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Re: Lady Burns Virgin Mary’s Statue In Enugu (Photos) by MistadeRegal(m): 8:30am On Jan 14, 2019 |
ebukason3: JESUS CHRIST never told anyone to worship his mother. Those passages you quoted still hasn't proved your claims but see this: Now the Jew's feast of tabernacles was at hand. His brethren therefore said unto him, Depart hence, and go into Judaea, that thy disciples also may see the works that thou doest. For there is no man that doeth any thing in secret, and he himself seeketh to be known openly. If thou do these things, shew thyself to the world. For neither did his brethren believe in him. John:7:2-5 Hope you can see 'that thy disciples'. |
Re: Lady Burns Virgin Mary’s Statue In Enugu (Photos) by MightySparrow: 8:39am On Jan 14, 2019 |
HOW SHE COME OFFEND AM? |
Re: Lady Burns Virgin Mary’s Statue In Enugu (Photos) by Nobody: 10:19am On Jan 14, 2019 |
TarOrfeek:No she is not jealous rather she is unhappy with the way things are going on in that parish. Proper investigation should be carried to dig more |
Re: Lady Burns Virgin Mary’s Statue In Enugu (Photos) by spine: 10:26am On Jan 14, 2019 |
sharpwriter: Thanks for your response. My own view is this. you have chosen the stance of the protestant argument. its an age old debate between the catholics and the protestants. it is by no means a proven fact that your view is correct nor false. The debate has never ended. As you have stated, modern preachers insisting Mary had other children.....james,joseph,simon and judas as the bible verse you quoted suggests. you have another large group of Legendary bible scholars, with great access to information and its context interpreting the contrary, and with reasonable foundation. why is this? it is not explicitly stated. its still within the realm of assumption. each person is free to derive his own interpretation. Trust me lots of research has been done to support both arguments that has led me to drop the matter. In my own personal view and with all the research ive done, there isnt enough to conclude so i would stick to the "ever virgin" perception. and if she had other kids with her betrothed husband Joseph, after Jesus Christ birth or death, nothing spoil. Just wont jump into conclusion and pontificate on texts that are very open to interpretation. at the end of the day we mostly tend to lean towards our personal bias and which authority you trust more. were all guilty of this. its the reason we have so many churches with their different doctrines. you may look thru this for other perspectives that dont necessarily agree with the protestant point of view, there are quite a few. https://testeverythingblog.com/who-was-james-the-brother-of-jesus-103d00828bce cheers |
Re: Lady Burns Virgin Mary’s Statue In Enugu (Photos) by Nobody: 10:27am On Jan 14, 2019 |
Jeromejnr:That doesn't justify her action. There are many churches to attend if she feels uncomfortable with the Catholic church as nobody will beat or ostracize her. Even if she, there other denomination that would accept her. What she did was an act of stupidity |
Re: Lady Burns Virgin Mary’s Statue In Enugu (Photos) by Nobody: 10:29am On Jan 14, 2019 |
MistadeRegal:You just posted the truth but does that justify that lady's action |
Re: Lady Burns Virgin Mary’s Statue In Enugu (Photos) by Nobody: 10:30am On Jan 14, 2019 |
Aurielfinizu:How for burning an idol or what? |
Re: Lady Burns Virgin Mary’s Statue In Enugu (Photos) by spine: 10:48am On Jan 14, 2019 |
I remember the comment Arch Bishop Alaba Job made. i was pretty young then, but it stuck and changed my view on religious bashing antagonism and excessively getting involved in other peoples business rather than facing yours... He said: You pray to God and he answers your prayer? correct and everyone said yea, yea! I pray to God and sometimes Pray through Mary and God still answers my prayer right?....a great nos shouted yes, yes! then he wailed in a funny tone...... so what is the PROBLEM !!! why do you people like wahala....? it was funny, didnt go down with everyone but it disarmed everyone.... Lesson learnt face your business, do your own and leave judgment for God...nobody can lay claim to knowing Gods full manual of who is wrong or right and who gets blessed. |
Re: Lady Burns Virgin Mary’s Statue In Enugu (Photos) by Nobody: 11:03am On Jan 14, 2019 |
Xander85:Here are the facts staring at many Catholics on idol worship 1.The Catholic church teaches it's followers to bow down before statues when in prayer. Anyone can walk into a Catholic church and see kneelers before every statue place within. However, the Creator specifically states in Exo 20:5,Lev 26:1 on bowing down to statues 2.The Catholic church declares unto all that are of her church to embrace and gather as many statues, medals, relics, and artifacts to themselves as a sign of holiness unto the Lord God. However, the Creator specifically states in Deut 29: 17 not to use such. Even some pentecostal churches have join them in this madness by putting on their G.O's picture on pendant. Thank the likes of Adeboye and Olukoya have vehemently condemned such in their preaching. 3.Catholics pray repetitive prayers using the rosary whereas Jesus forbid repetitive prayer ( See Mat 6:7) 4. Many catholics believe that Mary is still a virgin whereas the bible made it clear after birth of Christ that she had other children ( see Mat 13:55-56. 5. Catholics believe Mary is a mediator between man and God whereas the bible was clear when it say that Jesus was ( See 1 Tim 2:5) 6. From 1200-1970 AD, Roman Catholics laity were forbidden to drink the blood. This is known as communion under one kind, or communion of one species. During this time, Roman Catholics are permitted to eat the bread (body) of the Lord's Supper, they are generally not allowed to drink the wine (blood) of the Lord's Supper, as any Catholic knows from his own experience from attending Mass. (Except on rare special occasions.) The laity (the people in the pews) are withheld the cup of the Lord and it is usually reserved for church leaders only. Yes there are denominations within the Roman Catholic "communion" where some RC sects actually offer the juice, but most Mass attending Catholics know they rarely drink the cup of wine. Even till date many parishes don't share the wine whereas it run contrary to what Mat 26:26-28, 8; 1 Corinthians 11:23-28 |
Re: Lady Burns Virgin Mary’s Statue In Enugu (Photos) by spine: 1:07pm On Jan 14, 2019 |
asuustrike1: Bros i can see you are set in your views. goodluck with that. i used to do this many years ago. diseccting the so called ills of other denominations and exalting mine. It is self deciet to presume you have the monopoly of good and christlike behavior in the church you were groomed. when i got wiser, i discovered its all bullocks trying to grandstand or assuming God has your personal email and has sent you 2019 update in detail on who is absolutely right and who is hell bound. The same bible youre quoting, is the same bible that people quote to justify what they do. na you go tire. these debates have been on for years. The same book that says suffer not the witch to live, still tells brethren to love those who do them harm. The same bible that condemns "vain repetitive prayer" in which you conspicuously chose the rosary example and forgot the fire prayers with arrows and missiles in most pentecostal churches still says pray without ceasing..... what constitutes idolatry today would shock you....you have no idea. Pray to God for insight lest you be found wanting with set beliefs. bottom line the bible is not a story book to use in entertaining yourself....so many thing come into play.. the context in which the statement was said, the situation youre trying to address and the spirit leading you. it is my candid resolution to quit pontificating... if i am not comfortable in a particular church because their methods dont resonate with me, i would simply find a different place and guide my kin there so they are raised with the foundation i can comprehend. Same God who gave us Abraham and then isaac still gave haggar a son called ishmael...after the were driven away into the desert, the same God who you think you totally understand provided a miracle of water supply in the desert. ishmael is the genesis of muslims according to our holybook if you dont know everything exercise restraint and keep vain judgement to yourself bottomline face your church and your own business and leave God to decide who is right and wrong. cheers |
Re: Lady Burns Virgin Mary’s Statue In Enugu (Photos) by ebukason3(m): 2:24pm On Jan 14, 2019 |
MistadeRegal:Here are the bible verses I quoted John 19:25 But by the cross of Jesus stood His mother, His mother's sister, Mary the [wife] of Clopas, and Mary Magdalene. Matthew 27:56 Among them were Mary of Magdala, and Mary the mother of James and Joseph, and the mother of Zebedee's sons. Mark 15:40 Now some women were there also, looking on from a distance, among whom were Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James the younger and of Joses, and Salome, Jude 1 1 JUDE, A servant of Jesus Christ (the Messiah), and brother of James, [writes this letter] to those who are called (chosen), dearly loved by God the Father and separated (set apart) and kept for Jesus Christ: Mark 3:17-18 17 James son of Zebedee and John the brother of James, and He surnamed them Boanerges, that is, Sons of Thunder; 18 And Andrew, and Philip, and Bartholomew (Nathaniel), and Matthew, and Thomas, and James son of Alphaeus, and Thaddaeus (Judas, not Iscariot), and Simon the Cananaean [also called Zelotes], Matthew 13:55-56 55 Is not this the carpenter's Son? Is not His mother called Mary? And are not His brothers James and Joseph and Simon and Judas? 56 And do not all His sisters live here among us? Where then did this Man get all this? ___________________________________________________ Matthew 13 listed James, Joseph, Simon and Judas. Now let's take a look on crucification account by John, Mark and Mathew listed above ( in the crowd three women were noted Mary mother of Jesus, {Mary the [wife] of Clopas, } and Mary Magdalene. John tells us that the wife of Clopas also named Mary is a sister to Mary mother of Jesus. Mark 15:40 points out that Joses(Joseph),James (also in Jude1:1), Judas(Jude) are Children of wife of clopas Note also the use of sister for Clopas wife in John account (They were both named Mary). _____________________________________________________ Don't forget this, all generations shall call Mary blessed (Luke1:48). Does it mean that the Israelites were worshiping the Ark of the covenant in the book of Exodus. What biblical revelations Do yo have about the old and new Ark of the covenant? Now see why Mary is the Ark of the covenant. Embodiment of Gods presence and grace. God the Holy Spirit overshadowed and then indwelled the Ark. The Ark became the dwelling place of the presence of God [ Exodus 40:34-35] God the Holy Spirit overshadowed and then indwelled Mary. At that time Mary's womb became the dwelling place of the presence of God [ Luke 1:35]. The Ark contained the Ten Commandments [the words of God in stone], a pot of manna, and Aaron's rod that came back to life [ Deuteronomy 10:3-5; Hebrews 9:4]. The womb of the Virgin contained Jesus: the living Word of God enfleshed, the living bread from heaven, "the Branch" (Messianic title) who would die but come back to life [ Luke 1:35]. The Ark traveled to the hill country of Judah to rest in the house of Obed-edom [ 2 Samuel 6:1-11] Mary traveled to the hill country of Judah (Judea) to the home of Elizabeth [ Luke 1:39] Dressed in a priestly ephod, King David approached the Ark and danced and leapt for joy [ 2 Samuel 6:14] John the Baptist, son of a priest who would himself becomes a priest, leapt for joy in Elizabeth's womb at the approach of Mary [ Luke 1:43] David shouted for joy in the presence of God and the holy Ark [ 2 Samuel 6:15] Elizabeth exclaimed with a loud cry of joy in the presence God within Mary [ Luke 1:42] David asked, "How is it that the Ark of the Lord comes to me?" [ 2 Samuel 6:9] Elizabeth asks, "Why is this granted unto me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me?" [ Luke 1:43] The Ark remained in the house of Obed- edom for 3 months [ 2 Samuel 6:11] Mary remained in the house of her cousin Elizabeth for 3 months [ Luke 1:56]. The house of Obed-edom was blessed by the presence of the Ark [ 2 Samuel 6:11] The word "blessed" is used 3 times in Luke 1:39-45 concerning Mary at Elizabeth's house. The Ark returned to its sanctuary and eventually ends up in Jerusalem where the presence and glory of God is revealed in the newly built Temple [ 2 Samuel 6:12; 1 Kings 8:9-11] Mary returned home from visiting Elizabeth and eventually comes to Jerusalem, where she presents God the Son in the Temple [ Luke 1:56; 2:21-22] God made Aaron's rod (which would be kept in the Ark) return to life and budded to prove he was the legitimate High Priest [ Numbers 17:8]. God would resurrect His Son, who had become enfleshed in Mary's womb and born to bring salvation to all mankind, to prove He is the eternal High Priest [ Hebrews 4:14]. When the Ark was outside the Holy of Holies [when it was being transported] it was to be covered with a blue veil [ Numbers 4:4-6] In Mary's appearances outside of heaven visionaries testify that she wears a blue veil. In Revelation 11:19 John sees the Ark of the Covenant in heaven [this is the last verse of chapter 11] In Revelation 12:1 John sees Mary in heaven. |
Re: Lady Burns Virgin Mary’s Statue In Enugu (Photos) by MistadeRegal(m): 3:34pm On Jan 14, 2019 |
asuustrike1: Only GOD can judge her action. But according to the commandment of GOD in: Thou shalt have no other gods before me. Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in HEAVEN ABOVE, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; And showing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments. Exodus:20:3-6 Making an image to worship is idolatery. |
Re: Lady Burns Virgin Mary’s Statue In Enugu (Photos) by Nobody: 5:00pm On Jan 14, 2019 |
spine:The mother church is in pentecostal this was not how God wanted it to be. The bible is our guide and I have given you facts with scriptural evidences as to why idolatry still exist in that church. Unfortunately anybody against catholics is either a protestant or pentecostal even when the evidence is staring at them. Am not a pentecostal if you must know |
Re: Lady Burns Virgin Mary’s Statue In Enugu (Photos) by ebukason3(m): 7:05pm On Jan 14, 2019 |
asuustrike1: Bro read the bible well, you will know that Mary has no other children. Nor do catholic worship mary . I have posted it above but have to copy it to you here. John 19:25 But by the cross of Jesus stood His mother, His mother's sister, Mary the [wife] of Clopas, and Mary Magdalene. Matthew 27:56 Among them were Mary of Magdala, and Mary the mother of James and Joseph, and the mother of Zebedee's sons. Mark 15:40 Now some women were there also, looking on from a distance, among whom were Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James the younger and of Joses, and Salome, Jude 1 1 JUDE, A servant of Jesus Christ (the Messiah), and brother of James, [writes this letter] to those who are called (chosen), dearly loved by God the Father and separated (set apart) and kept for Jesus Christ: Mark 3:17-18 17 James son of Zebedee and John the brother of James, and He surnamed them Boanerges, that is, Sons of Thunder; 18 And Andrew, and Philip, and Bartholomew (Nathaniel), and Matthew, and Thomas, and James son of Alphaeus, and Thaddaeus (Judas, not Iscariot), and Simon the Cananaean [also called Zelotes], Matthew 13:55-56 55 Is not this the carpenter's Son? Is not His mother called Mary? And are not His brothers James and Joseph and Simon and Judas? 56 And do not all His sisters live here among us? Where then did this Man get all this? ___________________________________________________ Matthew 13 listed James, Joseph, Simon and Judas. Now let's take a look on crucification account by John, Mark and Mathew listed above ( in the crowd three women were noted Mary mother of Jesus, {Mary the [wife] of Clopas, } and Mary Magdalene. John tells us that the wife of Clopas also named Mary is a sister to Mary mother of Jesus. Mark 15:40 points out that Joses(Joseph),James (also in Jude1:1), Judas(Jude) are Children of wife of clopas Note also the use of sister for Clopas wife in John account (They were both named Mary). _____________________________________________________ Don't forget this, all generations shall call Mary blessed (Luke1:48). Does it mean that the Israelites were worshiping the Ark of the covenant in the book of Exodus. What biblical revelations Do yo have about the old and new Ark of the covenant? Now see why Mary is the Ark of the covenant. Embodiment of Gods presence and grace. God the Holy Spirit overshadowed and then indwelled the Ark. The Ark became the dwelling place of the presence of God [ Exodus 40:34-35] God the Holy Spirit overshadowed and then indwelled Mary. At that time Mary's womb became the dwelling place of the presence of God [ Luke 1:35]. The Ark contained the Ten Commandments [the words of God in stone], a pot of manna, and Aaron's rod that came back to life [ Deuteronomy 10:3-5; Hebrews 9:4]. The womb of the Virgin contained Jesus: the living Word of God enfleshed, the living bread from heaven, "the Branch" (Messianic title) who would die but come back to life [ Luke 1:35]. The Ark traveled to the hill country of Judah to rest in the house of Obed-edom [ 2 Samuel 6:1-11] Mary traveled to the hill country of Judah (Judea) to the home of Elizabeth [ Luke 1:39] Dressed in a priestly ephod, King David approached the Ark and danced and leapt for joy [ 2 Samuel 6:14] John the Baptist, son of a priest who would himself becomes a priest, leapt for joy in Elizabeth's womb at the approach of Mary [ Luke 1:43] David shouted for joy in the presence of God and the holy Ark [ 2 Samuel 6:15] Elizabeth exclaimed with a loud cry of joy in the presence God within Mary [ Luke 1:42] David asked, "How is it that the Ark of the Lord comes to me?" [ 2 Samuel 6:9] Elizabeth asks, "Why is this granted unto me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me?" [ Luke 1:43] The Ark remained in the house of Obed- edom for 3 months [ 2 Samuel 6:11] Mary remained in the house of her cousin Elizabeth for 3 months [ Luke 1:56]. The house of Obed-edom was blessed by the presence of the Ark [ 2 Samuel 6:11] The word "blessed" is used 3 times in Luke 1:39-45 concerning Mary at Elizabeth's house. The Ark returned to its sanctuary and eventually ends up in Jerusalem where the presence and glory of God is revealed in the newly built Temple [ 2 Samuel 6:12; 1 Kings 8:9-11] Mary returned home from visiting Elizabeth and eventually comes to Jerusalem, where she presents God the Son in the Temple [ Luke 1:56; 2:21-22] God made Aaron's rod (which would be kept in the Ark) return to life and budded to prove he was the legitimate High Priest [ Numbers 17:8]. God would resurrect His Son, who had become enfleshed in Mary's womb and born to bring salvation to all mankind, to prove He is the eternal High Priest [ Hebrews 4:14]. When the Ark was outside the Holy of Holies [when it was being transported] it was to be covered with a blue veil [ Numbers 4:4-6] In Mary's appearances outside of heaven visionaries testify that she wears a blue veil. In Revelation 11:19 John sees the Ark of the Covenant in heaven [this is the last verse of chapter 11] |
Re: Lady Burns Virgin Mary’s Statue In Enugu (Photos) by spine: 8:46am On Jan 15, 2019 |
asuustrike1: Nice to hear your opining from a "neutral" perspective nevertheless, in your spare time feel free to read the link and passages posted below (not so you agree but so you see there are other angles) so at least i can also support my claim that the bible gives diverse perspectives and idolatry is not something of mere appearances. theres a thin line between symbolism, reverence for someone and outright worship regardless of the popular negative opinion imprinted in some minds Since i did not create the earth, i would rather leave the controversy of who the sinner is and who isnt to the Creator and choose a path that is appropriate in my sight. Theres need for humility and grace to fully comprehend and tolerate differences rather than castigate amiss, knowing full well, some of your own practices too can be called to question. https://www.catholic.com/index.php/tract/do-catholics-worship-statues (cf. 1 Kgs. 6:29–32, 8:6–66; 2 Chr. 3:7–14. in the end its prudent to face your own, because that book is open to interpretation whether or not you disagree and are convinced beyond reasonable doubt that the group is wallowing in sin. |
Re: Lady Burns Virgin Mary’s Statue In Enugu (Photos) by Nobody: 5:22pm On Jan 15, 2019 |
Re: Lady Burns Virgin Mary’s Statue In Enugu (Photos) by Nodogragra4me(m): 11:48am On Jan 18, 2019 |
ebukason3: All this comparison is not addressing the issue of worship of Mary or images The Catholic church proclaims that she is only honouring and not worshipping Mary but the the evidence within the church practice speaks otherwise. Mary of the catholic church occupies a more prominent position within the church than Jesus Christ, the ALMIGHTY GOD AND THE holy spirit put together..... To her is a litany devoted calling her queen of of heaven, a a name condemned in the scripture. The longest formula prayer within the Catholic Church is devoted exclusively to her...the rosary...s.sometimes, it is elongated to 15 decadea The Church encourages you to pray to Mary rather than follow the Bible recommendations of asking in the name of the only recognized advocate and high priest between man and God . There is no way all this prominence that contradict the very words of Jesus Christ can be reduced to mere honour. You can't worship God through any image, no matter the good intentions...he is not an image but spirit and can only be worshipped in spirit through our spirit |
Re: Lady Burns Virgin Mary’s Statue In Enugu (Photos) by Xisnin(m): 12:01pm On Jan 18, 2019 |
CAPSLOCKED:Fixed. I am positive that most active on nairaland are frustrated waec candidates and unemployable "graduates". |
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