for evidence of these claims. One preceeds the other. The claim before your demand for evidence yet you say you do not care about the claims. If truly you do not care why then demand for demonstrative evidence?

butterflyl1on:


Answer my question. True or false

False.

dalaman:


False.

So Science is subjective and God is objective?

Is science no longer based on human perception?

You are just so eager to type without reading. See you making blunders everywhere and fellow ignorant people ended up liking and sharing your ignorant post about God being objective.

You and I know that God is subjective to a believer.

Science is objective. So why try to twist it?

butterflyl1on:


You should know. Afterall you get up everyday and eat and take a bath and go to work so why do all these things if you do not know or are not sure.

Ohh God,

adepeter2027:

Ohh God,

You should know. Why do you labour daily if you are not sure of being alive the next hour?

butterflyl1on:


You should know. Why do you labour daily if you are not sure of being alive the next hour?

You know what? I agree with you.

Let's just end it