So its no news that witnesses dont beleive in the teaching of the immortality of the soul (i.e that a person's soul continues to exist alongside his spirit after he dies) citing "the soul that sinneth shall die" (Ezek 18:4) and "the wages of sin is death" as biblical backup If a person's soul(his personality, memory, values,etc) seizes to exist and he becomes blank unconscious after he/she "dies" then i have two questions?? First why does d bible talk about the second death in Rev 21:8, how can a person who has died (seized to exist), die again 2) In genesis God told adam that if he eats the fruit of the tree of good and evil "he will surely die"(Gen 3:2) so why didnt adam "drop dead" and cease to exist after he ate the the fruit, if we believe that God doesnt lie and we also believe that death means a ceasure of breath and a termination of a persons soul, why did adam continue to "live" after God said he would "die" Or am i missing sth Witnesses i await your answers...

If you frequent the religious section and know any witness please feel free to tag them MaxinDHouse i sight u, come and answer

NuclearReactor:
So its no news that witnesses dont beleive in the teaching of the immortality of the soul (i.e that a person's soul continues to exist alongside his spirit after he dies) citing "the soul that sinneth shall die" (Ezek 18:4) and "the wages of sin is death" as biblical backup If a person's soul(his personality, memory, life perspectives, values,etc) seizes to exist and he becomes blank unconscious after he/she "dies" then i have a question?? In the book of genesis God told adam that if he eats the fruit of the tree of good and evil "he will surely die" (Gen 3:2), so why didnt adam "drop dead" and cease to exist after he ate the the fruit alongside eve, if we believe that God doesnt lie and we also believe that death means a ceasure of breath and a termination of a persons soul(memory, disposition, values,etc) why did adam continue to "live" after God said he would "die" Or am i missing sth Witnesses i await your answers...

the most foolish write up on earth. Is Adam alive today?

According to God's word Adam and Eve died that same day!
To you and i a day in our life amounts to 24 hours but from God's viewpoint Adam and Eve who were supposed to live forever died within a span of 1 day which is about 1,000 years when compared to our own 24 hours! 2Peter 3:8

Thanks for considering our book (BIBLE) God bless you and may you have PEACE!

Creamypie:
the most foolish write up on earth. Is Adam alive today?

modified, lol, whether adam died later or not, didnt he still die, if ur definition of death is to drop down unconscious and seize to exist then why did the bible talk about a "Second death" in revelation 21:8, if death means to seize to exist how can a person who died die again

It was because Adam ate the forbidden fruit that we die today, which was not God's intention for man. Else, there would not have been death for Humans. That is what NO DEATH FOR MAN means. Death became the ultimate end for mankind for contravening his law and acting in defiance of his instruction.

HIS INTENTION WAS FOR US TO LIVE FOREVER, IMMORTALITY.

Therefore, stop being disingenuous and half-smart. Except you are a true Christian you may not know the import of the sacrilege you attempted spinning.

You wish to ridicule a Christian sect, though I am not a fan of theirs. Neither am I a member of the Witness sect. However, you became very LTTLE in the process and become reduced deflated and the one RIDICULED instead.

STOP TREATING WITH LEVITY AND MAKING A MESS OF ANYTHING GOD.

Mickykarim:
It was because Adam ate the forbidden fruit that we die today, which was not God's intention for man. Else, there would not have been death for Humans. That is what NO DEATH FOR MAN means. Death became the ultimate end for mankind for contravening his law and acting in defiance of his instruction.

HIS INTENTION WAS FOR US TO LIVE FOREVER, IMMORTALITY.

Therefore, stop being disingenuous and half-smart. Except you are a true Christian you may not know the import of the sacrilege you attempted spinning.

You wish to ridicule a Christian sect, though I am not a fan of theirs. Neither am I a member of the Witness sect. However, you became very LTTLE in the process and become reduced deflated and the one RIDICULED instead.

STOP TREATING WITH LEVITY AND MAKING A MESS OF ANYTHING GOD.

On the contrary i think he has taken a bold step to know what he found confusing.
We are Jehovah's Witnesses, we don't blame people for their ignorance because none of us came to know the truth all by ourselves we were taught everything we know. 1Corin 4:7
If you know me when i was still a Muslim you will even praise this person because i was really aggressive than this by the time i was in search of the truth. But here i am today zealously preaching and industriously teaching people in my neighbourhood what Christ taught: The Good News of God's Kingdom! Matt 28:19-20

MaxInDHouse:
According to God's word Adam and Eve died that same day!
To you and i a day in our life amounts to 24 hours but from God's viewpoint Adam and Eve who were supposed to live forever died within a span of 1 day which is about 1,000 years when compared to our own 24 hours! 2Peter 3:8

Thanks for considering our book (BIBLE) God bless you and may you have PEACE!

Your answer clearly shows that the human definition/perspective of death is different from God's definition, humans see death from the lems of time whilst God sees it from the lens of eternity, if that is the case then why do u guys view death of the soul(the soul that sinneth shall die) from a strictly human standpoint of "becoming unconcious and seizing to exist" why are u confident that such is the correct way to inteprete that scripture(Ezek 18:4)

Mickykarim:
It was because Adam ate the forbidden fruit that we die today, which was not God's intention for man. Else, there would not have been death for Humans. That is what NO DEATH FOR MAN means. Death became the ultimate end for mankind for contravening his law and acting in defiance of his instruction.

But this is not the op point.

HIS INTENTION WAS FOR US TO LIVE FOREVER, IMMORTALITY.

The OP never against this!

Therefore, stop being disingenuous and half-smart. Except you are a true Christian you may not know the import of the sacrilege you attempted spinning.

You wish to ridicule a Christian sect, though I am not a fan of theirs. Neither am I a member of the Witness sect. However, you became very LTTLE in the process and become reduced deflated and the one RIDICULED instead.

STOP TREATING WITH LEVITY AND MAKING A MESS OF ANYTHING GOD.

I don't see calling for help as a crime! From the OP point, he wants more explanation.

The OP point centers on IMMORTALITY of SPIRIT against nor existing of the spirit after death by JWs.

I'm not sure you understand the OP.

For @WaxinDhouse.

If what you intended was the truth, why did he ask and or mention a particular Christian sect, the Witnesses and the question not made general and directed to all, or any Christian sect?

You may have been cornered by a comedian who attempted ridiculing the Witness sect. I am not.

Mickykarim i have no interest to ridicule anyone, look at my last reply to MaxinDHouse , the purpose of the thread was to show that most times the natural and human definition of a thing is different from the spiritual meaning of that term, if u think that mortality\deathmeans falling down and ceasing to exist then u are in for a long ride, why did the bible talk about the Second death in Revelation, lol if death means ceasing to exist then why would u need to die twice

Still dancing around it.

THERE WAS NOT MEANT TO BE DEATH AT ALL IN OUR DNA AND ACCORDING TO HIS PALN FOR US. IMMORTALITY FOR MAN WAS IT, IN HIS INITIAL PLAN AND FOUNDATION OF MAN.

We were not created to die, but live forever until the first man acted contrary to his wish for man.

THEREFORE, SIN ATTRACTED DEATH WHEN MAN WAS CURSED BY HIM.

NuclearReactor:
Your answer clearly shows that the human definition/perspective of death is different from God's definition, humans see death from the lems of time whilst God sees it from the lens of eternity, if that is the case then why do u guys view death of the soul(the soul that sinneth shall die) from a strictly human standpoint of "becoming unconcious and seizing to exist" why are u confident that such is the correct way to inteprete that scripture(Ezek 18:4)

The body is what we know but the character is what God prefer so when a person dies we will bury his body but the character remains fresh in God's memory no matter how long it takes {Genesis 4:10} He still view them from the standpoint of their character {Luke 20:38} but when a person choose to be evil God doesn't keep account of evil thoughts so He format them from His memory which means they will not be remembered during the resurrection of the dead! Psalms 9:17 compare to Matt 19:28

Mickykarim:
For @MaxInDHouse.
If what you intended was the truth, why did he ask and or mention a particular Christian sect, the Witnesses and the question not made general and directed to all, or any Christian sect? You may have been cornered by a comedian who attempted ridiculing the Witness sect. I am not.

We really appreciate people like him who speaks from the heart, our Master, Lord and King Christ Jesus taught us never to be quick in judging people but to be slow in response and fast in listening! James 1:19

Nathaniel was aggressive even abusive of Jesus' origin {John 1:46} but Jesus saw something else in Nathaniel {John 1:47} my friend the name Nathaniel today is part of the 12 names that formed the foundation of God's Kingdom in heaven! Reve 21:14

So don't even think he did anything wrong by asking a thought provoking question the way he chose to!

YOU PEOPLE ERRORNOUSLY MADE IT LOOK LIKE ALL THE IRRELEVANT QUOTES TO THE SUBJECT IN PURVIEW PRE-EXISTS THE BOOK OF GENESIS THAT CONTAINS THE ORIGINAL SIN.

All other happenings after the original sin were consequent upon that singular act and God's intention with plans for MANKIND.

JESUS WAS SENT DOWN TO US TO REDEEM US FROM OUR MISDEED AND REBELION AGAINST GOD'S WILL AND WISH.
THERE PROBABLY WOULD NOT HAVE BEEN ANY MORE BOOKS AFTER GENESIS, IF WE HAD NOT GONE AGAINST HIS WILL AND INSTRUCTION. JESUS MAY HAVE NOT COME TO SAVE US. MAY HAVE NOT BEEN NECESSARY

Not the other way round. It is not rock science.

Mickykarim:
YOU PEOPLE ERRORNOUSLY MADE IT LOOK LIKE ALL THE IRRELEVANT QUOTES TO THE SUBJECT IN PURVIEW PRE-EXISTS THE BOOK OF GENESIS THAT CONTAINS THE ORIGINAL SIN.

All other happenings after the original sin were consequent upon that singular act and God's intention with plans for MANKIND.

JESUS WAS SENT DOWN TO US TO REDEEM US FROM OUR MISDEED AND REBELION AGAINST GOD'S WILL AND WISH.
THERE PROBABLY WOULD NOT HAVE BEEN ANY MORE BOOKS AFTER GENESIS, IF WE HAD NOT GONE AGAINST HIS WILL AND INSTRUCTION. JESUS MAY HAVE NOT COME TO SAVE US. MAY HAVE NOT BEEN NECESSARY

Not the other way round. It is not rock science.

Please calm down my friend!

Books become necessary due to memory loss of imperfect humans but had it been Adam and Eve never sinned there wouldn't be any need for books to be written because by then we will all be perfect like Jesus who can remember everything he has seen, heard, said or did perfectly! Jere 31:33-34

But for now we need these books until after we regain perfection!

MaxInDHouse:


The body is what we know but the character is what God prefer so when a person dies we will bury his body but the character remains fresh in God's memory no matter how long it takes {Genesis 4:10} He still view them from the standpoint of their character {Luke 20:38} but when a person choose to be evil God doesn't keep account of evil thoughts so He format them from His memory which means they will not be remembered during the resurrection of the dead! Psalms 9:17 compare to Matt 19:28

if u said that God doesnt keep thoughts of peoples evil deeds, well thats incorrect, read Jer 31:31-34, God said that he would make a convenant with the people and under such convenant he would no longer remember the sins of the people, dat promise only applies to those who are under that convenant, the promise to forget peoples sins is not for everyone theres a condition atached to it, u must be under the new convenant, aka u must beleive in and relate with Jesus!!

@WaxinDhouse.

Thanks for making my point.

WHY WAS THE QUESTION DIRECTED AT A PARTICULAR CHRISTIAN SECT, THE JEHOVAH WITNESS?

Should have been a question for all Christians and IF you read the last statement in the original text with funny emojis.

YOU DID NOT GET IT, DO YOU!

NuclearReactor:
if u said that God doesnt keep thoughts of peoples evil deeds, well thats incorrect, read Jer 31:31-34, God said that he would make a convenant with the people and under such convenant he would no longer remember the sins of the people, dat promise only applies to those who are under that convenant, the promise to forget peoples sins is not for everyone theres a condition atached to it, u must be under the new convenant, aka u must beleive in and relate with Jesus!!

Well before the true God if you're not an Israelite He doesn't even know you exist at all!

It's His angels who are going about keeping account of people who are trying to live and let live. That's why Jesus could say about people who don't know the truth about God:


Jesus said to him: “Keep following me, and let the dead bury their dead.” Matt 8:22

Only the Israelites are living people from God's viewpoint and not even all of them but the faithful ones among them. As for people of other nations they will be resurrected as UNRIGHTEOUS {Act 24:15} since they lived by conscience not God's standard! Roma 2:15

So God doesn't keep account of evildoers at all they've had their days and chosen to misuse their opportunity of searching for God with their hearts! Psalms 9:17

Thanks!

BEFORE THE ENTRANCE OF THE ORIGINAL SIN! WHICH CHANGED THE CALCULATION.

Mickykarim:
Still dancing around it.

THERE WAS NOT MEANT TO BE DEATH AT ALL IN OUR DNA AND ACCORDING TO HIS PALN FOR US. IMMORTALITY FOR MAN WAS IT, IN HIS INITIAL PLAN AND FOUNDATION OF MAN.

We were not created to die, but live forever until the first man acted contrary to his wish for man.

THEREFORE, SIN ATTRACTED DEATH WHEN MAN WAS CURSED BY HIM.

I am not dancing arount anything, u are the one dancing, i am trying to say that what you understand as death, may not be what death truly means, but rather than face that u are busy repeating that death was never Gods plan, guess what we all know dat death wasnt God's original plan, we want to know what death really means. Gotit And oh the reason i specificially mention witnesses is dat their wrong definition of death influenced their errorneous belief that thd soul is not immortal!!

Mickykarim:

@WaxinDhouse.
Thanks for making my point.
WHY WAS THE QUESTION DIRECTED AT A PARTICULAR CHRISTIAN SECT, THE JEHOVAH WITNESS?
Should have been a question for all Christians and IF you read the last statement in the original text with funny emojis.
YOU DID NOT GET IT, DO YOU!

My friend i don't like doing this but it seems you want me to!

Jesus said:

"By their FRUITS you will recognize them. Never do people gather grapes from thorns or figs from thistles, do they?" Matt 7:16

Each religion has a FRUIT they're producing, Jesus is the tree planted by the true God {John 15:1} his disciples are the branches who began preaching zealously and industriously teaching people everywhere they go {John 15:6} JWs are the only group producing this same FRUIT today! John 17:20-23

So don't be surprised that everyone knows the one and only group practicing what Jesus laid down which is the preaching and teaching of God's word! Matt 5:14-16

That's why when anyone has a question bothering their minds the first group they think of is JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES! Act 1:8

YOU ARE STILL BEING DISNGENOUS. THE WORDINGS AND TEXT ARE STRAIT, NO AMBIGUITY. IT IS HUMAN WHO WOULD RATHER MISNITERPRETE THE SCRIPTURES AND REASON YOU HAVE PROFILATION OF CHURCHES. DUE TO THE MISINTERPRETATION OF BOTH THE BIBLE AND GOD'S INTENTIONS. EVEN WHEN THE TEXT ARE CLEARLY WRITING, REQUIRING NO HUMAN INTERPRETATIONS.

However, you have peeved away from the main crux of the matter. Which was an attempt to ridicule a Christian sect. The Jehovah witness sect. I have pointed at what made it my description. Go read the original post and the last statement, specifically.

Mickykarim:
YOU ARE STILL BEING DISNGENOUS. THE WORDINGS AND TEXT ARE STRAIT, NO AMBIGUITY. IT IS HUMAN WHO WOULD RATHER MISNITERPRETE THE SCRIPTURES AND REASON YOU HAVE PROFILATION OF CHURCHES. DUE TO THE MISINTERPRETATION OF BOTH THE BIBLE AND GOD'S INTENTIONS. EVEN WHEN THE TEXT ARE CLEARLY WRITING, REQUIRING NO HUMAN INTERPRETATIONS.

However, you have peeved away from the main crux of the matter. Which was an attempt to ridicule a Christian sect. The Jehovah witness sect. I have pointed at what made it my description. Go read the original post and the last statement, specifically.

You make me laugh with the highlighted!
Because you're trying to defend the Bible while your friend is fighting for the dogma of the Immortality of the soul!

NuclearReactor:
I am not dancing arount anything, u are the one dancing, i am trying to say that what you understand as death, may not be what death truly means, but rather than face that u are busy repeating that death was never Gods plan, guess what we all know dat death wasnt God's original plan, we want to know what death really means. Gotit And oh the reason i specificially mention witnesses is dat their wrong definition of death influenced their errorneous belief that thd soul is not immortal!!

So to resolve this issue what we need to find out is:

Did God create humans {Gene 2:7} and having the ability to send man back to inexistence {Gene 2:17} or do humans have something in us (soul) that cannot die? Gene 3:4

YOUR DUAL PERSONALITY ALREADY SPEAKS VOLUME. NucleaReator and WaxinDhouse.

No longer surprised that you would rather treat the words of God with levity and turn it into a JOKE. When you cannot defend your erroneous position.

NOW THAT YOU HAVE BEEN EXPOSED FOR WHAT YOU TRULY ARE.

I have now come to the understanding of the personality involved here.

Good day.

Mickykarim:

YOUR DUAL PERSONALITY ALREADY SPEAKS VOLUME. NucleaReator and WaxinDhouse.
No longer surprised that you would rather treat the words of God with levity and turn it into a JOKE. When you cannot defend your erroneous position.
NOW THAT YOU HAVE BEEN EXPOSED FOR WHAT YOU TRULY ARE.
I have now come to the understanding of the personality involved here. Good day.

It's God's word, thing recorded never happen or written in our presence so we tactfully discuss it to find out the truth.
Nobody can fight for God!

MaxinDHouse first of, that scripture in Jeremiah was repeated in the book of hebrews, why? Because the convenant in question is not the convenant he made with the nation isreal, rather that "new convenant" is the convenant God made with the world when Jesus died for the sins of the world, only those who beleives in and accept Jesus as their saviour are under that convenant, since not everyone beleives in and relates with Jesus so not everyone enjoys the benefit of that convenant. Second satan told eve that she wont die if she ate the fruit, well eve died IMMEDIATELY she ate it, but that death didnt manifest in her physical body... I can go on with what death realy means but since u are set in defining death as ceasing to exist, then cool

MaxInDHouse:


The body is what we know but the character is what God prefer so when a person dies we will bury his body but the character remains fresh in God's memory no matter how long it takes {Genesis 4:10} He still view them from the standpoint of their character {Luke 20:38} but when a person choose to be evil God doesn't keep account of evil thoughts so He format them from His memory which means they will not be remembered during the resurrection of the dead! Psalms 9:17 compare to Matt 19:28

Imagine making @color claim yet claiming to know Bible than anyone else when the Bible says both the righteous and unrighteous will be resurrected. Acts. 24:15

In fact, your organization says otherwise contrary to your claim. In this link see how your organization expose your lying mouth 15 "Revelation chapter 20, verse 13, in these words: “The sea gave up those dead in it, and death and Hades gave up those dead in them, and they were judged individually according to their deeds.” Thus, during Jehovah’s great thousand-year Judgment Day, all those in God’s memory will be resurrected​—both the righteous and the unrighteous. (Acts 17:31)

NuclearReactor:
MaxinDHouse first of, that scripture in Jeremiah was repeated in the book of hebrews, why? Because the convenant in question is not the convenant he made with the nation isreal, rather that "new convenant" is the convenant God made with the world when Jesus died for the sins of the world, only those who beleives in and accept Jesus as their saviour are under that convenant, since not everyone beleives in and relates with Jesus so not everyone enjoys the benefit of that convenant. Second satan told eve that she wont die if she ate the fruit, well eve died IMMEDIATELY she ate it, but that death didnt manifest in her physical body... I can go on with what death realy means but since u are set in defining death as ceasing to exist, then cool

Well if you understand it differently then there's no need looking for ways to argue with JWs, just pick up your Bible and go out there to PREACH and TEACH what you know as truth.
We are preaching and teaching what we know so play your part instead of calling out a group.
You've learnt a lesson today from Mickykarim that different religions groups has there own interpretation of God's word, stop thinking only JWs have different teachings from what you were taught to believe!

Emusan:


Imagine making @color claim yet claiming to know Bible than anyone else when the Bible says both the righteous and unrighteous will be resurrected. Acts. 24:15

In fact, your organization says otherwise contrary to your claim. In this link see how your organization expose your lying mouth 15 "Revelation chapter 20, verse 13, in these words: “The sea gave up those dead in it, and death and Hades gave up those dead in them, and they were judged individually according to their deeds.” Thus, during Jehovah’s great thousand-year Judgment Day, all those in God’s memory will be resurrected​—both the righteous and the unrighteous. (Acts 17:31)

In as much as i don't wish to engage you (OLAADEGBU) yet i will only answer this once:

Jehovah's Witnesses organization teaches us but if you're not one of us you can't understand what we were taught.

I have highlighted a point in what you quoted so it's not all dead people that will resurrect but only those in God's memory book.

Thanks!

MaxInDHouse:


In as much as i don't wish to engage you (OLAADEGBU) yet i will only answer this once:

Jehovah's Witnesses organization teaches us but if you're not one of us you can't understand what we were taught.

I have highlighted a point in what you quoted so it's not all dead people that will resurrect but only those in God's memory book.

Thanks!

I hope the moderators are taking note of the flouting of rule 8 by MaxinDHouse who is used to lying for his organisation.

MaxInDHouse:


Well if you understand it differently then there's no need looking for ways to argue with JWs, just pick up your Bible and go out there to PREACH and TEACH what you know as truth.
We are preaching and teaching what we know so play your part instead of calling out a group.
You've learnt a lesson today from Mickykarim that different religions groups has there own interpretation of God's word, stop thinking only JWs have different teachings from what you were taught to believe!

I will always seek to correct wrong doctrine and show people scriptures so that THEY CAN REASON IT INDEPENDENTLY and not just stick to what their church or governing body claims is the truth. Think out these things objectively whilst asking God for insight, though their are many intepretations of scriptures only one truth exists!! Study and compare scriptures to find the truth YOURSELF.