As a matter a fact the universe started without a God’s help.
Do we absolutely know what caused the Big Bang?
Do we know for absolutely sure this is not the only universe?
We do know how old it is if we work backward to the size it would have been a certain number of billions of years ago. If we could somehow go back the whole 13.8 billion years we might have an idea what caused it to expand the way which it did. We might also find out if anything was possibly here before the Big Bang.
We can with the information we do have prove that it didn’t happen in six days suddenly everything was here, and earth would nearly be the center of the universe.
But the problem with that is earth is 4.5 billion years old and the the universe is 13.8 billion years old. The universe existed like over 9 billion years longer than our side of the universe.
Humans have existed on earth what is it, 50 million years or something?
In the beginning god created the heavens and the earth. It reads like humans were first, except there were many creatures here way before we evolved. How does anyone believe what Christians call the good book or holy book, when there’s no accuracy to anything in it? It is true that the universe had a period of rapid expansion as it would take more than 13.8 billion years to reach out like what is it, 35 billion light years in every direction? Or is it more? This universe is huge and did from what some scientists say somehow expanded faster than anything can travel within it. Expanded into where I don’t know. If fact there’s a lot I have no idea about when it comes to this universe and those answers may never come either but the answers are not in the Holy Bible, the Christian bible. That piece of junk pretty much puts us as first and that’s just not true.
In fact I have only bits and pieces of an understanding of it all, and don’t believe it will all be discovered in my lifetime. Could get froze for awhile like Larry King says he wants cryogenically frozen. I don’t understand that one bit but at least we agree there’s probably no god, and nothing after death.
GodHead85: As a matter a fact the universe started without a God’s help.
Do we absolutely know what caused the Big Bang?
Do we know for absolutely sure this is not the only universe?
We do know how old it is if we work backward to the size it would have been a certain number of billions of years ago. If we could somehow go back the whole 13.8 billion years we might have an idea what caused it to expand the way which it did. We might also find out if anything was possibly here before the Big Bang.
We can with the information we do have prove that it didn’t happen in six days suddenly everything was here, and earth would nearly be the center of the universe.
But the problem with that is earth is 4.5 billion years old and the the universe is 13.8 billion years old. The universe existed like over 9 billion years longer than our side of the universe.
Humans have existed on earth what is it, 50 million years or something?
In the beginning god created the heavens and the earth. It reads like humans were first, except there were many creatures here way before we evolved. How does anyone believe what Christians call the good book or holy book, when there’s no accuracy to anything in it? It is true that the universe had a period of rapid expansion as it would take more than 13.8 billion years to reach out like what is it, 35 billion light years in every direction? Or is it more? This universe is huge and did from what some scientists say somehow expanded faster than anything can travel within it. Expanded into where I don’t know. If fact there’s a lot I have no idea about when it comes to this universe and those answers may never come either but the answers are not in the Holy Bible, the Christian bible. That piece of junk pretty much puts us as first and that’s just not true.
In fact I have only bits and pieces of an understanding of it all, and don’t believe it will all be discovered in my lifetime. Could get froze for awhile like Larry King says he wants cryogenically frozen. I don’t understand that one bit but at least we agree there’s probably no god, and nothing after death.
[/s]
Almighty Father, have Mercy on this mere creature!
When Destruction is pursuing people, you begin to see them do things as these..
GodHead85: As a matter a fact the universe started without a God’s help.
Do we absolutely know what caused the Big Bang?
Do we know for absolutely sure this is not the only universe?
We do know how old it is if we work backward to the size it would have been a certain number of billions of years ago. If we could somehow go back the whole 13.8 billion years we might have an idea what caused it to expand the way which it did. We might also find out if anything was possibly here before the Big Bang.
We can with the information we do have prove that it didn’t happen in six days suddenly everything was here, and earth would nearly be the center of the universe.
But the problem with that is earth is 4.5 billion years old and the the universe is 13.8 billion years old. The universe existed like over 9 billion years longer than our side of the universe.
Humans have existed on earth what is it, 50 million years or something?
In the beginning god created the heavens and the earth. It reads like humans were first, except there were many creatures here way before we evolved. How does anyone believe what Christians call the good book or holy book, when there’s no accuracy to anything in it? It is true that the universe had a period of rapid expansion as it would take more than 13.8 billion years to reach out like what is it, 35 billion light years in every direction? Or is it more? This universe is huge and did from what some scientists say somehow expanded faster than anything can travel within it. Expanded into where I don’t know. If fact there’s a lot I have no idea about when it comes to this universe and those answers may never come either but the answers are not in the Holy Bible, the Christian bible. That piece of junk pretty much puts us as first and that’s just not true.
In fact I have only bits and pieces of an understanding of it all, and don’t believe it will all be discovered in my lifetime. Could get froze for awhile like Larry King says he wants cryogenically frozen. I don’t understand that one bit but at least we agree there’s probably no god, and nothing after death.
GodHead85: Its a really disturbing trend i've come to observe on this website. Now i'm sort of an agnostic deist but i have many atheist friends in real life, and some that are much more anti-theistic. While I do agree with them on a variety of different fronts, I don't really understand the hate. I wouldn't say I hate religious people; I just don't agree with them on certain things. Isn't taking a militant approach towards anti-theism somewhat ineffective? From what I've seen, religious people tend to become even more anchored to their beliefs when you attack them, even if they are disproven from a logical standpoint. My solution is to simply educate these people, and let the information sink in until they contradict themselves. And as I've turned by debate style from a harder version to a softer, probing version, I've been able to have more productive discussions, even with religious people, simply because they are more willing to open up to their shortcomings as well.
THE NAME "GOD" HAS SEVERAL USES. 1. CONMEN USE IT TO MILK GULLIBLE PEOPLE. 2. YOU CAN USE IT GAIN SPECIAL FAVOURS. 3. YOU CAN DECEIVE MANY PEOPLE BY MENTIONING THE WORD. 4. YOU CAN CONSOLE FRAGILE PEOPLE WITH THE NAME, MAKE THEM HAVE HIGH HOPES ON SOMETHING ACTUALLY WORTHLESS.
GodHead85: As a matter a fact the universe started without a God’s help.
Do we absolutely know what caused the Big Bang?
Do we know for absolutely sure this is not the only universe?
We do know how old it is if we work backward to the size it would have been a certain number of billions of years ago. If we could somehow go back the whole 13.8 billion years we might have an idea what caused it to expand the way which it did. We might also find out if anything was possibly here before the Big Bang.
We can with the information we do have prove that it didn’t happen in six days suddenly everything was here, and earth would nearly be the center of the universe.
But the problem with that is earth is 4.5 billion years old and the the universe is 13.8 billion years old. The universe existed like over 9 billion years longer than our side of the universe.
Humans have existed on earth what is it, 50 million years or something?
In the beginning god created the heavens and the earth. It reads like humans were first, except there were many creatures here way before we evolved. How does anyone believe what Christians call the good book or holy book, when there’s no accuracy to anything in it? It is true that the universe had a period of rapid expansion as it would take more than 13.8 billion years to reach out like what is it, 35 billion light years in every direction? Or is it more? This universe is huge and did from what some scientists say somehow expanded faster than anything can travel within it. Expanded into where I don’t know. If fact there’s a lot I have no idea about when it comes to this universe and those answers may never come either but the answers are not in the Holy Bible, the Christian bible. That piece of junk pretty much puts us as first and that’s just not true.
In fact I have only bits and pieces of an understanding of it all, and don’t believe it will all be discovered in my lifetime. Could get froze for awhile like Larry King says he wants cryogenically frozen. I don’t understand that one bit but at least we agree there’s probably no god, and nothing after death.
It's so funny that someone created in God's image and likeness, would deny His existence.
It's so funny that someone created in God's image and likeness, would deny His existence.
WHAT'S FUNNY IS THAT THERE'S AN ONGOING BATTLE FOR GODS BETWEEN THOUSANDS OF RELIGIONS SPREAD OUT ACROSS REGIONS OF THE WORLD. EVERY HUMAN THINKS THE GOD HIS FAMILY RAISED HIM TO BELIEVE IS THE ONLY TRUE GOD. IT'S JESUS IN IBADAN, IT'S MJBOLT IN PAPAU NEW GUINEA, IT'S ALLAH IN MECCA, IT'S RAMA IN NEPAL. AND THE GODS THEMSELVES NEVER SHOW UP.
GodHead85: As a matter a fact the universe started without a God’s help.
Can you prove or even demonstrate that the universe started? Can you demonstrate it started without the help of God?
GodHead85: Do we absolutely know what caused the Big Bang?
Why would you assume the big bang had a cause?
GodHead85: Do we know for absolutely sure this is not the only universe?
Why would you assume this is the only universe? Why would you assume there is another universe?
GodHead85: We do know how old it is if we work backward to the size it would have been a certain number of billions of years ago. If we could somehow go back the whole 13.8 billion years we might have an idea what caused it to expand the way which it did. We might also find out if anything was possibly here before the Big Bang.
Size I wonder if that is even a relevant issue? Physics breaks down at Planck time. Are you sure anything called “size” would matter at all?
GodHead85: We can with the information we do have prove that it didn’t happen in six days suddenly everything was here, and earth would nearly be the center of the universe.
But the problem with that is earth is 4.5 billion years old and the the universe is 13.8 billion years old. The universe existed like over 9 billion years longer than our side of the universe.
Humans have existed on earth what is it, 50 million years or something?
13.8 billion years ago, you have no evidence at all, and you are still trying to find a cause. Why? Causality breaks down at the quantum level. Causality is relative to our existence in this universe here and now. That’s about all we can actually say. How do you know there was a “before” the big bang. If time is a product of our universe, how can there be a before? Christians believe their holy book because they can. Just like you believe the universe had a cause and want to set out looking for it.
GodHead85: In the beginning god created the heavens and the earth. It reads like humans were first, except there were many creatures here way before we evolved. How does anyone believe what Christians call the good book or holy book, when there’s no accuracy to anything in it? It is true that the universe had a period of rapid expansion as it would take more than 13.8 billion years to reach out like what is it, 35 billion light years in every direction? Or is it more? This universe is huge and did from what some scientists say somehow expanded faster than anything can travel within it. Expanded into where I don’t know. If fact there’s a lot I have no idea about when it comes to this universe and those answers may never come either but the answers are not in the Holy Bible, the Christian bible. That piece of junk pretty much puts us as first and that’s just not true.
In fact I have only bits and pieces of an understanding of it all, and don’t believe it will all be discovered in my lifetime. Could get froze for awhile like Larry King says he wants cryogenically frozen. I don’t understand that one bit but at least we agree there’s probably no god, and nothing after death.
The universe had a period of rapid expansion as far as we currently know. That does not mean it is “True.” It means the facts seem to lead us to this conclusion currently. You say this universe is huge? By whose standard? In a sea of universes it is but a grain of sand and it is no where near “Huge.”
I will accept the idea that as far as anyone can tell, there is no good evidence supporting the idea of any god that I have heard of. ------------------------- Godhead85, you have taken the position of an anti-theist, claiming a god does not exist. Good luck maintaining that position, which is untenable. In my opinion, a god or gods can not be proven or disproven.
CAPSLOCKED: THE NAME "GOD" HAS SEVERAL USES. 1. CONMEN USE IT TO MILK GULLIBLE PEOPLE. 2. YOU CAN USE IT GAIN SPECIAL FAVOURS. 3. YOU CAN DECEIVE MANY PEOPLE BY MENTIONING THE WORD. 4. YOU CAN CONSOLE FRAGILE PEOPLE WITH THE NAME, MAKE THEM HAVE HIGH HOPES ON SOMETHING ACTUALLY WORTHLESS.
IT'S ONLY USELESS AS A PERSONALITY.
Thanks Brother. You are one of the Few Sensible People that graced This Thread
Can you prove or even demonstrate that the universe started? Can you demonstrate it started without the help of God?
Can you? There’s pretty much No Evidence any Deity exists.
Why would you assume the big bang had a cause?
Well Something made it happen, but can either of us prove it was a god? I Believe asking the Question I asked is like asking (What’s The Meaning Of Life.)
Size I wonder if that is even a relevant issue? Physics breaks down at Planck time. Are you sure anything called “size” would matter at all?
Well, We do know The Universe is huge
13.8 billion years ago, you have no evidence at all, and you are still trying to find a cause. Why? Causality breaks down at the quantum level. Causality is relative to our existence in this universe here and now. That’s about all we can actually say.
Some scientists do say that’s How Old it is. And yes I would like to find a cause, something happened to cause it.
How do you know there was a “before” the big bang. If time is a product of our universe, how can there be a before?
There’s an After, so there could have been a Before
Christians believe their holy book because they can. Just like you believe the universe had a cause and want to set out looking for it.
True true true.
But I doubt with Everything in me a God did it.
The universe had a period of rapid expansion as far as we currently know. That does not mean it is “True.” It means the facts seem to lead us to this conclusion currently.,
Yes
You say this universe is huge? By whose standard? In a sea of universes it is but a grain of sand and it is no where near “Huge.”
It isn’t Small either as it would take Billions of Light Years to get to the other side. But in some aspects I guess you could call it Small
I will accept the idea that as far as anyone can tell, there is no good evidence supporting the idea of any god that I have heard of.
Can you? There’s pretty much No Evidence any Deity exists.
You are shifting the burden of proof. That is a fallacy. I don’t have to prove a damn thing. I am not the one making the claim.
GodHead85: Well Something made it happen, but can either of us prove it was a god?
Please understand this: Causality is a function of our universe. It breaks down in quantum physics. It breaks down at Planck time. Nothing has to have made anything happen.
GodHead85: I Believe asking the Question I asked is like asking (What’s The Meaning Of Life.)
What in the world makes you think, life has a meaning? It's like asking what is the meaning of rock, and that would be a very dense question. What's the meaning of your life, GodHead85? Could it be to come onto Nairaland and make inane assertions?
You are what you do. You are asking the wrong question. The meaning of life is what you make it out to be. “What is the meaning of your life?” You ascribe meanings to rocks. You ascribe meaning to life. You also ascribe meaning to your life. You do this actively or passively but you do it just the same.
You must be very delusional. We call the universe huge. We have absolutely nothing to compare our universe with to call it "big." Big compared to what?
GodHead85: Some scientists do say that’s How Old it is. And yes I would like to find a cause, something happened to cause it.
GodHead85: There’s an After, so there could have been a Before
More narrow minded bullshit. Can you tell me what is north of the North Pole?
Our personal experiences tell us that time flows like a river, in one way. But the crazy mind-Bleep you need to grasp is that if the universe began at the big bang, then time also began at that instant too. Before the big bang, it is possible time did not exist.
You can please demonstrate the methodology you used to rule out an eternal universe?
GodHead85: It isn’t Small either as it would take Billions of Light Years to get to the other side. But in some aspects I guess you could call it Small
That says nothing at all about the size of the universe and everything about our ability.
Yet here you are. You're still the one running your mouth and making all the unsubstantiated universe and god claims. I hope I wouldn't have to continue demonstrating the idiocy of your blind claims.
Before the big bang, it is possible time did not exist.
I loved it all except for the mild assertion.
If there was before big bang - and there must have been because something had to go bang - it would have had to exist in time or not exist at all, unless it was quantum physics, which the universe is not.
There was time. There were just no clocks marking it.
Now don't forget the laws of thermodynamics: matter can neither be created nor destroyed. It's scientists and atheists like you that propounded the law.
My question is, if truly matter can neither be created nor destroyed, as accepted worldwide, how come there was a big bang? What created the elements and compounds that resulted nto the big bang?
You are shifting the burden of proof. That is a fallacy. I don’t have to prove a damn thing. I am not the one making the claim.
Please understand this: Causality is a function of our universe. It breaks down in quantum physics. It breaks down at Planck time. Nothing has to have made anything happen.
What in the world makes you think, life has a meaning? It's like asking what is the meaning of rock, and that would be a very dense question. What's the meaning of your life, GodHead85? Could it be to come onto Nairaland and make inane assertions?
You are what you do. You are asking the wrong question. The meaning of life is what you make it out to be. “What is the meaning of your life?” You ascribe meanings to rocks. You ascribe meaning to life. You also ascribe meaning to your life. You do this actively or passively but you do it just the same.
You must be very delusional. We call the universe huge. We have absolutely nothing to compare our universe with to call it "big." Big compared to what?
More narrow minded bullshit. Can you tell me what is north of the North Pole?
Our personal experiences tell us that time flows like a river, in one way. But the crazy mind-Bleep you need to grasp is that if the universe began at the big bang, then time also began at that instant too. Before the big bang, it is possible time did not exist.
You can please demonstrate the methodology you used to rule out an eternal universe?
That says nothing at all about the size of the universe and everything about our ability.
Yet here you are. You're still the one running your mouth and making all the unsubstantiated universe and god claims. I hope I wouldn't have to continue demonstrating the idiocy of your blind claims.
Ok Madam So can We agree that if Gods can not be proven or disproven, Then a Soul would be able to be proved. As it is, There’s 0 Evidence that consciousness can exist outside the Brain. Therefore I see no reason to Believe that it can not be disproven either.
If there was before big bang - and there must have been because something had to go bang - it would have had to exist in time or not exist at all, unless it was quantum physics, which the universe is not.
There was time. There were just no clocks marking it.
Greetings budaatum
I respectfully disagree on the condition of time before the big bang. Yes, the entire universe as we know it originated from a VERY tiny object (smaller than an atom) that contained immense energy. But although this known universe is huge and standard physics are able to describe it, in the period of the big bang, it was so tiny quantum mechanics do apply.
Quantum mechanics describe the physical properties of nature on an atomic scale.
I accept the Theory of Relativity, and both matter and time are integral to each other. If there is no matter (in the absolute), then there is no time. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ok Madam So can We agree that if Gods can not be proven or disproven, Then a Soul would be able to be proved.
Wow that is a spectacularly irrational non-sequitur
GodHead85: As it is, There’s 0 Evidence that consciousness can exist outside the Brain. Therefore I see no reason to Believe that it can not be disproven either.
You just are incapable of understanding an argumentum ad ingorantiam fallacy then, no matter how many times it is explained. Just for the sake of it, I’ll have one more try, nothing is either proved or disproved because of an absence of evidence. Thus you are making an irrational assumption.
Honestly dear, why not just give up? You are as out of your depth on this subject as a new age creationist.
I respectfully disagree on the condition of time before the big bang. Yes, the entire universe as we know it originated from a VERY tiny object (smaller than an atom) that contained immense energy. But although this known universe is huge and standard physics are able to describe it, in the period of the big bang, it was so tiny quantum mechanics do apply.
Quantum mechanics describe the physical properties of nature on an atomic scale.
I accept the Theory of Relativity, and both matter and time are integral to each other. If there is no matter (in the absolute), then there is no time.
That's you error right there. You make time depend on matter instead of the other way round. It is the argument equally posed when a tree falls in a forest.
Surely that "VERY tiny object (smaller than an atom) that contained immense energy" must have existed at a time, lets say t=0 when it went bang. But are you suggesting it did not exist, as very tiny as it might have been at t=-1 and t=-2 and so on backwards with the energy slowly building up over time until it big banged?
Its not like I was there when that tree silently fell but I think it would be odd if big bang did not come out of a prior existence that extended probably very far into the minus territory is what I think. I can't get my head round how a thing that didn't exist could have gone bang, I guess.
Can you prove or even demonstrate that the universe started? Can you demonstrate it started without the help of God?
Why would you assume the big bang had a cause?
Why would you assume this is the only universe? Why would you assume there is another universe?
Size I wonder if that is even a relevant issue? Physics breaks down at Planck time. Are you sure anything called “size” would matter at all?
13.8 billion years ago, you have no evidence at all, and you are still trying to find a cause. Why? Causality breaks down at the quantum level. Causality is relative to our existence in this universe here and now. That’s about all we can actually say. How do you know there was a “before” the big bang. If time is a product of our universe, how can there be a before? Christians believe their holy book because they can. Just like you believe the universe had a cause and want to set out looking for it.
The universe had a period of rapid expansion as far as we currently know. That does not mean it is “True.” It means the facts seem to lead us to this conclusion currently. You say this universe is huge? By whose standard? In a sea of universes it is but a grain of sand and it is no where near “Huge.”
I will accept the idea that as far as anyone can tell, there is no good evidence supporting the idea of any god that I have heard of. ------------------------- Godhead85, you have taken the position of an anti-theist, claiming a god does not exist. Good luck maintaining that position, which is untenable. In my opinion, a god or gods can not be proven or disproven.
Hello, I don't know you but I just want to let you know that I owe you a drink
That's you error right there. You make time depend on matter instead of the other way round. It is the argument equally posed when a tree falls in a forest.
Surely that "VERY tiny object (smaller than an atom) that contained immense energy" must have existed at a time, lets say t=0 when it went bang. But are you suggesting it did not exist, as very tiny as it might have been at t=-1 and t=-2 and so on backwards with the energy slowly building up over time until it big banged?
Its not like I was there when that tree silently fell but I think it would be odd if big bang did not come out of a prior existence that extended probably very far into the minus territory is what I think. I can't get my head round how a thing that didn't exist could have gone bang, I guess.
GodHead85: As a matter a fact the universe started without a God’s help.
Do we absolutely know what caused the Big Bang?
Do we know for absolutely sure this is not the only universe?
We do know how old it is if we work backward to the size it would have been a certain number of billions of years ago. If we could somehow go back the whole 13.8 billion years we might have an idea what caused it to expand the way which it did. We might also find out if anything was possibly here before the Big Bang.
We can with the information we do have prove that it didn’t happen in six days suddenly everything was here, and earth would nearly be the center of the universe.
But the problem with that is earth is 4.5 billion years old and the the universe is 13.8 billion years old. The universe existed like over 9 billion years longer than our side of the universe.
Humans have existed on earth what is it, 50 million years or something?
In the beginning god created the heavens and the earth. It reads like humans were first, except there were many creatures here way before we evolved. How does anyone believe what Christians call the good book or holy book, when there’s no accuracy to anything in it? It is true that the universe had a period of rapid expansion as it would take more than 13.8 billion years to reach out like what is it, 35 billion light years in every direction? Or is it more? This universe is huge and did from what some scientists say somehow expanded faster than anything can travel within it. Expanded into where I don’t know. If fact there’s a lot I have no idea about when it comes to this universe and those answers may never come either but the answers are not in the Holy Bible, the Christian bible. That piece of junk pretty much puts us as first and that’s just not true.
In fact I have only bits and pieces of an understanding of it all, and don’t believe it will all be discovered in my lifetime. Could get froze for awhile like Larry King says he wants cryogenically frozen. I don’t understand that one bit but at least we agree there’s probably no god, and nothing after death.
your argument fall flat if science lied to you all the while...if the earth is flat and the big bang never happened. science is the perfect deception tool
Tamaratonye5: - Godhead85, you have taken the position of an anti-theist, claiming a god does not exist. Good luck maintaining that position, which is untenable. In my opinion, a god or gods can not be proven or disproven
What do you mean by "a god cannot be disproven" , when you have already said it cannot be proven in the first place?
And you know the craziest part... God still loves you even if u die believing He doesn't exist...it's people like you I pray for correct asin mind blowing encounters with Jesus to happen to... because in the end every knee "must" bow whether you like it or not
What do you mean by "a god cannot be disproven" , when you have already said it cannot be proven in the first place?
My assertion was that god claims in their broadest sense are unfalsifiable. Thus we can know nothing about them, which is the definition of agnosticism. Since I can't know if an unfalsifiable claim is true or not, I remain an agnostic, and of course withhold belief, so I am also an atheist.
Whenever this is observed I usually ask the same question: do you usually believe claims when you have already acknowledged you can know nothing about them? Alternatively if anyone asserts they know something about the claim for an extant deity, then they should demonstrate some objective evidence to support this claim for knowledge.
Anyways this is an old, old concept. I am surprised you aren't already familiar with it. Most theists who i'm close with, agree with that assertion as it emphasises the importance of faith for them which would be worthless if they had incontrovertible evidence for their god’s existence. And really its not something worth arguing about as you are never going to be able to supply that important objective evidence, no theist ever has in 2000 years.
I wonder if that is even a relevant issue? Physics breaks down at Planck time. Are you sure anything called “size” would matter at all?