It looks like the crisis in Iraq is not enough 4 this administration. The US is currently provoking Russia & Turkey -

*Meddling in their internal affairs
*Trying 2 set up a missile defence in Russian sphere of influence

the result
*Turkey is currently preparing an invasion of northern Iraq to root out what it believes are terrorists.
*Russia is gradually resuming the arms race & the nuclear- cold war era (patrolling with long range bombers)

& if i may add, there is a trade war going on between the US & China, & ofcourse tensions with Iran.

I may be wrong, but these look like the early stages of a world war. This may become more obvious when Europe begins to take sides.

Rumours of the End of The World have thankfully been greatly exaggerated so far, and this latest "Sum of All Fears" alarm is probably no exception. Best selling novelist Tom Clancy spins conspiracy theories such as yours into gold with just about every book he writes selling out as fast as the copies roll off the press, so you are in good company, Jagwar.

A notable exception to the rule of life rarely imitating art[i] did in fact occur [/i] in the USA on Sept 11 2001, when all those hijacked passenger jets were deliberately piloted into buildings, because that exact method of attack served as the climactic scene of Tom Clancy's 1994 novel " Debt of Honor" , in which a homicidally bereaved Japanese Airlines pilot guided his Boeing 747 into the White House to avenge the death of his fighter-pilot son who had been shot down in a dogfight with American jets over some disputed Pacific islands.

One can only guess whether and to what extent Tom Clancy's fictional 1994 novel was studied by the Al Queda planners of the 2001 terror attacks, given the eerie similarity between the fictional suicide pilot's maneuvers as he closed in on his target, and that of the 911 terrorist pilots as they set course for their individual targets that turned out to be the New York World Trade Center Twin Towers, The Pentagon, and very nearly The White House, but for the heroic passengers of United Flight 93 who died preventing that third strike.

Speculateth ye not, Young Grasshopper, lest it may come to pass.

Hmnmnmnmnmnm! Interesting!

jagwar:

It looks like the crisis in Iraq is not enough 4 this administration. The US is currently provoking Russia & Turkey -

*Meddling in their internal affairs
*Trying 2 set up a missile defence in Russian sphere of influence

the result
*Turkey is currently preparing an invasion of northern Iraq to root out what it believes are terrorists.
*Russia is gradually resuming the arms race & the nuclear- cold war era (patrolling with long range bombers)

& if i may add, there is a trade war going on between the US & China, & ofcourse tensions with Iran.

I may be wrong, but these look like the early stages of a world war. This may become more obvious when Europe begins to take sides.

Are you saying that the US is not allowed to deal with these countries as it is doing now without it all triggering a war?

I think President Bush is running out of ideas on how to revive the American failing economy.

Maybe the best thing is to cause foreign frictions, our world against their world, so as to get the support of ordinary Americans.

Besides running out of ideas in the Bushville GOP, the only way to brainwash Americans is to go to war within 10 months of the next election.  Americans will blindly stand by any president who takes them to war.

It worked for Bush in 2000-2008. This may start WW3 but the most immdiate goal is to find another scapegoat to derail the 2008 elections. This is the ace up the sleeve of the GOP.  Just mention "terrorism" or "Osama Bin Laden"--you have the ears and eyes of Americans.   Works every time!

almondjoy:

Besides running out of ideas in the Bushville GOP, the only way to brainwash Americans is to go to war within 10 months of the next election. Americans will blindly stand by any president who takes them to war.

It worked for Bush in 2000-2008. This may start WW3 but the most immdiate goal is to find another scapegoat to derail the 2008 elections. This is the ace up the sleeve of the GOP. Just mention "terrorism" or "Osama Bin Laden"--you have the ears and eyes of Americans. Works every time!

McKren:

I think President Bush is running out of ideas on how to revive the American failing economy.

Maybe the best thing is to cause foreign frictions, our world against their world, so as to get the support of ordinary Americans.

Now I know you two are not serious about those. The Weapon shield issue did not start with Bush, it has been in the worlds LONG before Bush. so why is his continuing to push for it suddenly him wanting to cause fiction?? and the comment about Americans will do anything to go to war statement is following the same old turning every other thread into ridicule move. Please stop already. Stop the I CAN READ EVERYBODIES MIND AND KNOW WHAT ALL AMERICANS AND BUSH ARE THINKING style and focus on using what you is to argue your points. Gosh!!! It's gets boring after so much use of that tactic.


Jeeezzz

jagwar:

It looks like the crisis in Iraq is not enough 4 this administration. The US is currently provoking Russia & Turkey -

*Meddling in their internal affairs
*Trying 2 set up a missile defence in Russian sphere of influence

[b]the result
*Turkey is currently preparing an invasion of northern Iraq to root out what it believes are terrorists.
*Russia is gradually resuming the arms race & the nuclear- cold war era (patrolling with long range bombers)
[/b]
& if i may add, there is a trade war going on between the US & China, & ofcourse tensions with Iran.

I may be wrong, but these look like the early stages of a world war. This may become more obvious when Europe begins to take sides.

One of the attributes of modern day discourse is to attribute to the US, responsibility for not just the actions of the US but the actions of others,be they nation states or terror groups.

So the US is responsible not just for invading,say Iraq, but for Turkey's decision to interfere in Northern Iraq,never mind that Turkey has done so before in the 90s and has constantly made incursions into that region.What about questioning the disgraceful way in which Turkey has been suppressing its Kurdish minority for decades?Not a word.Suddenly,the same people who criticize the US or Israel for breaching the sovereignty of other nations suddenly turn a blind eye to Turkey's actions and blame it on the US.

Suddenly,Eastern European nations like the Czech Republic and Poland, who have expressed a desire to host US missile defense systems have no right to do since the Czech Republic and Poland,wholly sovereign nations,are within Russia's "sphere of influence" and as such must obtain Russia's permission to host purely defensive weapons.What is the point of the concepts of sovereignty or independence,if nations like the 2,who were invaded and brutally occupied by Russia for decades,have to seek Russia's(their former occupier) permission to host defensive systems?

Trade wars between the US and China are also blamed on the US.Given that China has trade wars with pretty much every major trading nation or region on the planet,it is amazing that someone actually believes that the US is uniquely at fault.

To complete the list,tensions with Iran are cited.Of course,it was the US,not Iran, that made threats to wipe out another nation in the Middle East and currently occupies land belonging to the UAE.

What a simplistic view people have of international affairs.

The missile defence system is dividing Europe now and that is exactly what US want. Beleive me they dont want United Europe and will try anything to divide them. If truely they are sincere in the missile shield then they should come to compromise with Russia on a more suitable site to place it so that Russia will not feel threatend. Putin made a suggestion and they rejected it instanta why?. Lets watch as things will unfold but i strongly beleive that as far as Putin is alive Russia must not allow it to happen instead another cold war will start and Europe will suffer the most.

Russian Bombers flying to British airspace even US airspace, something that has not happened since the end of cold war, this shows you that russia is ready for anything.

What else can we blame on the US?
Ah yes, Etteh's N628m scandal was all part of the US plan to derail Nigeria's democracy.

sometimes, i can't believe people

Kurds based in Northern Iraq cross over to turkish territory and carry out terrorist attacks. Turkey announces its readiness to cross into Northen Iraq to fish out the perpetrators.
The US, recognizing that an armed incursion into Northern Iraq could inflame tensions and accelerate hostilities, try to prevail on the turkish authorities not to do this.
This is clearly an act of peace, yet the poster alleges that this is designed to precipitate war?

Please, let's try and make sensible contributions in the future, ok?

I am just going by the prophesy of "The Man Who Saw Tomorrow". The great Nostradamus. He clearly stated that WW3 would come from a "madman" in the west if I am not mistaken. We all have our beliefs and time will prove us wrong.

Kobojunkie:


Now I know you two are not serious about those. The Weapon shield issue did not start with Bush, it has been in the worlds LONG before Bush. so why is his continuing to push for it suddenly him wanting to cause fiction?? and the comment about Americans will do anything to go to war statement is following the same old turning every other thread into ridicule move.


Please stop already. Stop the I CAN READ EVERYBODIES MIND AND KNOW WHAT ALL AMERICANS AND BUSH ARE THINKING style and focus on using what you is to argue your points. Gosh!!! It's gets boring after so much use of that tactic.
Jeeezzz

Okay, we shall see!  Most modern wars are because of American interests in one part of the world or another.  Unfortunately, like a spider-when you start weaving, you never know how large the web can get.  If the interests were good, no problem.  But selective interests just like selective justice in Nigeria can only go so far.  Not going to say more than this!

I-man:



Suddenly,Eastern European nations like the Czech Republic and Poland, who have expressed a desire to host US missile defense systems have no right to do since the Czech Republic and Poland,wholly sovereign nations,are within Russia's "sphere of influence" and as such must obtain Russia's permission to host purely defensive weapons.

CUBAN MISSILE CRISIS?? i remember that didnt go too well in the US, even though it was planned for a sovereign country.

jagwar:

CUBAN MISSILE CRISIS?? i remember that didnt go too well in the US, even though it was planned for a sovereign country.

Introducing Soviet nuclear missiles into the US's next door neighbour is hardly comparable to mounting radar systems and other defensive systems in countries like Czech Republic and Poland who are not neighbouring states.These systems do not threaten Russia.

Comparing the Czech Republic to Cuba is absurd,even more absurd is comparing missile defense to nuclear weapons.

At the end of the day,one has to examine whether the US is to blame for Russia's lack of respect for many countries within the region.

almondjoy:

Okay, we shall see! [b]Most modern wars are because of American interests in one part of the world or ano[/b]ther. Unfortunately, like a spider-when you start weaving, you never know how large the web can get. If the interests were good, no problem. But selective interests just like selective justice in Nigeria can only go so far. Not going to say more than this!

Includinig world war I and II?
Na wa for people o.

texazzpete:

sometimes, i can't believe people

The US, recognizing that an armed incursion into Northern Iraq could inflame tensions and accelerate hostilities, try to prevail on the turkish authorities not to do this.
This is clearly an act of peace, yet the poster alleges that this is designed to precipitate war?

Please, let's try and make sensible contributions in the future, ok?

Ermm, the Turks wont have taken this action if the US congress didnt accuse them of comitting genocide (totally unnecessary) Come to think of it what happened to the native Americans? let me guess, the US took good care of them? it wasnt genocide at all.

jagwar:

Ermm, the Turks wont have taken this action if the US congress didnt accuse them of comitting genocide (totally unnecessary) Come to think of it what happened to the native Americans? let me guess, the US took good care of them? it wasnt genocide at all.

Sometimes you wonder if people bother to read their history books before making threads. The Turks and the Kurds have been at each others throats for decades. Are we now trying to pin the blame for that on the actions of the US congress last week?

Yes, but the Turks hav shown restraint for some years now to respect US demands to stay out of Iraq. The US then decides to say something provocative to them

almondjoy:

I am just going by the prophesy of "The Man Who Saw Tomorrow". The great Nostradamus. He clearly stated that WW3 would come from a "madman" in the west if I am not mistaken. We all have our beliefs and time will prove us wrong.

are u serious? Based on the current trend i could hav sworn it would be Ahmedinejad

jagwar:

Yes, but the Turks hav shown restraint for some years now to respect US demands to stay out of Iraq. The US then decides to say something provocative to them

This "blame the US for my bleeding gums" game is now becoming ridiculous. What have the Iraqi Kurds got to do with the US decision to label the massacre of the Armenians as genocide?

The Turks are trying 2 show the US that they have no regard 4 them anymore by invading Iraq while they are there. A small price to pay for their comments.

By the way it wasnt a massacre, it was war & there were casualties on both sides. I wonder how the US would like their actions in Iraq being labelled as genocide or military occupation.

Try to be open minded & see the truth.

jagwar:

The Turks are trying 2 show the US that they have no regard 4 them anymore by invading Iraq while they are there. A small price to pay for their comments.

this is merely trying to bend the truth to suit your agenda. the Turks have always been at logger-heads with the Kurds in Iraq whose quest for independence is sure to unsettle the already precarious relationship the Turks have with their own indigenous Kurds.
The US action is but another excuse in the armoury of those who will blame the US when they cant find their pencils.

jagwar:

By the way it wasnt a massacre, it was war & there were casualties on both sides. I wonder how the US would like their actions in Iraq being labelled as genocide or military occupation.

What war did the Armenians fight with the Turks? Read your history well.

jagwar:

Try to be open minded & see the truth.

You need this advice much more than me. Most often times when people ask for open mindedness and seeing the truth what they mean is - SEE THINGS MY WAY ONLY.

jagwar:

By the way it wasnt a massacre, it was war & there were casualties on both sides. I wonder how the US would like their actions in Iraq being labelled as genocide or military occupation.

there is no beating about the bush here, the REAL killings in Iraq is a direct result of muslim on muslim violence and has nothing to do with the US.
When will you label the Sudan massacre a genocide?

davidylan:

the REAL killings in Iraq is a direct result of muslim on muslim violence and has nothing to do with the US.
when will you label the Sudan massacre a genocide?

The last time i checked, 'black water" was not a muslim armed group without ties to the US. God knows how many of such killings they got away with in the past.

& yes the massacre in Sudan is genocide.

almondjoy:

Okay, we shall see! Most modern wars are because of American interests in one part of the world or another. Unfortunately, like a spider-when you start weaving, you never know how large the web can get. If the interests were good, no problem. But selective interests just like selective justice in Nigeria can only go so far. Not going to say more than this!

How many Modern wars are these?? Let us analyze these so called MOST modern wars?? Iraq I & II ?? Afghanistan?? Are these MOST modern wars

jagwar:

The last time i checked, 'black water" was not a muslim armed group without ties to the US. God knows how many of such killings they got away with in the past.

blackwater is a private security organisation hired independently. they are not under the control of the Us army or government. Seriously your strenous attempt to find just about any blame to lay at the doorsteps of the US is beyond imagination.

Blackwater killed a few Iraqis in an attempt to defend themselves and all of a sudden we are crying so loudly forgeting the thousands slaughtered in the hands of suicide bombers. How many times have US soldiers failed to open fire on allegedly "innocent civilians" only to find themselves roped into an ambush?

jagwar:

The Turks are trying 2 show the US that they have no regard 4 them anymore by invading Iraq while they are there. A small price to pay for their comments.

By the way it wasnt a massacre, it was war & there were casualties on both sides. I wonder how the US would like their actions in Iraq being labelled as genocide or military occupation.

Try to be open minded & see the truth.

You speak about being OPEN MINDED And you just pulled a twist to blame the US for Turkeys so called need to show off??  

UNBEWEAVABLE!!!!!

jagwar:

The last time i checked, 'black water" was not a muslim armed group without ties to the US. God knows how many of such killings they got away with in the past.

& yes the massacre in Sudan is genocide.

So because Blackwater is a US company means the many people in Iraq who were killed in Iraq were fooled into believing they were killed by insurgents or what? Comparing 17 killed in an incident with Blackwater which we are still not 100% on it being intensional to tens of thousands killed by insurgents since the beginning of the war. Nice move!!! nice move, what can I say, I am sure you somehow believe that is a great argument for whatever case it is you want to put forth but please do enlighten the rest of us who are clueless as to what exactly that move shows

davidylan:

blackwater is a private security organisation hired independently. they are not under the control of the Us army or government. Seriously your strenous attempt to find just about any blame to lay at the doorsteps of the US is beyond imagination.

How many times have US soldiers failed to open fire on allegedly "innocent civilians" only to find themselves roped into an ambush?

& your desperate attempts to make the US look like the saint they can never be are commendable. Yes black water is a private company that hires retired US marines who happen 2 be killing civilians.

I dont care how many times the US army had 2 refrain from killing civilians, they werent asked to be there in the first place. Besides its not in their personal interest to be caught killing civilians.

jagwar:


& your desperate attempts to make the US look like the saint they can never be are commendable. Yes black water is a private company that hires retired US marines who happen 2 be killing civilians.

I don't care how many times the US army had 2 refrain from killing civilians, they werent asked to be there in the first place. Besides its not in their personal interest to be caught killing civilians.

see argument, WOW!!!! I am amazed, !!!

jagwar:

& your desperate attempts to make the US look like the saint they can never be are commendable.

Go thru my posts and point out where i claimed that the US is a saint. there are probably more Americans against the Iraq war than the rest of you. The difference between you and the rest of us is that you are looking at things from the muddled prisms of a muslim - US bad, muslim good.

jagwar:

Yes black water is a private company that hires retired US marines who happen 2 be killing civilians.

So because blackwater is a US company George Bush and the US government is now to blame? Is Yar Adua to blame for the activities of the O'odua Peoples Congress?

jagwar:

I don't care how many times the US army had 2 refrain from killing civilians, they werent asked to be there in the first place. Besides its not in their personal interest to be caught killing civilians.

lol hogwash. Do you really care about the thousands of Iraqis killed by insurgents and fellow Iraqis crying allahu akbar? Where were you when Saddam was gassing the Kurds? where were you during the 8yr war of attrition btw Iran and Iraq?

And you all pretend as if Iraq was an oasis of peace and tranquility before the US appeared?

davidylan, dont even try to bring religion into this discussion coz i dont hav time for that area now.

If the US stays in control of Iraq as long as Saddam was, they would hav been responsible for the death of approximately 100 times the toll of Sadam.

Im sure if u ask the Iraqis, they would say they prefer Sadam to what they hav now. So dont even go there. By the way during the Iraq -Iran war. The US took sides & was arming Iraq against Iran (so u see they were involved there also)

got 2 go now, will continue later.