haibe:

How can you reconcile this with other scriptures that says a person sleeps at death?

When lazarus, who Jesus ressurected, died did he go to heaven or hell?

Ranchhoddas: i read it and it made no sense to me...if u can't/won't answer me,just say so and i'll leave u alone.

Pastor Olu T:

There was no account (where he went to) of that Lazarus whom Jesus raised, I hope u know its a different Lazarus as against Luke 16?
.

Pastor Olu T:

Sleep as death do not mean soul sleep at all (human is created spirit, soul n body), the body sleeps 'cos it will later be resurrected as a glorified one.

haibe:

But do you think he went anywhere when he died? ?

haibe:

The body sleeps?? how can a body sleep? Isn't sleeping something a person does and not just body?

Pastor Olu T:

Smile, doesn't make sense to u, then what gave u the impression when I answer ur question it will make sense to u?

Pastor Olu T:

Its possible he went to Heaven or just roam around the world (u know for sure spirit roam the world?) till he was brought back!

Ranchhoddas: because the answer i require is simple-heaven or hell...or are you planning on quoting bible passages?

Pastor Olu T:

A very good question, when one sleep does that mean that all his system is shut down? Why does he dream n in what state was he in when he dreams?

All this shows that everything is not shut down when he sleep/ die!

haibe:

I don't know for sure a so called spirit of a dead man roam the world, that's very unscriptural.

Assuming he went to heaven:

1) Wouldn't it be cruel for God to bring him back to earth where he can continue suffering and bringing back to tendency to be a sinner and not make paradise eventually??

2) How come he never said anything about heaven or hell when he was ressurected? I think you are one of those who believe in those NDEs right?

haibe: Am running out of power, but before that..

Lazarus didn't see anything when he died, he was simply unconscious, If he was in heaven already, there is no point bringing him back to earth, if he was in hell, no point too

I will be back when I charge

Man is a soul who posesses a spirit, not a spirit person like angels though, the Spirit in man is not immoral, "it" can't exist as a separate entity(person) from its body.

haibe:
Lazarus didn't see anything when he died, he was simply unconscious, If he was in heaven already, there is no point bringing him back to earth, if he was in hell, no point too

Man is a soul who posesses a spirit, not a spirit person like angels though, the Spirit in man is not immoral, "it" can't exist as a separate entity(person) from its body.

Emusan:
Jesus told His desciples touch me and see for a spirit has no flesh & blood" this statement alone should tell you that SPIRIT do exist as a person.

Emusan:

You people have been using this case of Lazarus for many years without asking a right question;
If Lazarus didn't see anything, the question is; Did anybody ask Lazarus about his afterlife experience

Pastor Olu T:

Ok, anyone that do not accept Jesus as is Lord n savior is going to Hell, for Jesus is the only way to the father!

Pastor Olu T:

Hmmm, so how do u explain spiritual experiences as in the prophets, Paul, n John the revelator just to mention.
No problem when u charge ur phone/laptop, we continue!

haibe:
That is where your confusion comes from, the word SPIRIT.
To enlighten to you a bit, the Greek word translated spirit is pneuma which means a lot, it could mean breath, air, wind, [size=14pt]a supernatural being,[/size] an intelligent part of a man, a dead man's apparition(Also known as a ghost) etc.

So when Jesus says a spirit does not have flesh and bones,the question is what does Jesus mean by spirit.
The believe of ghosts even though being a mythology has been in existence for a very long time, it is believed among some that when a person dies, he can appear as a disembodied spirit to those who are alive, this believe has been circulated by so many including in our present day and so when a person sees a supposed dead man he is quick to call him a spirit(ghost in this case).

Jesus had been dead for about 3 days and so it is expected that he is to remain in his grave, when the disciples saw Jesus who dies, they supposed they had seen a ghost, yes they supposed it was a Jesus apparition but of course Jesus was no longer dead, he has ressurected and is alive again, so they were wrong. Jesus also proved to them that he wasn't a ghost because it is believed ghosts don't have flesh and bones and he had them.

So yes there are spirit beings, angels and demons are examples but man is totally physical and human, the spirit in man is not a person like angels but an intelligent part capable of connecting us to God.
The word spirit doesn't mean one thing, it means a lot.

haibe:

If going to hell or heaven immediately after death was a fact and a serious issue like its preached in our churches today, the dead lazarus would have gone around spreading the new or might have even written his own book like people do nowadays, lol, you know now all those 8 hours in hell books or my stay in heaven.

Also the maid which Jesus raised from the dead, how come she didn't testify of heaven or hell?? Its because she was not there, she was totally unconscious in her death state.

People who are in the state of coma hardly tell anything about hell either, they rather tell you their last memory was perhaps when an accident happened or so, why?? its because they are unconscious during that state.

Emusan:

@bold-you agree spirit also means a supernatural being....that is good....now when Bible says human being are gods, what make Man to be god?
And does this supernatural being possess human body?

Ans: The fact that we have control over so many things implies we are gods, authority also implies that.


According to you, this supernatural being; do they have flesh and bones?

Ans: I know they do have their spiritual bodies

Let's say it's a believe.....then who are those spirit in prison that Jesus went and preached to when He died? 1Peter 3:18-19
a)Wind
b)Air
c)supernatural being


Ans: c, more like demons

It means alot yet you discard it being "person".....

Ans: The spirit in man is not a person, simple

Emusan:

The question still remain, how did you know that Lazarus didn't see anything?
was Bible written because of Lazarus or everything that happened was recorded in the Bible?

Ans: if it was that important, it would have been mentioned

Same as above



False!!! go and read more about NDE
Does state of comma mean absent of LIFE? SMH
State of comma should tell you that "Life" is different from "consciousness"

Ans: yes I have read about NDEs, and I remember the lady saying she saw everyone that was dead including the ungodly in a white place.
I don't believe though
Another man said he just experienced peace, nothing else

haibe:
Ans: c, more like demons

Ans: The spirit in man is not a person, simple

Emusan:

Anyway it shows you don't read your Bible. Check any translation including NWT verse 20 says "The spirit are those who were once disobedient in time of Noah when they perished by the flood"



Then, which spirit did Jesus preach to?

haibe:

How absurd!! So Jesus went to preach to the dead who you believe are in hell?? So if they get converted God will transfer them from hell to heaven?

Even if the spirit here are not demons, they can't be dead humans in hell either.

A better interpretation is this:
The preaching was done "by the Spirit" (verse 18) in Noah's day to people who where then living (verses 19, 20).

The 'spirits in prison' could also refers to people whose lives 'were' in bondage to Satan but definitely not dead people.

Emusan:

Truly absurd...right?



Are Demons the one that perished in the flood?



Keep twisting the scriptures....
Whose spirit?



[size=14pt]PERISHED in the FLOOD[/size] is English a difficult language for you or the flood is a continous event?

haibe:

John experienced a vision in which God revealed a lot to him, every true christian can experience a vision.

Ranchhoddas: why is it so hard for you to give a straight answer?

Pastor Olu T: Flee the coming wrath!