Yujin:

I'm proudly Igbo but not in severe pain over dispelling the false narrative your likes have been trying to perpetuate. I'll celebrate Oyos achievements if they really had been able to have such an empire you're trying to paint. I still marvel at those rock carvings of humans found somewhere in Kwara state(can't remember the exact name of the town) and I believe that was one of the achievements under Oyo Kingdom. An empire is a different ball game. Simply put; for a kingdom to graduate into an empire, it most have vassal states of other people not of the same stock like the conquerors. The influence will be thorough such that it will affect the form of governance of the vassal states. For instances, during the peak period of the Israeli kingdom under David/Solomon, some nations were paying tributes to David/Solomon yet the Israelis never had an empire. Do you know why? Go study and find out for yourself. The Assyrians, Babylonian, Greeks, Persians, Romans, Byzantine, Turks, Benins had empires because they consolidated their victories in the domains they defeated militarily. Did Oyo consolidate any of their victories? If they did, can you share such stories here for our consummation and conviction?

Which part of my mention said Oyo empire was as large as Roman Empire ?

And why is that no one knew of igbos pre independence

We all knew edo
We all knew even Kanuri
We all knew nupe
We even knew Ashante
We all knew Dahomey
Everyone knew yorubas as Oyo then
But for whatever reasons no one knew igbos
Not a single achievement in your civilization


Till today you see Benin And Yoruba arts scattered all around the world but we don’t see as much Igbo presence

Could your lack of history be the reason you loath and enjoy watering down Yoruba history so much

In your mind your like how dare them have it and we don’t

The only history of igbos was onitsha which was founded by the Edos till date your king holds a Benin sword

Oba of Lagos once a vassal of edo stop paying tribute and the defeat of Benin by British ended his influence for Good

Yujin:

I'm proudly Igbo but not in severe pain over dispelling the false narrative your likes have been trying to perpetuate. I'll celebrate Oyos achievements if they really had been able to have such an empire you're trying to paint. I still marvel at those rock carvings of humans found somewhere in Kwara state(can't remember the exact name of the town) and I believe that was one of the achievements under Oyo Kingdom. An empire is a different ball game. Simply put; for a kingdom to graduate into an empire, it most have vassal states of other people not of the same stock like the conquerors. The influence will be thorough such that it will affect the form of governance of the vassal states. For instances, during the peak period of the Israeli kingdom under David/Solomon, some nations were paying tributes to David/Solomon yet the Israelis never had an empire. Do you know why? Go study and find out for yourself. The Assyrians, Babylonian, Greeks, Persians, Romans, Byzantine, Turks, Benins had empires because they consolidated their victories in the domains they defeated militarily. Did Oyo consolidate any of their victories? If they did, can you share such stories here for our consummation and conviction?

Have you read on Dahomey or you choose not to see it can’t you see the map covers all of Benin republic of today and a portion of Togo

Are you aware the Oyos defeated the ashantis of Ghana


Let’s even forget history

Let’s focus on independent Nigeria
Yorubas built up Ibadan to become the largest and most prosperous city in Africa
At its peak it had the tallest building in subsaharan Africa
First television station

Today we have built Lagos from federal capital to the economic capital of west Africa

We have made our language and culture the popular image of Nigeria

Is it a coincidence Afro beats is basically Yoruba based !?

See when it comes to building civilization Yorubas do it with ease

I pray eventually Nigeria breaks up so Yorubas will be by themselves alone

I look forward to the day all the Yoruba territories are in west Africa will unite under a nation and watch how we will transform the african landscape

We got education and enlightenment before the South Koreans but look at them today

Omoodua007:


Wonderful then you should know the exploits of Oyo empire
And it peak it subjugated an entire tribe
Even Benin was not as powerful nor did it last as long as Oyo empire.

It collapsed and it’s people today have been reduced to prostitution in Italy

The Yoruba land occupied by edo has now been reunited under its kiths and Kin and are way ahead of the edo lol

Infact a Yoruba man in the name of awolowo went ahead to rule over edo lol

Are we going to talk about how Biafra razed edo in a week and it took the same Oyo empire descendants to liberate them Lool

Now you are facing me as an edo person


Awolowo what !!!

It took an edo man to liberate you all from the britsh yes Anthony enawohro

Edo was the war zone in the civil war ,there was no empire or know existing kingdom who they fought so literally biafrans defeated nigerian soldiers in edo state

Our people are into prostitution it is better than skull mining

How we going to talk how edo man ruled yorubaland as governors or the edo kings in yorubalands that are still rulling till date

Or tge oduduwa we gave ife and became yoruba most respected king

Or

The yam fesrivals we gave the yoruba people and they are still practising it today

Or
.the edo coral red beeds that all the yoruba kings are wearing ,

Atleast you yorubas should be gatefull to edos for selling some of you off as slaves to the whitemen

If edo had the population as yorubas the north wouldn't even smell power and the country wouldnt be like this

Omoodua007:



Which part of my mention said Oyo empire was as large as Roman Empire ?

And why is that no one knew of igbos pre independence

We all knew edo
We all knew even Kanuri
We all knew nupe
We even knew Ashante
We all knew Dahomey
Everyone knew yorubas as Oyo then
But for whatever reasons no one knew igbos
Not a single achievement in your civilization


Till today you see Benin And Yoruba arts scattered all around the world but we don’t see as much Igbo presence

Could your lack of history be the reason you loath and enjoy watering down Yoruba history so much

In your mind your like how dare them have it and we don’t

The only history of igbos was onitsha which was founded by the Edos till date your king holds a Benin sword

Oba of Lagos once a vassal of edo stop paying tribute and the defeat of Benin by British ended his influence for Good

Lol. I thought you're grounded in history you're trying to push but now I see you're just bored seeking for attention. Did I mention size in my analogies? The Benin Empire I mentioned; is it big? NO! So where does size come into place. I overestimated your mental capacity. Accept my apologies.
As for Igbos not having an empire, I'm very proud of that too because it proved that we are not naturally oppressive people. There's no shame in that. This is why we have lots of minority tribes around us despite our size. Our philosophy doesn't allow us to engage in such ventures. We're just like the Indians(hindus) in this case. The only group of Igbos to the best of my knowledge whose influence transcended the Igbo area are the Nris. There influence went into both Igala and Benin areas and majority of other Igbo areas. They never believed in violence. That's the basic Igbo philosophy and we're proud of that. The question you should ask is why then we weren't conquered by any of the surrounding Empire(Benin) or kingdom(Igala). This is because we resisted all their attempts. Benin tried their best but were always checked by our Anioma people. The Igalas tried and we're equally checked by our Nsukka people. But see the level of Yorubaland that the Benin controlled. Lol. From Ondo, Ekiti and parts of Osun up to Eko. That should tell you what stuff the Igbos are made of.
As for Onitsha, the story is clear that it was reverse migration. Any similarity with Benin you see in Onitcha was copied by Igbo returnees. Was Onitcha ever a vassal of Benin? Was Ezechima a Benin Prince? Who was his father?
You see Igbos have always been a liberal people who welcomed all sorts of people but once you bring conquest to them, you'll face die hards. Most run away Edo people settled among Igbos in Anioma. Some Igalas brought war to Igbo areas and were defeated and assimilated eventually. Others simply migrated and integrated into Igbo areas even deep into Aguata areas of Anambra State were you ordinarily shouldn't find them as they mostly operated around the River Niger banks. The Olukumis migrated into Anioma and were welcomed. That's how accommodating we were but weren't conquered by any one. Only the British succeeded but we still gave them headache and were more vociferous in them leaving Nigeria. That's Igbo for you.
Finally, I don't engage in any dick measuring contest that ignorant folks like you do here on Nairaland. Oyo was never an empire. They probably were very strong at their peak period but never assumed an empire status as you would want us to believe.

gregyboy:



Now you are facing me as an edo person


Awolowo what !!!

It took an edo man to liberate you all from the britsh yes Anthony enawohro

Edo was the war zone in the civil war ,there was no empire or know existing kingdom who they fought so literally biafrans defeated nigerian soldiers in edo state

Our people are into prostitution it is better than skull mining

How we going to talk how edo man ruled yorubaland as governors or the edo kings in yorubalands that are still rulling till date

Or tge oduduwa we gave ife and became yoruba most respected king

Or

The yam fesrivals we gave the yoruba people and they are still practising it today

Or
.the edo coral red beeds that all the yoruba kings are wearing ,

Atleast you yorubas should be gatefull to edos for selling some of you off as slaves to the whitemen

If edo had the population as yorubas the north wouldn't even smell power and the country wouldnt be like this

Nope it’s vice versa
Your king is an egiso
Why did you people adopt oba a Yoruba word
Even iya oba is a Yoruba word
An Oyo prince oranmiyan usurped power from egiso and till today his linage still rules over Benin

Till today you see Benins bearing Yoruba names
Adesuwa , Dele momudu

We gave you AC, ACN
We gave you Obaseki & Oshiomole
Lol the first person your new oba of Benin came to visit was ooni of Ife

I’m going to give it to Benin they tried they occupied lower sections of ondo all the way to Lagos Island and stretched all the way past onitsha where they traded igbos as slaves . Unlike the Fulanis who impose Islam they operated a tributary model

And who gave you the delusion yam festival is an edo affair lol it’s celebrated all across west Africa



However in terms of duration of existence and continuity they didn’t meet up with the Yorubas
Benin has now been reduced to 4 local governments
Where as Yorubas still occupy 8 states in Nigeria
Lower ondo and Lagos back then is the kwara of today for Yorubas

Anthony enahoro that left ncnc to avoid Igbo domination by Azikwe is the one your saying came to liberate us loooool
Was it not awolowo that gave you free Education
Till today in Niger delta
Edo and delta stands out
Even the igbos of delta still enjoy the Yoruba leadership effect some of the most succesful Igbo men are delta igbos Tony E.and Jim Ovia

We gave you our cocoa wealth to liberate yourselves but Italy has taking over
The entire Europe now relates ancient Benin with international trafficking

At least skull mining is a local affair

And no edo man rules an inch of Yoruba land in present !

Yujin:

Lol. I thought you're grounded in history you're trying to push but now I see you're just bored seeking for attention. Did I mention size in my analogies? The Benin Empire I mentioned; is it big? NO! So where does size come into place. I overestimated your mental capacity. Accept my apologies.
As for Igbos not having an empire, I'm very proud of that too because it proved that we are not naturally oppressive people. There's no shame in that. This is why we have lots of minority tribes around us despite our size. Our philosophy doesn't allow us to engage in such ventures. We're just like the Indians(hindus) in this case. The only group of Igbos to the best of my knowledge whose influence transcended the Igbo area are the Nris. There influence went into both Igala and Benin areas and majority of other Igbo areas. They never believed in violence. That's the basic Igbo philosophy and we're proud of that. The question you should ask is why then we weren't conquered by any of the surrounding Empire(Benin) or kingdom(Igala). This is because we resisted all their attempts. Benin tried their best but were always checked by our Anioma people. The Igalas tried and we're equally checked by our Nsukka people. But see the level of Yorubaland that the Benin controlled. Lol. From Ondo, Ekiti and parts of Osun up to Eko. That should tell you what stuff the Igbos are made of.
As for Onitsha, the story is clear that it was reverse migration. Any similarity with Benin you see in Onitcha was copied by Igbo returnees. Was Onitcha ever a vassal of Benin? Was Ezechima a Benin Prince? Who was his father?
You see Igbos have always been a liberal people who welcomed all sorts of people but once you bring conquest to them, you'll face die hards. Most run away Edo people settled among Igbos in Anioma. Some Igalas brought war to Igbo areas and were defeated and assimilated eventually. Others simply migrated and integrated into Igbo areas even deep into Aguata areas of Anambra State were you ordinarily shouldn't find them as they mostly operated around the River Niger banks. The Olukumis migrated into Anioma and were welcomed. That's how accommodating we were but weren't conquered by any one. Only the British succeeded but we still gave them headache and were more vociferous in them leaving Nigeria. That's Igbo for you.
Finally, I don't engage in any dick measuring contest that ignorant folks like you do here on Nairaland. Oyo was never an empire. They probably were very strong at their peak period but never assumed an empire status as you would want us to believe.

Looool dude onitsha was set up by edos to trade Igbo slaves better go and read your history even Jaja of

Benin’s influence only reached lower section of ondo and it was not until the fall of Oyo empire so you don’t have any empire and that was why Ojukwu attempted to build one during the civil war

Omoodua007:


Looool dude onitsha was set up by edos to trade Igbo slaves better go and read your history even Jaja of

Benin’s influence only reached lower section of ondo and it was not until the fall of Oyo empire so you don’t have any empire and that was why Ojukwu attempted to build one during the civil war

You see one thing I don't tolerate is outright lies. Which Benin traded in Onitsha? Who were they selling Igbo slaves to at Onitcha? Stop saying rubbish. Do you even know the groups that were trading at Onitcha as at then? Benin influence was only strong around the Ika area of Anioma. Even at that, Agbor gave Benin big problem. All the areas from Umunede down to Asaba had no kings and weren't any vassal to Benin, so how can Benin come down to Onitcha. Like I said, you know nothing about history. Lol. You even tried to mention Jaja of Opobo. Can you take a map of Southern Nigeria to see where Opobo is? Igbo slaves were traded at Calabar and Bonny ports. Go study before coming to argue with me.
Finally, what do you mean by 'lower Ondo'? Can you name specific areas so I can trash your lies with facts? Tell me the name of the areas Benin Empire controlled in Yorubaland.

Omoodua007:


Nope it’s vice versa
Your king is an egiso
Why did you people adopt oba a Yoruba word
Even iya oba is a Yoruba word
An Oyo prince oranmiyan usurped power from egiso and till today his linage still rules over Benin

Till today you see Benins bearing Yoruba names
Adesuwa , Dele momudu

We gave you AC, ACN
We gave you Obaseki & Oshiomole
Lol the first person your new oba of Benin came to visit was ooni of Ife

I’m going to give it to Benin they tried they occupied lower sections of ondo all the way to Lagos Island and stretched all the way past onitsha where they traded igbos as slaves . Unlike the Fulanis who impose Islam they operated a tributary model

And who gave you the delusion yam festival is an edo affair lol it’s celebrated all across west Africa



However in terms of duration of existence and continuity they didn’t meet up with the Yorubas
Benin has now been reduced to 4 local governments
Where as Yorubas still occupy 8 states in Nigeria
Lower ondo and Lagos back then is the kwara of today for Yorubas

Anthony enahoro that left ncnc to avoid Igbo domination by Azikwe is the one your saying came to liberate us loooool
Was it not awolowo that gave you free Education
Till today in Niger delta
Edo and delta stands out
Even the igbos of delta still enjoy the Yoruba leadership effect some of the most succesful Igbo men are delta igbos Tony E.and Jim Ovia
We gave you our cocoa wealth to liberate yourselves but Italy has taking over
The entire Europe now relates ancient Benin with international trafficking

At least skull mining is a local affair

And no edo man rules an inch of Yoruba land in present !

Our kings transcend its name during the beginning of a new era they changed from ogiso( sky kings) to oba
The word oba" spread its influence over yoruba territory because they were once vassals under the empire
If oromiyan truely brought the word oba" to benin were did he get it from the only known king in ife was ooni he should have installed himself ooni ,even the oromiyan we are talking about didnt even rule as a king in benin not to start saying he brought a foreign word to benin

Its simple the word oba had its origin to benin it simply got into yoruba lexicon because edo had influence over half of yoruba nation just the way prime minster got into different nations of the world because of British influence, yorubas have different words for kings and non used the word oba ,so you can conclude that by yourself now

Haha, the influenced people are now saying they influenced,
the conquered are now saying they influenced the conquerors, how can a conquered tribe still be bigoted to ask ,the owners of the words (adesuwa, oba) it like saying nigeria saying they own english or christanity because they became so advance than the britsh in the future years

You gave us what!!! Ac ,acn you must be high if not for oshiomole influence what would have become of apc today,
And the ooni came for oba coronation but oba didnt even go for his...lol ,he only went to tell all the kings thanks for thier respect for attending his coronation and nothing special about who he visited first....

Did you see the dignitries who came for our oba of benin coronation ,can you compare it to the watery one ooni had....lol
It was even rated amongst the most searched on that month, but no one heard about oonis coronation

Awolowo did what gave free education to edo you must be high ,ambrose ali was the person who gave both delta and edo free education....

Anthony enawohro fought and spoke out for us to be independence ,dele giwa who died speaking out for nigeria
Gen. George Agbazika Innih, who was one-time military governor of Bendel and Kwara State

. Aigboje Aig-Imoukhuede, cofounder of Access Bank Plc and founder of Africa Initiative for Governance (AIG)

John Momoh, Nigerian broadcast journalist and CEO of Channels TV


Are all these yorubas or influenced in anyway by them.... I keep saying it edo by population are very few even fewer than delta state but its influence are rated amongst the three big tribes imagine if we had the population

And a yoruba man has never ruled an inch in the present edo but edo are still ruling yorubas as kings as little as they are


Yam festival is not an african thing young man dont decieve yourself a quick goggle search will tell you is a nigerian thing Tue only africa country that popped up on the search is ghana probably it was a borrowed culture by Ghanian as a result of thier stay in nigeria at a time

gregyboy:

Jjjj



We gave you our cocoa wealth to liberate yourselves but Italy has taking over
The entire Europe now relates ancient Benin with international trafficking

At least skull mining is a local affair

And no edo man rules an inch of Yoruba land in present !

What about Oba Akiolu of Lagos? The only Oba in Yorubaland that doesn't wear a shirt as part of his kingship dressing.

Yujin:

You see one thing I don't tolerate is outright lies. Which Benin traded in Onitsha? Who were they selling Igbo slaves to at Onitcha? Stop saying rubbish. Do you even know the groups that were trading at Onitcha as at then? Benin influence was only strong around the Ika area of Anioma. Even at that, Agbor gave Benin big problem. All the areas from Umunede down to Asaba had no kings and weren't any vassal to Benin, so how can Benin come down to Onitcha. Like I said, you know nothing about history. Lol. You even tried to mention Jaja of Opobo. Can you take a map of Southern Nigeria to see where Opobo is? Igbo slaves were traded at Calabar and Bonny ports. Go study before coming to argue with me.
Finally, what do you mean by 'lower Ondo'? Can you name specific areas so I can trash your lies with facts? Tell me the name of the areas Benin Empire controlled in Yorubaland.

Lower ondo - coastal ondo region !
Why are you denying onitsha Benin roots even your king wears the beaded edo crown

Yujin:

What about Oba Akiolu of Lagos? The only Oba in Yorubaland that doesn't wear a shirt as part of his kingship dressing.

Your people operated a tributary model go and learn what that is
You appointed a Yoruba man to pay you tributes basically how British appointed local chiefs lol

Akiolu is not a Benin man

Omoodua007:



Lower ondo - coastal ondo region !
Why are you denying onitsha Benin roots even your king wears the beaded edo crown

I'm done with you. You clearly don't know history and you don't care to learn. Ordinary names of location you can't give. Let me just put it here to before I leave you to wallow in your ignorance. As at the early 19th century, Benin was controlling almost the entire eastern Yoruba land. This was why there was less information about those areas by early Yoruba historians. From Ekiti through Ondo down to Lagos. As for Onitsha, nothing like Benin root there only influences from travellers. Onitcha was at no point in time a vassal to Benin, nor did the Obi of Onitcha keep any contact with the Oba of Benin. If there's any proof to the contrary, state it here.

Omoodua007:


Your people operated a tributary model go and learn what that is
You appointed a Yoruba man to pay you tributes basically how British appointed local chiefs lol

Akiolu is not a Benin man

I'm Igbo not Benin or Edo.
Till date, Benin kings still rule in some Yoruba communities especially in Ondo and Lagos State. Tributaries were in some cases, while in others, sons of the soil were made kings. In Idoani, the son of Oba Ozolua still reigns as king.

Yujin:

What about Oba Akiolu of Lagos? The only Oba in Yorubaland that doesn't wear a shirt as part of his kingship dressing.

Am edo please school the guy

Yujin:

I'm Igbo not Benin or Edo.
Till date, Benin kings still rule in some Yoruba communities especially in Ondo and Lagos State. Tributaries were in some cases, while in others, sons of the soil were made kings. In Idoani, the son of Oba Ozolua still reigns as king.

Obasunloye is a Benin name ? And which inch of Lagos is ruled by Benin ?
Do you even know how Yoruba operates Obaship Loool no edo king rules any Yoruba sadly

I know it pains you how my thread about the great Oyo empire suddenly turned to looking for ways to degenerate Yorubas continue to choke on hate

Omoodua007:


Obasunloye is a Benin name ? And which inch of Lagos is ruled by Benin ?
Do you even know how Yoruba operates Obaship Loool no edo king rules any Yoruba sadly

I know it pains you how my thread about the great Oyo empire suddenly turned to looking for ways to degenerate Yorubas continue to choke on hate

Please rephrase

gregyboy:


Please rephrase

Hater ! Yorubaphobia kill you there

Omoodua007:


Looool dude onitsha was set up by edos to trade Igbo slaves better go and read your history even Jaja of

Benin’s influence only reached lower section of ondo and it was not until the fall of Oyo empire so you don’t have any empire and that was why Ojukwu attempted to build one during the civil war

Not even in your wildest dreams, Yorubaland was the only place in history it seems that the Benin were able to freely colonise stretches of land with impunity. In the height of the Benin empire’s expansion, most Igbos still did not know it existed. The densely populated and well-armed populations of Igboland ensured that attempts of invasion were limited to fringe communities.

Shiver99:


Not even in your wildest dreams, Yorubaland was the only place in history it seems that the Benin were able to freely colonise stretches of land with impunity. In the height of the Benin empire’s expansion, most Igbos still did not know it existed. The densely populated and well-armed populations of Igboland ensured that attempts of invasion were limited to fringe communities.

Loool
Can you explain why your king still holds edo blade till date and wears red beads

Omoodua007:


Hater ! Yorubaphobia kill you there

Lol....haha you got me laughing

.the only thing yoruba have is population

Omoodua007:


Loool
Can you explain why your king still holds edo blade till date and wears red beads

Yoruba kings also wore the red beads too

Omoodua007:


Loool
Can you explain why your king still holds edo blade till date and wears red beads

Sure. Red coral was introduced by Portuguese traders to Southern Nigeria, so trying to lay claim to it is laughable.
The oldest recorded use of beads in Nigeria is by the Igbo people, as many intricate and well-formed pieces of jewellery consisting of thousands of coloured beads, were found dating back to at least over a millenium ago.

Secondly, the Benin, despite attempts to invade igboland- one of the most fertile and populated places in west Africa-were not able to get past Agbor, so it's quite confusing how you think they could have gotten all the way to Onitsha. Even the Igala, in the height of their expansionism, were only able to conquer relatively smaller communities in Northern igboland such as Nzam, most Igbos were not even aware that that event happened.

Thirdly, the rise of Benin during the slave trade era ensured that many business-minded Igbos would be eager to trade with them. The same way that Igbos controlled trade routes between states in the cross river and delta that grew exponentially during the slave trade. This would have caused intercultural exchange. Igbos would have imported cultural aspects of these societies back to Igboland while the Igbos exported their own culture such as the Iguaro festival and calendar, the veneration of ala, Ikenga, etc, etc to the minority groups.

The most embarassing part of this thread, is the guy trying to mock Igbo for not invading and harassing hapless villagers in the name of building an 'empire". Igbos are not empire builders, it is a source of great pride for them and an emblem of their democratic spirit.

Igbos in the past, despite being one of the major targets of the slave trade, numbered in the millions, while the minorities around them numbered in the thousands. Despite living in segmented states and communities, Igbos in the past regularly formed alliances and contracts for mutual benefits, such as controlling trade routes, utilising iron ore deposits, etc, etc, so it would have been beyond easy to conquer all these lands.

However they did not, because firstly, they had not desire to. If we disregard the Igbo republican perspective; Igboland is one of the most fertile places in West Africa, they had no desire to expand to swamps in the south, or more arid and mountainous areas up north which were not be able to support large-scale farming.
Secondly, colonising groups introduces resentment and is not very long-lived approach. Igbos instead chose the smarter option of treaties, contracts and intermarriages which ensured long-lived prosperity for the two groups. Nearing the end of the slave trade era, in the most prosperous states in the delta, their elites either had Igbo ancestry and recent familial ties to communities deep in the Igbo hinterland or were Igbos themselves, and regularly and sometimes exclusively married with Igbos.
Thirdly, Igbos before the slave trade and even admiringly after it too, did not believe in senseless violence, and preferred to arrange formal trade agreements for access to resources, instead of massacring innocents.

Shiver99:


Sure. Red coral was introduced by Portuguese traders to Southern Nigeria, so trying to lay claim to it is laughable.
The oldest recorded use of beads in Nigeria is by the Igbo people, as many intricate and well-formed pieces of jewellery consisting of thousands of coloured beads, were found dating back to at least over a millenium ago.

Secondly, the Benin, despite attempts to invade igboland- one of the most fertile and populated places in west Africa-were not able to get past Agbor, so it's quite confusing how you think they could have gotten all the way to Onitsha. Even the Igala, in the height of their expansionism, were only able to conquer relatively smaller communities in Northern igboland such as Nzam, most Igbos were not even aware that that event happened.

Thirdly, the rise of Benin during the slave trade era ensured that many business-minded Igbos would be eager to trade with them. The same way that Igbos controlled trade routes between states in the cross river and delta that grew exponentially during the slave trade. This would have caused intercultural exchange. Igbos would have imported cultural aspects of these societies back to Igboland while the Igbos exported their own culture such as the Iguaro festival and calendar, the veneration of ala, Ikenga, etc, etc to the minority groups.

Another time

Shiver99:
The most embarassing part of this thread, is the guy trying to mock Igbo for not invading and harassing hapless villagers in the name of building an 'empire". Igbos are not empire builders, it is a source of great pride for them and an emblem of their democratic spirit.

Igbos in the past, despite being one of the major targets of the slave trade, numbered in the millions, while the minorities around them numbered in the thousands. Despite living in segmented states and communities, Igbos in the past regularly formed alliances and contracts for mutual benefits, such as controlling trade routes, utilising iron ore deposits, etc, etc, so it would have been beyond easy to conquer all these lands.

However they did not, because firstly, they had not desire to. If we disregard the Igbo republican perspective; Igboland is one of the most fertile places in West Africa, they had no desire to expand to swamps in the south, or more arid and mountainous areas up north which were not be able to support large-scale farming.
Secondly, colonising groups introduces resentment and is not very long-lived approach. Igbos instead chose the smarter option of treaties, contracts and intermarriages which ensured long-lived prosperity for the two groups. Nearing the end of the slave trade era, in the most prosperous states in the delta, their elites either had Igbo ancestry and recent familial ties to communities deep in the Igbo hinterland or were Igbos themselves, and regularly and sometimes exclusively married with Igbos.
Thirdly, Igbos before the slave trade and even admiringly after it too, did not believe in senseless violence, and preferred to arrange formal trade agreements for access to resources, instead of massacring innocents.

No one is calling you out for not invading others

The question is what was your Kingdom famous for
What did you trade in
Don’t intentionally misread me

What did you achieve on your own since you said you didn’t colonize anyone

What did you do what were you famous for etc
I see Yoruba and Benin arts everywhere but I don’t see Igbo arts

Omoodua007:



Another time

Erm...? I give up. What is this supposed to prove?
Does that guy look closer to Benin people (the first two pictures)or Nri people, centuries older than Benin? (last two pictures)

Just stop my guy. It's clear that you know nothing of Igbo history.

Omoodua007:


No one is calling you out for not invading others

The question is what was your Kingdom famous for
What did you trade in
Don’t intentionally misread me

What did you achieve on your own since you said you didn’t colonize anyone

What did you do what were you famous for etc
I see Yoruba and Benin arts everywhere but I don’t see Igbo arts

You're still here yapping senseless after you couldn't bring any proof of your empire claims. Are you not ashamed of yourself? You're here mentioning arts and demanding our own arts. Let me respond to that. Firstly, the notable Yoruba arts were the Ife works not the Oyo Kingdom. Nothing proves Oyos glory till date. No foot prints anywhere. No none Yoruba groups are practising any Yoruba festivals or bearing any insignia as a mark of Oyos one-time domination. For Igbos, our artworks are there too from the popular Igbo-Ukwu bronzes(the earliest of its kind in sub-saharan Africa) to the Nri Ivory Carvings. Our wood carvings are notable too.
As for trade, you can go and read up on Obi Ossai of Aboh(present day Ukwuani area of Delta state) and the palm oil plus other spices he traded with the British. He was heavily involved in slave trading and had to switch to agricultural produce after the British stopped the ignoble trade. I see that you've heard about King Jaja of Opobo but didn't know about him. He was a very smart business man who at a point controlled the trade at the lower Niger Delta after cutting off the Europeans from having to deal directly with the villagers and thus ensured that a more profitable bargain goes to the farmers. Majority of the agricultural produce traded at the Bonny port before and during the 19th century came from the hinterland (Igboland). The popular name 'Oil Rivers' was because of palm oil that came from Igboland. That the Nigerian educational system was silent on the historical feats of the Igbos doesn't mean that we had nothing. You can search the internet for all I wrote here.

Omoodua007:


No one is calling you out for not invading others

The question is what was your Kingdom famous for
What did you trade in
Don’t intentionally misread me

What did you achieve on your own since you said you didn’t colonize anyone

What did you do what were you famous for etc
I see Yoruba and Benin arts everywhere but I don’t see Igbo arts

There was never a time in recorded modern history that Igbos were under a single kingdom. Due to democracy in Igboland, families were free to, and sometimes encouraged to form their own independent communities without intimidation unlike other areas in west africa.

Anyway, if we disregard ancient history, where Igbos were one of the first to smelt iron in the world, and were also one of the first groups in West Africa, where we see signs of complex civilisation dating back to at least 2000BC, there are several notable things feats Igbos achieved later on history.

An example is the Igbo-Ukwu artefacts who some believed to have been created by Awka ( a town in historical Igboland famed for the skill of it's blacksmiths) artisans and gifted to 'Nri' people. At the time, the level of complexity and skill employed in making many of those artefacts were absent in most of Europe until centuries later. I am shocked that you are unaware of this as it was both hundreds of years older than those of Benin and Yoruba as well as more intricately made.

Shiver99:


Erm...? I give up. What is this supposed to prove?
Does that guy look closer to Benin people (the first two pictures)or Nri people, centuries older than Benin? (last two pictures)

Just stop my guy. It's clear that you know nothing of Igbo history.

He thinks when one criticizes his claims, that it is born out of hatred or jealousy. That's so petty. When one reads about the Asante and Benin Empires, one can see footprints that proves their achievements. It's simple! The capital of the so called Oyo empire was destroyed by a small Nupe army from the north while their southern encroachment into dahomey was dealt a fatal blow by female warriors. Is that one an empire? Abegi keep quiet.
Yorubas as a whole had some glory period where they excelled in arts and governance. I can see these from proofs that abound from the Ife bronzes and terracotta to the Esie soapstone carvings including their trades with their neighbours. However, building an Empire was never one of such. Stop dragging it further. I'm done with you.

Igbos have the most unique settlement pattern and style of government in the West African region and It is clear by the unsubtle jabs you have been directing at Igbos throughout the thread that you do not understand it.

That's alright, many Igbos still struggle to understand the blind obeisance some other Nigerians had to their leaders to the point of almost worshipping them as gods, which Igbos historically considered rather primitive; especially compared to their republican societies.

The Benin and Yoruba had great civilisations throughout history. So did the Igbos. Ignorance of Igbo history doesn't make this stop being the truth.
So it's peculiar that attempt to create lies and post ignorant statements about Igbo people, to try and make your group look better. It is actually quite strange to be honest.

Yujin:
I always laugh when I hear or see someone talking about Oyo Empire. Traces of an empire is always visible as can be seen in Benin Empire, Songhai Empire, Roman Empire etc. For Oyo, there's no credible facts just conjectures. I challenge anyone to name 4 non-Yoruba ethnic groups that were subsumed by the Oyos. That of Benins is clear to all. From the Akoko areas to Ondo proper and parts of Ekiti even Lagos Island to some parts of Anioma and majority part of Delta state to the remaining part of Edo state, the Benins footprint can be seen. For the Oyos, where are the footprints? Oyo could have been a great Kingdom who troubled their neighbours to the West but never succeeded in emerging as a strong Empire where they exert their influence to last for long.

The kingdom of Dahomey was conquered by and paid tribute to Oyo up until the 19th century. So was the kingdom of Weme, and a number of other polities in present day Benin Republic.

Within Nigeria, parts of Nupe and Bariba paid tribute to Oyo until they took advantage of political problems in Oyo-Ile to revolt in the 1780s and 1790s.

Also, an empire doesn't neccessarily have to consist of different linguistic groups to qualify as an empire. A political state built up by conquest of formerly autonomous political units that pays tribute to the conquering sovereign is an empire. This is why Japan is an empire despite the fact that everyone in the empire is Japanese. That is also why the Holy Roman Empire was an empire even at the time when the empire only consisted of German-speaking peoples.

So, even if Oyo never conquered the Aja peoples of Dahomey, it would still be accurate to reckon it as an empire since the Egba and the Egbado who paid tribute to the Alaafin were distinct cultural units from the Oyo, despite also being Yoruba.

RedboneSmith:



The kingdom of Dahomey was conquered by and paid tribute to Oyo up until the 19th century. So was the kingdom of Weme, and a number of other polities in present day Benin Republic.

Within Nigeria, parts of Nupe and Bariba paid tribute to Oyo until they took advantage of political problems in Oyo-Ile to revolt in the 1780s and 1790s.

Also, an empire doesn't neccessarily have to consist of different linguistic groups to qualify as an empire. A political state built up by conquest of formerly autonomous political units that pays tribute to the conquering sovereign is an empire. This is why Japan is an empire despite the fact that everyone in the empire is Japanese. That is also why the Holy Roman Empire was an empire even at the time when the empire only consisted of German-speaking peoples.

So, even if Oyo never conquered the Aja peoples of Dahomey, it would still be accurate to reckon it as an empire since the Egba and the Egbado who paid tribute to the Alaafin were distinct cultural units from the Oyo, despite also being Yoruba.

Nupe paid what big lie my friend

An emoire that was defeated by female warriors from dahomey ,how come we have yorubas in benin republic
Dahomey actually took them as slaves to thier land

Oyo is never an empire and stop rubbing shoulders with benin empire if not for the britsh we could extended to empire to whole of Nigeria