livingchrist:

Shedeyinka illustration is only an analogy.

Matt 24:36 Refers only to persons the disciples were familiar with.

The holy spirit is a person, John 14:16

That would make Jesus a Liar, he said Only the Father knows. So holy spirit also know ?

Barristter07:


That would make Jesus a Liar, he said Only the Father knows. So holy spirit also know ?

It doesnt make Jesus a liar, Jesus was only speaking in the context of persons that his disciples were familiar with and in that context only the father knew.
Yes the holy spirit knew.

1 Corinthians 2:11
For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.

See paul is saying the spirit of God knows the mind of God.

livingchrist:
It doesnt make Jesus a liar, Jesus was only speaking in the context of persons that his disciples were familiar with and in that context only the father knew.
Yes the holy spirit knew.

1 Corinthians 2:11
For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.

See paul is saying the spirit of God knows the mind of God.

Then Jesus is wrong that ONLY , ONLY , ONLY , ONLY , ONLY the Father knows. Two persons not one person as Jesus said

Barristter07:


That means Greater authority.

The higher your authority, the higher you won't tolerate violation of identity.

The way Army will deal with who spoke against Sanwo Olu, is not the same as speaking against Gen. Buhari

No sir!
It is about the uniqueness of each personality

shadeyinka:

No sir!
It is about the uniqueness of each personality

Actually it speak of more authority than the other.

bingbagbo:


Good questions

Q1: Yes, the Holy Spirit is same as the Lord Jesus Christ

Q2: He is Spirit/God (John 4:24)

At the appointed time, He became man (1 Timothy 3:16)

Died, resurected on the third day and ascended into heaven. He poured Himself upon His children and Lives in the children of God.

Only He can do this.

With Him all things are possible

He loves you

Jesus Christ is not the HolySpirit.

John 15:26. "But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me:"

Matthew 12:32 "And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come."

Barristter07:


Actually it speak of more authority than the other.

The bible is silent on that

shadeyinka:

The bible is silent on that

It's not. That text said it all

Barristter07:

It's not. That text said it all

I don't know about that

shadeyinka:

I don't know about that

U do and your conscience bears witness, for a Holy spirit to be a Person, holy spirit is Greater than Christ and has more authority going by that verse.

livingchrist:
It doesnt make Jesus a liar, Jesus was only speaking in the context of persons that his disciples were familiar with and in that context only the father knew.
Yes the holy spirit knew.

Contextually speaking, the Holy spirit can ONLY know if He/she/it is not a person independent of the person of God the father.
Who can know the things of man except the spirit of man?
My spirit knows everything about me because it is what it is, My Spirit! Not another independent entity, it is my spirit!

If the Holy spirit is an independent entity of the father, then He is part of the "NO ONE KNOWS" category.

Whether you like it or not, that's the scriptural and logical truth.

Barristter07:


U do and your conscience bears witness, for a Holy spirit to be a Person, holy spirit is Greater than Christ and has more authority going by that verse.

Believe what you will. It's a free world.

Barristter07:


Then Jesus is wrong that ONLY , ONLY , ONLY , ONLY , ONLY the Father knows. Two persons not one person as Jesus said

yes the 'ONLY' is only limited to revealed persons.

The only thing that the Bible is silent on is what Jesus said @ Matthew 24:36, apart from this God's Holy Spirit has taught true Christians all the remaining things Jesus (the word) didn't reveal! John 14:26, 16:12-13
Sorry Shadeyinka that's the work of God's Holy Spirit ~to teach the true Christians all sacred secrets except the day and hour!

shadeyinka:

The bible is silent on that

MuttleyLaff:
I earlier told you didnt I, that you aren't ready to be exposed to the truth, fact and reality, lmso.

Both KJV and NWT are translations, that weren't inspired by God. Now, if KJV is not inerrant, what makes you believe that your Jehovah's Witnesses 1961 NWT that makes many false and misleading statements on many subjects, topics and even God directly, would be an exception, hmm?

MuttleyLaff:
"¹⁶All Scripture is inspired by God and is useful to teach us what is true and to make us realize what is wrong in our lives. It corrects us when we are wrong and teaches us to do what is right.
¹⁷God uses it to prepare and equip his people to do every good work."
- 2 Timothy 3:16-17

Max/InDHouse, all Scripture is inspired by God (i.e. all scripture is given by inspiration of God) but not all translation of Scripture as done in 1961 by Frederick W. Franz, who happened to be the main translator of scripture for use by Jehovah's Witnesses or The Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society (i.e. WTBTS) is inspired by God nor done by inspiration of God

Frederick W. Franz's New World Translation (i.e. NWT) even worse, is a poor translation from the original Koine Greek. Words have been added, deleted, inserted, invented, changed and modifications made to change scripture so to navigate round doctrinal difficulties and make scripture agree with Jehovah's Witnesses' heresies and suspect theology.

Now here's the truth, point and fact, right from the word go, Jehovah's Witnesses have set off on the wrong foot and with fraudulence right from the foundational level and so in the hands of the unsuspecting, inexperienced and the not aware, the New World Translation (i.e. NWT) can be chancy and misleading translation to be only reading. I won't mince words in saying that the New World Translation (i.e. NWT) should not be read, taken not accepted at face value, but to look deeper for its veiled intent and uncover what its translators have carefully and clearly hidden away or introduced

---

---

---

Barristter07:
KJV calls holy spirit "It" . Are u contradicting yourselves?

Shows that KJV is not inerrant

MaxInDHouse:
It's now clear what you detest so much but i'll repeat it always that there is LOVE, JOY and PEACE amongst God's people! false jw mob <edited for truth
So quoting the Bible and speaking grammar is not the evidence of God's holy spirit but what's obtainable in the midst of those adhering to God's word!

false jw mad max

having love joy and peace among your sect members
doesn't mount for anything

there is love joy and peace among many gatherings
and not just religious gatherings, it's normal and is nothing new:

Mat_5:46  For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?

It's when dealing with sacred things they pretends not to be sound in reasoning just to support their TRINITY dogheads.
Deformation of character only becomes a crime in the case of someone having higher authority! Luke 12:10

Barristter07:

That means Greater authority.
The higher your authority, the higher you won't tolerate violation of identity.
The way Army will deal with who spoke against Sanwo Olu, is not the same as speaking against Gen. Buhari

The father, Son and Holy Spirit are one with different functions but is there anyway people can get to see the functions of these three or are they just like the false gods in ancient times?
The characteristics of dead gods back then is noisy attitudes of the worshipers when there is no positive results/benefits anywhere!
So can you please present a gathering where Mr father, Mr Son and Mr Holy Spirit are at WORK since the three are invisible (to none worshipers) because i know you guys can see them even in the darkness, it's the unbelievers that's not seeing THEM/HIM

Nuttella:
It means that father, Son and Holy spirit are one with different functions.

MaxInDHouse:
The only thing that the Bible is silent on is what Jesus said @ Matthew 24:36, apart from this God's Holy Spirit has taught true Christians all the remaining things Jesus (the word) didn't reveal! John 14:26, 16:12-13
Sorry Shadeyinka that's the work of God's Holy Spirit ~to teach the true Christians all sacred secrets except the day and hour!

Who is greater: the Father or the Holy Spirit?
Who is greater: the Father or the Word?

I know you'll go off tangent with this now as usual!

The scripture that suggested the question in the first place was:

Mat 12:31:
"Why I say to you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven to men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven to men."

And Barristter07 said:

Barristter07:


That means Greater authority.

The higher your authority, the higher you won't tolerate violation of identity.

The way Army will deal with who spoke against Sanwo Olu, is not the same as speaking against Gen. Buhari

Do you think you can get anything contradicting what you've heard from me by engaging another JW?
Well i've told you this several times but it seems you don't believe me so i'll repeat it again Whatever you hear from any member of the JW family is exactly what you'll get from any other member of the family throughout the globe. Jesus prayed that they should be made one just as himself and his father are one! John 17:20-23

So forget about JWs organization and look for any other religionist that you can share your thoughts with.

Barrister is only being sarcastic about your Trinity concept, JEHOVAH is the one and only God that deserve our worship, Jesus is God's son who came as his PA to teach us how to worship God acceptably and the Holy Spirit is God's active force that will be given like a form of energizer to help worshipers accomplish the difficult tasks ahead of them.

Go throughout the entire universe and see if you can find a single member of the JW family that will tell you something different. You can see the Churchgoers chatting with you and going back and forth with their beliefs but not JWs. We are of the same line of thought globally! 1Corinthians 1:10

Regarding the PRACTICAL APPLICATION of the quoted verse, it simply means You're free to say anything against God's representatives since they appear just like you and you don't know what they do in secret, (Jesus only appeared to his contemporaries with good manners and fine upbringing speeches but nobody knows what this guy does in secret so you're free to think, say or do anything to him). But please please please don't speak against the proof God gives as evidence of his presence (Holy Spirit) because it's works is undeniable so whoever deny the works of God's Holy Spirit which all eyes can see as evidence of God's presence will never be forgiven"

That's the import of the quoted verse Sir.

May God bless you my friend!

shadeyinka:

Who is greater: the Father or the Holy Spirit?
Who is greater: the Father or the Word?
I know you'll go off tangent with this now as usual!
The scripture that suggested the question in the first place was:
Mat 12:31:
"Why I say to you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven to men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven to men."
And Barristter07 said:

MaxInDHouse:
Do you think you can get anything contradicting what you've heard from me by engaging another JW?
Well i've told you this several times but it seems you don't believe me so i'll repeat it again Whatever you hear from any member of the JW family is exactly what you'll get from any other member of the family throughout the globe. Jesus prayed that they should be made one just as himself and his father are one! John 17:20-23

So forget about JWs organization and look for any other religionist that you can share your thoughts with.

Barrister is only being sarcastic about your Trinity concept, JEHOVAH is the one and only God that deserve our worship, Jesus is God's son who came as his PA to teach us how to worship God acceptably and the Holy Spirit is God's active force that will be given like a form of energizer to help worshipers accomplish the difficult tasks ahead of them.

Go throughout the entire universe and see if you can find a single member of the JW family that will tell you something different. You can see the Churchgoers chatting with you and going back and forth with their beliefs but not JWs. We are of the same line of thought globally! 1Corinthians 1:10

May God bless you my friend!

You should have answered the questions rather than going off at tangent as predicted!

MaxInDHouse:
The only thing that the Bible is silent on is what Jesus said @ Matthew 24:36, apart from this God's Holy Spirit has taught true Christians all the remaining things Jesus (the word) didn't reveal! John 14:26, 16:12-13
Sorry Shadeyinka that's the work of God's Holy Spirit ~to teach the true Christians all sacred secrets except the day and hour!

Where you not in agreement with Barrister?

shadeyinka:

You should have answered the questions rather than going off at tangent as predicted!

I respect you as an intelligent being and image of God, try to improve the level of your intelligence!
What is the purpose of asking questions all the time when you already know that members of this group will give you the same response?
Come on Shadeyinka you should be wiser than this, once you know what is published in our magazines and you're aware that it's believing (trusting) in those publications that makes one a JW. Your next line of action should be to present something of higher value and operational somewhere not questions upon questions that you already know what they will give you as response!

Where you not in agreement with Barrister?

Imagine this question of yours again!
My friend, Maximus and Barrister both belongs to the same Organization (JW) and you know our logo is the same line of thought, so why asking me if i'm in agreement with my brother in faith?

Well it's just a question, i'm in agreement with the Watchtower just as Barrister so we will always be in agreement! John 17:20-23

MaxInDHouse:

I respect you as an intelligent being and image of God, try to improve the level of your intelligence!
What is the purpose of asking questions all the time when you already know that members of this group will give you the same response?
Come on Shadeyinka you should be wiser than this, once you know what is published in our magazines and you're aware that it's believing (trusting) in those publications that makes one a JW. Your next line of action should be to present something of higher value and operational somewhere not questions upon questions that you already know what they will give you as response!



Imagine this question of yours again!
My friend, Maximus and Barrister both belongs to the same Organization (JW) and you know our logo is the same line of thought, so why asking me if i'm in agreement with my brother in faith?

Well it's just a question, i'm in agreement with the Watchtower just as Barrister so we will always be in agreement! John 17:20-23

A member of your group said that the Holy Spirit is senior in rank to the Father and the Word. What do you want me to do except ask you how and by what justification is it true!

Blabbermouth:
Contextually speaking, the Holy spirit can ONLY know if He/she/it is not a person independent of the person of God the father.

God chose "I AM that I AM" obviously from YHWH (i.e. the Hebrew four-letter name, lmso) that is vocalised as Yahweh

Yahweh, means "to be", "to exist", "to become" and literally "I AM ...'' while "I AM that I AM" revealed to Moshe aka Moses, is an expression of praise and statement about the outstanding merit about God that He said He wants to used as for an admiration of Him, an encomium and tribute for Him.

Blabbermouth:
Who can know the things of man except the spirit of man?
My spirit knows everything about me because it is what it is, My Spirit! Not another independent entity, it is my spirit!

[img]https://s8/images/Sheol-copy.jpg[/img]

"Then the dust will return to the earth as it was,
And the spirit will return to God who gave it."
- Ecclesiastes 12:7

"Then Jesus called out in a loud voice,
"Father, into Your hands I commit My Spirit."
And when He had said this, He breathed His last."
- Luke 23:46

"While they were stoning him, Stephen appealed,
"Lord Jesus, receive my spirit.""
- Acts 7:59

Your spirit man, if dead to God (i.e. spiritually dead, meaning you aren't "born again" as in, born from on high) will not know about the important things of God because of its disconnect with the Spirit of God (i.e.person isnt "born again'')

I am sure you know that upon physical death, the body (i.e. flesh aka carnal man) goes back to the ground (i.e. as dust), the spirit aka spirit man, goes back God who first gave it and the soul, goes to either of two "holding" places shown in the above pasted picture, to await resurrection that will be followed by judgment.

Blabbermouth:
If the Holy spirit is an independent entity of the father, then He is part of the "NO ONE KNOWS" category.

Whether you like it or not, that's the scriptural and logical truth.

The Holy Spirit you're quite right is part of of the "NO ONE KNOWS" the personal name of the "The Holy Spirit", just as well as no one knows God's personal name

PS: @shadeyinka,
bro, I havent forgotten about our ongoing exchanges over you misunderstanding the sideline H₂0 (i.e. water) illustration I used, when comparing H₂0 and its configurations to solid, liquid and gas, to show the similarity with God, being Father, Son and Holy Spirit. Sorry I'll soon get round to you. I want to believe sha, that you know that water does exists in more form other the commonly known H₂0 composition lmso. Anyway, we'll delve more into this, when I share the reason why God for the most part, manifests Himself as Father, Son and Holy Spirit, lmso

MuttleyLaff:
God chose "I AM that I AM" obviously from YHWH (i.e. the Hebrew four-letter name, lmso) that is vocalised as Yahweh

Yahweh, means "to be", "to exist", "to become" and literally "I AM ...'' while "I AM that I AM" revealed to Moshe aka Moses, is an expression of praise and statement about the outstanding merit about God that He said He wants to used as for an admiration of Him, an encomium and tribute for Him.

[img]https://s8/images/Sheol-copy.jpg[/img]

"Then the dust will return to the earth as it was,
And the spirit will return to God who gave it."
- Ecclesiastes 12:7

"Then Jesus called out in a loud voice,
"Father, into Your hands I commit My Spirit."
And when He had said this, He breathed His last."
- Luke 23:46

"While they were stoning him, Stephen appealed,
"Lord Jesus, receive my spirit.""
- Acts 7:59

Your spirit man, if dead to God (i.e. spiritually dead, meaning you aren't "born again" as in, born from on high) will not know about the important things of God because of its disconnect with the Spirit of God (i.e.person isnt "born again'')

I am sure you know that upon physical death, the body (i.e. flesh aka carnal man) goes back to the ground (i.e. as dust), the spirit aka spirit man, goes back God who first gave it and the soul, goes to either of two "holding" places shown in the above pasted picture, to await resurrection that will be followed by judgment.

The Holy Spirit you're quite right is part of of the "NO ONE KNOWS" the personal name of the "The Holy Spirit", just as well as no one knows God's personal name

PS: @shadeyinka,
bro, I havent forgotten about our ongoing exchanges over you misunderstanding the sideline H₂0 (i.e. water) illustration I used, when comparing H₂0 and its configurations to solid, liquid and gas, to show the similarity with God, being Father, Son and Holy Spirit. Sorry I'll soon get round to you. I want to believe sha, that you know that water does exists in more form other the commonly known H₂0 composition lmso. Anyway, we delve more into this, when I share the reason why God for the most part, manifests Himself as Father, Son and Holy Spirit, lmso

Okay!

shadeyinka:
Okay!

[img]https://media1./images/0231ce01bd7fce51b82d143924cb3cfd/tenor.gif[/img]

You're the one who keep saying "holy spirit is a person" so to make you reason deeply he told you if that's true then the position of the holy spirit must be higher than the FATHER and SON put together since the father forgives just as the son but the Holy Spirit doesn't. That's what he is telling you.
There is no person called Holy Spirit, my brother is just being sarcastic with you!

shadeyinka:

A member of your group said that the Holy Spirit is senior in rank to the Father and the Word. What do you want me to do except ask you how and by what justification is it true!

shadeyinka:
A member of your group said that the Holy Spirit is senior in rank to the Father and the Word. What do you want me to do except ask you how and by what justification is it true!

I very much too, would like to see how true it is that, the Holy Spirit is senior in rank to the Father and the Word, lmso

He wasn't being sarcastic. He was relaying your position

MaxInDHouse:
You're the one who keep saying "holy spirit is a person" so to make you reason deeply he told you if that's true then the position of the holy spirit must be higher than the FATHER and SON put together since the father forgives just as the son but the Holy Spirit doesn't. That's what he is telling you.
There is no person called Holy Spirit, my brother is just being sarcastic with you!

No person called the Holy Spirit.
Yet
1. He can be grieved
2. He speaks
3. He teaches
4. He takes account of sin against himself.

The difference between a BEING and a THING is the attributes of the WILL, EMOTION and INTELLECT!

MuttleyLaff:
God chose "I AM that I AM" obviously from YHWH (i.e. the Hebrew four-letter name, lmso) that is vocalised as Yahweh

Yahweh, means "to be", "to exist", "to become" and literally "I AM ...'' while "I AM that I AM" revealed to Moshe aka Moses, is an expression of praise and statement about the outstanding merit about God that He said He wants to used as for an admiration of Him, an encomium and tribute for Him.

[img]https://s8/images/Sheol-copy.jpg[/img]

"Then the dust will return to the earth as it was,
And the spirit will return to God who gave it."
- Ecclesiastes 12:7

"Then Jesus called out in a loud voice,
"Father, into Your hands I commit My Spirit."
And when He had said this, He breathed His last."
- Luke 23:46

Your spirit man, if dead to God (i.e. spiritually dead, meaning you aren't "born again" as in, born from on high) will not know about the important things of God because of its disconnect with the Spirit of God (i.e.person isnt "born again'')

I am sure you know that upon physical death, the body (i.e. flesh aka carnal man) goes back to the ground (i.e. as dust), the spirit aka spirit man, goes back God who first gave it and the soul, goes to either of two "holding" places shown in the above pasted picture, to await resurrection that will be followed by judgment.

To start with, can you tell me leaving no stone unturned, the differences between your Soul and your Spirit?

MuttleyLaff:
I very much too, would like to see how true it is that, the Holy Spirit is senior in rank to the Father and the Word, lmso

That was said by Barrister07 himself, representing the JWs here. Although Maximus is trying hard to correct his line of thought.

That's why i said if that's true then you don't need all these arguments, just present a gathering of people where Mr Holy Spirit is working so everyone can see the benefits of his works.
Note that it's when you see the performance of a technician that you go out to employ him, the same logic should be applied in the case of Mr Holy Spirit. Jesus said we should beg the father to give us the holy spirit, therefore to convince an unbeliever that he needs this spirit, all you need is point, show, present, name the group of persons where Mr Holy Spirit is working in their midst lóbátán!

shadeyinka:
He wasn't being sarcastic. He was relaying your position
No person called the Holy Spirit.
Yet
1. He can be grieved
2. He speaks
3. He teaches
4. He takes account of sin against himself.
The difference between a BEING and a THING is the attributes of the WILL, EMOTION and INTELLECT!