jcross19:
oh go and check my previous posts I said give me a quotation where the apostles ordained Paul? I have told you that it's only Jesus and God have the power to ordain a man ! Jesus was the one that ordained Paul and the apostles ! So show me where apostles ordained any man.

The point is no man can be ordained by his fellow man. Ordination is from the will of Jehovah God by means of holy spirit.
The minister must have a firm grasp of God's word, so he can minister to others.
Shalom.

Janosky:


The point is no man can be ordained by his fellow man. Ordination is from the will of Jehovah God by means of holy spirit.
The minister must have a firm grasp of God's word, so he can minister to others.
Shalom.

okay! you now get my point! you people might not believe what divine call is all about you can check the story of Ezekiel, Isaiah, Jacob, John the Baptist, Jeremiah and many in the bible called for a special mission.

Janosky:

Oh sorry, maybe not this thread.
I know you had a duel with Kumuyi's spokesman on NL.
"ogbeni gbe fila" or something like that....

Not on this topic. Not in any thread on this topic. I never uttered such a phrase ever.

The reference to pots and kettles refers to a common saying about people cut from the same cloth yet criticising each other in a bid to be superior.

I have nothing whatsoever in common with Kumuyi's henchman. It is you and him that are born of that same spirit.

PastorAIO:


Not on this topic. Not in any thread on this topic. I never uttered such a phrase ever.

The reference to pots and kettles refers to a common saying about people cut from the same cloth yet criticising each other in a bid to be superior.

I have nothing whatsoever in common with Kumuyi's henchman. It is you and him that are born of that same spirit.

Yes. Not on this thread but those comments mirror the topic of this thread.
That aside, your last sentence & every assertion are false.
There are several threads by "Kumuyi's henchman" that debunks your claims.

PastorAIO:


Not on this topic. Not in any thread on this topic. I never uttered such a phrase ever.

The reference to pots and kettles refers to a common saying about people cut from the same cloth yet criticising each other in a bid to be superior.

I have nothing whatsoever in common with Kumuyi's henchman. It is you and him that are born of that same spirit.

Yes. Not on this thread but those comments mirror the topic of this thread.

"Re: "How Can One Witness To A Jehovah's
Witness?"
by OLAADEGBU ( m ): 11:33am On Jul 31
PastorAIO:
Is Kumuyi a rejected Jehovah Witness?
That is not the question, Ogbeni gbe fila.
( Quote ) ( Report ) ( Like ) ( Share )
Re: "How Can One Witness To A Jehovah's
Witness?"
by PastorAIO : 2:43pm On Jul 31
OLAADEGBU :
That is not the question, Ogbeni gbe
fila.
How can one witness to a rejected Jehovah
witness?
( Quote ) ( Report ) 1 Like ( Like ) ( Share )
Re: "How Can One Witness To A Jehovah's
Witness?"
by OLAADEGBU ( m ): 2:55pm On Jul 31
PastorAIO:
How can one witness to a rejected
Jehovah witness?
"You are of your father the devil , and the
lusts of your father you will do . He was a
murderer from the beginning , and abode not
in the truth , because there is no truth in
him . When he speaks a lie, he speaketh of
his own : for he is a liar , and the father of
it" (John 8:44)
See the children of the devil creeping out
from the woodworks. Spreading lies from the
father of lies. You better repent and believe
the gospel truth before it becomes too late.
( Quote ) ( Report ) ( Like ) ( Share ) "


****¢ That aside, your assertions are false.
There are several threads by "Kumuyi's henchman" that debunks your claims.
Thank you.

Janosky:

Yes. Not on this thread but those comments mirror the topic of this thread.
That aside, your last sentence & every assertion are false.
There are several threads by "Kumuyi's henchman" that debunks your claims.

What assertion exactly?

PastorAIO:

What assertion exactly?

PastorAIO:


*1)have nothing whatsoever in common with Kumuyi's henchman.
*2) It is you and him that are born of that same spirit.

Your (*2) assertion is NOT true. Several topics by Kumuyi's henchman debunks it.

Janosky:


Your (*2) assertion is NOT true.
Several topics by Kumuyi's henchman debunks it.

Au contraire mon ami.

The contentious need to superior by any means necessary can be found in Kumuyi's henchmen and Charlie Russell's disciples both.

PastorAIO:


Au contraire mon ami.

The contentious need to superior by any means necessary can be found in Kumuyi's henchmen and Charlie Russell's disciples both.

That's your own opinion, though.
Your freedom of speech is guaranteed.

Janosky:


That's your own opinion, though.
Your freedom of speech is guaranteed.

Thank you. This is very kind of you,

jcross19:
okay! you now get my point! you people might not believe what divine call is all about you can check the story of Ezekiel, Isaiah, Jacob, John the Baptist, Jeremiah and many in the bible called for a special mission.

Divine call worked out before Jesus established Christianity @ Pentecost, note how Apostle Paul explained this @ Hebrews 1:1: there he made it clear to the Israelites{the one and only nation with whom God had a direct dealing} that divine calling is appropriate because God's only begotten son who will teach us all what we need to know about God has not come yet!

Immediately after Pentecost all those who wish to worship the true God must work in harmony with the Christian congregation. There happens to be no more divine calling that's independent of this group! Roman's 15:5-6, 1Corinthians 1:10, Ephesians 4:3, Philippians 2:2

It's impossible for anyone to start a new religious group that's independent of all other existing religious groups and still claim that it's from the same God! 1Corinthians 14:40

Kumuyi never claimed that he is not serving the same God with other existing Churches, which means he supposed to be ordained by one group as a minister having the same teaching with them. That's why Kumuyi's followers are confused on this matter because they can neither claim he is totally different nor freely associate with other existing religious groups!

On the other hand, Russell's followers strongly believe that there's no other group teaching the truth except their group and they're ever ready to defend their assertion.
For your information Sir, that's why all other religious groups do team up against the JWs as they're not as dumb as deeperlifers who finds it difficult to stand out clearly as totally different from all others!

Before now i also thought the same thing, but after discussing with several members of these two groups, i discovered the sharp contrast!

Maximus69:


Divine call worked out before Jesus established Christianity @ Pentecost, note how Apostle Paul explained this @ Hebrews 1:1: there he made it clear to the Israelites{the one and only nation with whom God had a direct dealing} that divine calling is appropriate because God's only begotten son who will teach us all what we need to know about God has not come yet!

Immediately after Pentecost all those who wish to worship the true God must work in harmony with the Christian congregation. There happens to be no more divine calling that's independent of this group! Roman's 15:5-6, 1Corinthians 1:10, Ephesians 4:3, Philippians 2:2

It's impossible for anyone to start a new religious group that's independent of all other existing religious groups and still claim that it's from the same God! 1Corinthians 14:40

Kumuyi never claimed that he is not serving the same God with other existing Churches, which means he supposed to be ordained by one group as a minister having the same teaching with them. That's why Kumuyi's followers are confused on this matter because they can neither claim he is totally different nor freely associate with other existing religious groups!

On the other hand, Russell's followers strongly believe that there's no other group teaching the truth except their group and they're ever ready to defend their assertion.
For your information Sir, that's why all other religious groups do team up against the JWs as they're not as dumb as deeperlifers who finds it difficult to stand out clearly as totally different from all others!

Before now i also thought the same thing, but after discussing with several members of these two groups, i discovered the sharp contrast!

you are confused here! am on the field and I understand what divine call is all about ! they are many Muslims and traditionalists who have divine calls to be pastor or prophet but they are not even a Christian still divine call is on them until they find their way to Christianity before the call can materialised . like I have said it's only Jesus/God have the power to ordain any man for His workshop.

jcross19:
you are confused here! am on the field and I understand what divine call is all about ! they are many Muslims and traditionalists who have divine calls to be pastor or prophet but they are not even a Christian still divine call is on them until they find their way to Christianity before the call can materialised . like I have said it's only Jesus/God have the power to ordain any man for His workshop.

Hmmmmmmmmm OK, so you think i'm confused right?

Well @bolded

So if these ones eventually heard voices, are you of the opinion that God actually called them! Revelations 16:14

¤Please for what purpose? 2Corinthians 4:4

¤Called for what without Christ{Light}?

¤Then what stops God from calling everyone?

¤Why preaching if God chose to call just anybody all by himself?

Please i'll assume you're NOT confused for now but if these questions aren't answered then something is wrong somewhere!

Maximus69:


Hmmmmmmmmm OK, so you think i'm confused right?

Well @bolded

So if these ones eventually heard voices, are you of the opinion that God actually called them! Revelations 16:14

¤Please for what purpose? 2Corinthians 4:4

¤Called for what without Christ{Light}?

¤Then what stops God from calling everyone?

¤Why preaching if God chose to call just anybody all by himself?

Please i'll assume you're NOT confused for now but if these questions aren't answered then something is wrong somewhere!

don't be confused here or try to misunderstood me! like what I said many Muslims and traditionalists they have divine calls but until they get close to church or Christ before it materialised . I have a friend who was born as Muslims most of his life as Islamic preacher but one day he met Christ in his dream that's all because he was a chosen vessel! before any man was born, man have been chosen from womb to carry out a certain mission that's your divine call! a duty that can only be carried out only by you. they are many pastors in book haram but because they are on a wrong track they could not realised who they are now devil have hijacked them to carry out his works.

jcross19:
don't be confused here or try to misunderstood me! like what I said many Muslims and traditionalists they have divine calls but until they get close to church or Christ before it materialised . I have a friend who was born as Muslims most of his life as Islamic preacher but one day he met Christ in his dream that's all because he was a chosen vessel! before any man was born, man have been chosen from womb to carry out a certain mission that's your divine call! a duty that can only be carried out only by you. they are many pastors in book haram but because they are on a wrong track they could not realised who they are now devil have hijacked them to carry out his works.

Please calm down a bit because it's pointless becoming bitterly annoyed with someone who is asking you sincere questions!

¤So what's the purpose of Jesus coming if God has chosen all of us one way or the other to do his will?

¤What then is the meaning of all have sinned and fall short of God's glory.Romans 3:23 if all of us are divinely chosen?

¤What is the essence of preaching and teaching if all those living had been chosen from their mother's womb?

Maximus69:


Please calm down a bit because it's pointless becoming bitterly annoyed with someone who is asking you sincere questions!

¤So what's the purpose of Jesus coming if God has chosen all of us one way or the other to do his will?

¤What then is the meaning of all have sinned and fall short of God's glory.Romans 3:23 if all of us are divinely chosen?

¤What is the essence of preaching and teaching if all those living had been chosen from their mother's womb?

1 Peter 2:9 King James Version (KJV)
But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light; can you see that? look at the story of Jacob and Esau , Jacob was chosen even inside the womb but still the chosen Jacob did not stop him been a fraudster can you see that? God have given every mankind a mandate but the choice is left for you.

jcross19:
1 Peter 2:9 King James Version (KJV)
But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light; can you see that? look at the story of Jacob and Esau , Jacob was chosen even inside the womb but still the chosen Jacob did not stop him been a fraudster can you see that? God have given every mankind a mandate but the choice is left for you.

@bolded

Sir, i disagree completely with that statement of yours!

Jacob surely treasures spiritual things but Esau doesn't that's why God preferred Jacob {the second son} rather than Esau! Genesis 25:30-34

Both of them knew very well that the promise of being the ancestor of the Messiah {Christ} belongs to the first born son of the family, but Esau dispises these spiritual heritage while Jacob really treasure it in his heart!

Remember Jesus' illustration of the man who found a piece of land that's of great value, went and sold all that he had only to by that land! Matthew 13:44

Jesus is God's representative in the flesh so whatever Jesus tells us is exactly how God feels inside! John 1:18

God whose undivided attention is focused on the lineage that will bring about the Messiah could say in advance that Isaac's second son is his choice!

Apart from that lineage and anyone having to do with pure worship, it's God's angels that makes report of what's happening there to him {Genesis 18:20-21} because he has taken his mind away from them since they'll not bring him joy! Genesis 6:5-6

So he is NOT predestining all humans on earth as the Churches taught people Sir, his main focus was on the one and only race that will produce the Messiah! Luke 3:23-38

I think that I have just learned something gbnew about JWs, that is that Predestination or having a Divinely appointed Purpose is not a part of their doctrine and that they oppose it vehemently.

jcross19:
1 Peter 2:9 King James Version (KJV)
But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light; can you see that? look at the story of Jacob and Esau , Jacob was chosen even inside the womb but still the chosen Jacob did not stop him been a fraudster can you see that? God have given every mankind a mandate but the choice is left for you.

Maximus69:


@bolded

Sir, i disagree completely with that statement of yours!

Jacob surely treasures spiritual things but Esau doesn't that's why God preferred Jacob {the second son} rather than Esau! Genesis 25:30-34

Both of them knew very well that the promise of being the ancestor of the Messiah {Christ} belongs to the first born son of the family, but Esau dispises these spiritual heritage while Jacob really treasure it in his heart!

Remember Jesus' illustration of the man who found a piece of land that's of great value, went and sold all that he had only to by that land! Matthew 13:44

Jesus is God's representative in the flesh so whatever Jesus tells us is exactly how God feels inside! John 1:18

God whose undivided attention is focused on the lineage that will bring about the Messiah could say in advance that Isaac's second son is his choice!

Apart from that lineage and anyone having to do with pure worship, it's God's angels that makes report of what's happening there to him {Genesis 18:20-21} because he has taken his mind away from them since they'll not bring him joy! Genesis 6:5-6

So he is NOT predestining all humans on earth as the Churches taught people Sir, his main focus was on the one and only race that will produce the Messiah! Luke 3:23-38

then what about Isaiah 49 vs 1-2 , Jeremiah 1vs1-6 ? and 1peter 2:9 I quoted before? abi that verse is not part of bible? funny if you don't believe that, that does not mean there is no divine call! you are spiritual empty that's why you are talking like a kid I have given quotations backing my point. now there is no where in the bible where God says He chooses Jacob because he treasure the spiritual heritage abi what do you call it self. I laugh again! so are you telling me that Jacob and Esau have decided their believes from womb is that what you are saying? back your point up with bible verses. don't come post that your unwise journals here.

Maximus69:


@bolded

Sir, i disagree completely with that statement of yours!

Jacob surely treasures spiritual things but Esau doesn't that's why God preferred Jacob {the second son} rather than Esau! Genesis 25:30-34

Both of them knew very well that the promise of being the ancestor of the Messiah {Christ} belongs to the first born son of the family, but Esau dispises these spiritual heritage while Jacob really treasure it in his heart!

Remember Jesus' illustration of the man who found a piece of land that's of great value, went and sold all that he had only to by that land! Matthew 13:44

Jesus is God's representative in the flesh so whatever Jesus tells us is exactly how God feels inside! John 1:18

God whose undivided attention is focused on the lineage that will bring about the Messiah could say in advance that Isaac's second son is his choice!

Apart from that lineage and anyone having to do with s pure worship, it's God's angels that makes report of what's happening there to him {Genesis 18:20-21} because he has taken his mind away from them since they'll not bring him joy! Genesis 6:5-6

So he is NOT predestining all humans on earth as the Churches taught people Sir, his main focus was on the one and only race that will produce the Messiah! Luke 3:23-38

am talking about divine calls you are talking about seeking kingdom of God are they not different from each other?what's Mathew 13vs44 has to do with divine call? jw you need Christ not unscriptural journals!

jcross19:
then what about Isaiah 49 vs 1-2 , Jeremiah 1vs1-6 ? and 1peter 2:9 I quoted before? abi that verse is not part of bible? funny if you don't believe that, that does not mean there is no divine call! you are spiritual empty that's why you are talking like a kid I have given quotations backing my point. now there is no where in the bible where God says He chooses Jacob because he treasure the spiritual heritage abi what do you call it self. I laugh again! so are you telling me that Jacob and Esau have decided their believes from womb is that what you are saying? back your point up with bible verses. don't come post that your unwise journals here.

Because someone disagreed with you doesn't make us enemies Sir, and it's not a reason to be annoyed with your neighbour!
One thing we both shared is the believe in a Creator who have the power to reward those who put their trust in him.
So if our differences is just this predestination issue, then we need to trash it out mildly and succinctly not grudgingly.

Our own believe is that God doesn't predestine all of us before birth. Granted he foretold what will happen to those having to do with his plans, and of course he is able to foretell things before it occurred but that doesn't mean he does that always. He began doing so immediately after Adam and Eve had sinned! Genesis 3:15

To illustrate, imagine a builder who has great architectural designs in his plans, during the construction he noticed that some workers have other plans apart from what he employed them to do.
So he went into his closet and brought out his telescope, surely you can't expect him to gaze anywhere else apart from his wonderful design which he had in mind to bring to reality!
In the same manner, God is that builder {Hebrews 3:4} the heavens and earth are his wonderful masterpiece, the workers are his children both angels and faithful humans, the selfish workers are Satan, demons and disobedient humans.
While he had good plans to make sure that all his creatures live in Paradise and faithful humans are working hard with him to actualise this wonderful purpose, selfish and disobedient creatures are making things difficult for his loyal ones. That's why he brought out his telescope {power to foresee the outcome of things from afar} but his focus is on his plans and only those having to do with his plans, whether they're contributing to it's success or opposing it!

Maximus69:


Because someone disagreed with you doesn't make us enemies Sir, and it's not a reason to be annoyed with your neighbour!
One thing we both shared is the believe in a Creator who have the power to reward those who put their trust in him.
So if our differences is just this predestination issue, then we need to trash it out mildly and succinctly not grudgingly.

Our own believe is that God doesn't predestine all of us before birth. Granted he foretold what will happen to those having to do with his plans, and of course he is able to foretell things before it occurred but that doesn't mean he does that always. He began doing so immediately after Adam and Eve had sinned! Genesis 3:15

To illustrate, imagine a builder who has great architectural designs in his plans, during the construction he noticed that some workers have other plans apart from what he employed them to do.
So he went into his closet and brought out his telescope, surely you can't expect him to gaze anywhere else apart from his wonderful design which he had in mind to bring to reality!
In the same manner, God is that builder {Hebrews 3:4} the heavens and earth are his wonderful masterpiece, the workers are his children both angels and faithful humans, the selfish workers are Satan, demons and disobedient humans.
While he had good plans to make sure that all his creatures live in Paradise and faithful humans are working hard with him to actualise this wonderful purpose, selfish and disobedient creatures are making things difficult for his loyal ones. That's why he brought out his telescope {power to foresee the outcome of things from afar} but his focus is on his plans and only those having to do with his plans, whether they're contributing to it's success or opposing it!

now are you telling me that some bible verses are not true?

jcross19:
am talking about divine calls you are talking about seeking kingdom of God are they not different from each other?what's Mathew 13vs44 has to do with divine call? jw you need Christ not unscriptural journals!

Well Matthew 13:44 is surely about God's Kingdom and that promise is what made Jacob bought the birth right from Esau who dispises the heritage of having to do with Jesus {the main man through whom God's Kingdom will be made possible}

So i was talking about why God said he preferred Jacob and i said it's because he treasured Spiritual heritage just like the man in Jesus illustration!

Maximus69:


Well Matthew 13:44 is surely about God's Kingdom and that promise is what made Jacob bought the birth right from Esau who dispises the heritage of having to do with Jesus {the main man through whom God's Kingdom will be made possible}

So i was talking about why God said he preferred Jacob and i said it's because he treasured Spiritual heritage just like the man in Jesus illustration!

ah there is no where in the bible it was stated like that! if you can show it to me then I believe you! I have given you quotations backing my divine call point can you show a quotations too that counter it that's all let's examine it.

jcross19:
now are you telling me that some bible verses are not true?

All scriptures is inspired of the one and only true God! 2Timothy 3:16

So everything you find in his word is TRUE but if you don't allow scripture to interpret scripture you'll be making it sound as if the Bible contradicts itself!

That's why every believer need the accurate knowledge of God's word! Romans 10:2-3

Maximus69:


All scriptures is inspired of the one and only true God! 2Timothy 3:16

So everything you find in his word is TRUE but if you don't allow scripture to interpret scripture you'll be making it sound as if the Bible contradicts itself!

That's why every believer need the accurate knowledge of God's word! Romans 10:2-3

Isaiah 49:1-2and Jeremiah 1:1-6 can you explain it to me?

PastorAIO:
I think that I have just learned something gbnew about JWs, that is that Predestination or having a Divinely appointed Purpose is not a part of their doctrine and that they oppose it vehemently.

NO! NO!! NO!!!

We believe in divine calling Sir, but what we opposed is the inaccurate information that's spread abroad by misinformed Churchgoers!

For instance, God often call people directly and give them a mission but he doesn't just call anyone, he looks at their virtuous attributes {Genesis 6:9} this will help the audience at least to some extent. If the person has questionable lifestyle it will hinder honesthearted and sincere persons to accept what such a person says! John 4:18 compared to verse 42

But all that came to an end after Jesus offered his perfect life on our behalf, now God only speak through Jesus {Hebrews 1:1-2} who educated Christians on God's plans for the future.
And after the completion of the Bible, God will never again speak through someone who is NOT a baptised Christian!
So we Jehovah's Witnesses will never agree that someone who has nothing to do with God's word {Jesus} could speak from God! Remember that Jesus is the word according to Apostle John, whoever despises God's word or ridicules those who treasure it can never receive any divine calling!
Moreover the Bible is now complete, so there's no more addiction or subtraction to what God has to say, everything is completed in his word the Bible! Revelation 22:18-19

jcross19:
Isaiah 49:1-2and Jeremiah 1:1-6 can you explain it to me?

These men are part of God's chosen race{Abraham's lineage}
What God said is clear!

I know you guys more than you know yourself, so as part of my chosen race i can boldly say you're qualified for this job i'm about to give you!

If you read through the books you will understand why God said this before commissioning these faithful men, along the lines both of them came to find out that it's not that easy delivering God's warning message before people with crooked minds! Jeremiah 20:7-11

Notice what Jeremiah said about God: "you have deceived me!" Jeremiah 20:7

Why did he say so? Well he became confused due to all the intimidation he receives each time he tried to deliver God's messages!

So he's now wondering, but you said you ordained me from my mother's womb, is it to suffer like this in the hands of this crooked people?

But at verse 9 he said God's word is like a burning fire in his minds so he can't help it but to speak out!

Surely the true God knows those he is sending to deliver his messages much more than they knew themselves!

Maximus69:


These men are part of God's chosen race{Abraham's lineage}
What God said is clear!

I know you guys more than you know yourself, so as part of my chosen race i can boldly say you're qualified for this job i'm about to give you!

If you read through the books you will understand why God said this before commissioning these faithful men, along the lines both of them came to find out that it's not that easy delivering God's warning message before people with crooked minds! Jeremiah 20:7-11

Notice what Jeremiah said about God: "you have deceived me!" Jeremiah 20:7

Why did he say so? Well he became confused due to all the intimidation he receives each time he tried to deliver God's messages!

So he's now wondering, but you said you ordained me from my mother's womb, is it to suffer like this in the hands of this crooked people?

But at verse 9 he said God's word is like a burning fire in his minds so he can't help it but to speak out!

Surely the true God knows those he is sending to deliver his messages much more than they knew themselves!

[b]

Maximus69:


These men are part of God's chosen race{Abraham's lineage}
What God said is clear!

I know you guys more than you know yourself, so as part of my chosen race i can boldly say you're qualified for this job i'm about to give you!

If you read through the books you will understand why God said this before commissioning these faithful men, along the lines both of them came to find out that it's not that easy delivering God's warning message before people with crooked minds! Jeremiah 20:7-11

Notice what Jeremiah said about God: "you have deceived me!" Jeremiah 20:7

Why did he say so? Well he became confused due to all the intimidation he receives each time he tried to deliver God's messages!

So he's now wondering, but you said you ordained me from my mother's womb, is it to suffer like this in the hands of this crooked people?

But at verse 9 he said God's word is like a burning fire in his minds so he can't help it but to speak out!

Surely the true God knows those he is sending to deliver his messages much more than they knew themselves!

[/b]

Maximus69:


These men are part of God's chosen race{Abraham's lineage}
What God said is clear!

I know you guys more than you know yourself, so as part of my chosen race i can boldly say you're qualified for this job i'm about to give you!

If you read through the books you will understand why God said this before commissioning these faithful men, along the lines both of them came to find out that it's not that easy delivering God's warning message before people with crooked minds! Jeremiah 20:7-11

Notice what Jeremiah said about God: "you have deceived me!" Jeremiah 20:7

Why did he say so? Well he became confused due to all the intimidation he receives each time he tried to deliver God's messages!

So he's now wondering, but you said you ordained me from my mother's womb, is it to suffer like this in the hands of this crooked people?

But at verse 9 he said God's word is like a burning fire in his minds so he can't help it but to speak out!

Surely the true God knows those he is sending to deliver his messages much more than they knew themselves!

your last statement have shown that God do send people to deliver his message meaning before God send you , He might have chosen for the mission? now check Isaiah 45vs 15 to 19 there God is talking king Cyrus who was not even an Israelite but was chosen by God to carry out God's task! sir like I have said some people have divine call but due to they have not seen the light the real mandate have not been materialized .

jcross19:
your last statement have shown that God do send people to deliver his message meaning before God send you , He might have chosen for the mission? now check Isaiah 45vs 15 to 19 there God is talking king Cyrus who was not even an Israelite but was chosen by God to carry out God's task! sir like I have said some people have divine call but due to they have not seen the light the real mandate have not been materialized .

Cyrus is totally a pagan with whom God had no divine dealing!

But as i've told you let scripture interpret scripture, don't just conclude on an idea after reading few passages.

Think about what Jesus said regarding ascension to heaven, it was recorded that Enoch was taken and Elijah went to heaven in a chariot. Anyone could easily conclude that these faithful men have gone to heaven, but Jesus who came from heaven declared publicly that no man has been to heaven apart from himself {who is now living as a man} that came from heaven! John 3:13

It's confusing right?
It's later that the born again sons of God revealed that it's impossible for flesh and blood to go to heaven because only spirits lives there! 1Corinthians 15:43-44 compared to Luke 20:35-36

So where is Enoch and Elijah?

Well let's live that for now and focus on the issue raised.

God's people will be enslaved because of their idolatrous deeds, they will suffer in the hands of a pagan nation and because of God's promise that the Messiah will come through them, they'll still return to their land. But if a world power like mighty Babylonian empire seizes them, how are they going to return and build the shattered temple that's to be destroyed by the Babylonians?
Another world power must issue that order for God's people to return and continue as a nation until the arrival of the Messiah. That's why God foretold that another world power in the person of Cyrus will conquer Babylon and free his people to return home.

Don't forget what i told you from the onset, God only focus on his own plans regarding the Salvation of mankind, and Jerusalem is very very significant in this arrangement! Cyrus happened to be that world ruler who will give that order to restore pure worship in Jerusalem, but did he join the worshippers there? NO!
So he couldn't have been a REAL servant of God because his PERSIA kingdom has nothing to do with pure worship!
But as soon as the nation of Israel rejected Jesus, he told his faithful followers to forget about Jerusalem and it's Temple because it will be destroyed again and the Jews will be dispassed to all foreign lands never to be assembled again as a nation! Matthew 23:37-38

Maximus69:


Cyrus is totally a pagan with whom God had no divine dealing!

But as i've told you let scripture interpret scripture, don't just conclude on an idea after reading few passages.

Think about what Jesus said regarding ascension to heaven, it was recorded that Enoch was taken and Elijah went to heaven in a chariot. Anyone could easily conclude that these faithful men have gone to heaven, but Jesus who came from heaven declared publicly that no man has been to heaven apart from himself {who is now living as a man} that came from heaven! John 3:13

It's confusing right?
It's later that the born again sons of God revealed that it's impossible for flesh and blood to go to heaven because only spirits lives there! 1Corinthians 15:43-44 compared to Luke 20:35-36

So where is Enoch and Elijah?

Well let's live that for now and focus on the issue raised.

God's people will be enslaved because of their idolatrous deeds, they will suffer in the hands of a pagan nation and because of God's promise that the Messiah will come through them, they'll still return to their land. But if a world power like mighty Babylonian empire seizes them, how are they going to return and build the shattered temple that's to be destroyed by the Babylonians?
Another world power must issue that order for God's people to return and continue as a nation until the arrival of the Messiah. That's why God foretold that another world power in the person of Cyrus will conquer Babylon and free his people to return home.

Don't forget what i told you from the onset, God only focus on his own plans regarding the Salvation of mankind, and Jerusalem is very very significant in this arrangement! Cyrus happened to be that world ruler who will give that order to restore pure worship in Jerusalem, but did he join the worshippers there? NO!
So he couldn't have been a REAL servant of God because his PERSIA kingdom has nothing to do with pure worship!
But as soon as the nation of Israel rejected Jesus, he told his faithful followers to forget about Jerusalem and it's Temple because it will be destroyed again and the Jews will be dispassed to all foreign lands never to be assembled again as a nation! Matthew 23:37-38

when you commission to carry out a task that's divine call from God either good or bad now Cyrus was called for mandate , who ordained him for that assignment God! You are moving in circle.

jcross19:
when you commission to carry out a task that's divine call from God either good or bad now Cyrus was called for mandate , who ordained him for that assignment God! You are moving in circle.

You're missing the mark Sir!

Cyrus actually did something in favour of pure worship because God touched his heart for God's plans to work out!

But did Cyrus join in worshipping the most high God in Jerusalem? NO!

For instance, something similar happened here in Nigeria almost 40 years ago, God's true worshipers came under attack as a military ruler ordered that every Nigerian must recite the Anthem, it became a problem for God's people and Nigeria is the world's most populous black nation. If pure worship come under attack in Nigeria, most African nations may join in doing the same and it will become a big problem for God's people to continue worshipping God in Nigeria!

Despite all their well arranged orderliness back then, this military ruler was overthrown by another military ruler and immediately that order was cancelled!

Most people later started cursing the one who cancelled that order because he later committed many atrocities but none of them realized that God used him to free his people from the hands of Satan's agents who would have caused a great problem for pure worship to continue flourishing in Africa.

God's kingdom has not yet come, and this military ruler is no more in power today, but he is the one and only military leader who left office willingly appointing an interim government. He is still alive till today while all those who were attacking him for all his atrocities back then are gone. But is he one of the worshippers of the true God? NO! NO!! NO!!!

Yet God used him to deliver his people in 1985!