nobilis:



My guy, go take a rest.

So, initially, God didn't create sin.
And according to ur bible, sin came into the world through one man, Adam, and destroyed the perfect nature of his creation.

Thank God you know that. The concept of free will at play.

Now he was fast enough to destroy the world in a flood because of sin but has decided to allow sin to continue to be in the world.
He hasn't even forgiven Adam's sin because he still ropes and yokes all the descendants of Adam into and with Original sin.
So that whether you commit any actual sin by your own self, or not, you're already a condemned sinner.

You atheists never cease to amuse me. When you find it hard to stay out of sin, the easiest way out is to put the blame on God. And this has gone along way to cloud your judgement, derail ur thoughts and misconstrue your perception. Ask yourself; What is Sin? What is it that amounts to Sin? Take that as an assignment, come back and tell me later. Once u have understood the nature of Sin and Sin itself, then you will understand why Sin was not the creation of God, why God have to destroy the first world as a result of sin, and most importantly, how and why Sin still persist till date in this present world. I shall be waiting!

On Adam, you are dead wrong, and it appears you don't even know a jot about Him,nor the position he had with Amighty God! Adam was created in the image and likeness of God (Gen.1vs26); and when the fall came in the garden, he lost his original estate with God as he fulfeited his right and the title deed of the world unto Satan, and consequently driven from the garden. But he never completely lost touch with God, neither did God forgot about him. Rather the contrary.
God was fully concerned with the happenings in Adam's life. In fact, there is evidence that God did indeed continue His relationship with Adam and his progeny. For example, the birth of Adam's sons- record of the events between Cain and Abel; God spoke with Cain, the birth of Seth, then Enos after which men started to CALL UPON THE NAME OF THE LORD. These are certainly an indication that there was indeed a relationship (foster by a sense of reconciliation that was now in progress) between God and man even after Adam sinned (what a powerful love of God).:'

Regarding Sin, God never forsook Adam and his progeny (s) thereafter, as his/their Sins where continually taken care of by the blood of animals (reconciliation in process). In the garden after the fall, God clothed them with animal skin; where did He get it? He vanished it from thin air? No! He probably 'killed' an animal. Adam was never neglected. Have you ever considered why Adam was not cursed 'directly'? Eve was cursed directly, and till date, the effect of that curse is very evident in her conception. The serpent nature today is evident of same direct curse. But when it came to Adam, the story was totally different. It was the earth that was cursed for his sake. Thorns and thirstles were to spring forth from the ground to make his work for food hard. He was to eat of the herbs of the field (as if it wasn't the same herbs that he was meant to eat in Gen.1 vs 29-30), And he is to return to the dust where he came from (as if that was the original nature of the man. Eccl.12vs7)
Adam was only cursed 'indirectly', he never was cursed directly. Why? Simple: he was the son of God (Luke 3vs38). And God can not lose His own (John 6 vs 37).

The full process of reconciliation and forgiveness was completed in Christ. Romans 5vs10, 2Cor.5vs18-20. But as man is still endue with his will in the dictate of his free moral agency, he is at liberty to decide. By one man's sin, death came, and by one man's death though with unsinful nature, life came-reconciliation perfected. So, if you feel you are still a condemned, unforgiven sinner, then that is what you chose to be by the dictates of your own will; not God's. 1 Tim.2vs4, 2Peter 3vs9.

So get ur acts together and embrace Christ.

And the reason he couldn't destroy sin, even as he destroyed the world with flood is just so that he can wait to see if any of his creatures will sin and then when they sin, he will also destroy them like he destroyed those people that perished in the flood.
He finds it very difficult to destroy sin but finds it very easy to kill his son because of sin

So he couldn't destroy sin but he could destroy the world because of sin.
He couldn't destroy sin but he could kill his son because of sin.
And the reason he couldn't or doesn't want to destroy sin is because he is looking for a bigger number of people to destroy in the future because of sin.

like i said, you are still understanding 'Sin'. You will need to improve on that, only then can you understand the role of His son in the whole show.

Honestly, sometimes I wonder if God is as daft as you guys portray him to be.


Unconditional love is a love without any conditions at all. And it is the perfect kind of love.
I don't have to do anything to merit it. If I have to do anything to merit it, then it is not unconditional.
It is now attached to a certain set of conditions.

Just like a mother's love for her child. The child has to do nothing to earn his mother's love. And the child knows (this is the wonderful part), that no matter what he does and no matter how angry his mother gets with him for what he does, she will still eventually forgive him.

Nobody here is projecting God as being daft, other than you and ur likes. And remember, we all shall give account of every idle and blasphemous word we use and say.

Yes! God's love is unconditional, and you did nothing to merit it. But why is it unconditional? God's love is unconditional because God don't give a dime about who you are or were, what you have done, or what you think--He chose to find you out by himself-"for while we are yet sinners, Christ died for Us". Reconciliation was God reconciling man to Himself, not man reconciling with him. All because God is love.

Few people nowadays understand what true love is, nor can they comprehend the unconditional love of God which sent Jesus to Calvary to die for our sins.
God's love is UNCONDITIONAL, i.e., it matters not who you are, nor what you have done-God still loves you! God doesn't love us for who we are; but rather, because
of WHO HE IS! Likewise, we ought to love others because
of who WE ARE; and not because of who they are, nor
what they do, nor what they think. God's love is
unconditional. I love even my enemies, because of the love of God shed abroad in my heart. Romans 5:5, “And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us.”

Your understanding of Unconditional love entails that since God is too loving, He can not punish you nor reprimand you for any wrong of commision or omission, even when you have come to understand the concept of grace vis the notion of good and evil. If that should be the case, then that will make God a lawless being: therefore an unruly God. But i thank God it isn't so.

God's uncomditional love meant He has called you (and still calling) into the kingdom of His dear Son, who is the way, the truth, and the life, to walk therein and live; not to continue in your formal lust or Sin and die again.

Just reconsider your hypothesis of a mother and child; the mother love the child no matter what, but that same mother will not hesitate to spank the child when he goes wrong. Why would he spank the child? Because there are RULES that must not be broken. Watch that same mother lashes out at that child when such laws are broken. Now, as the child grows (this is where time factor comes in to play) to that stage where he can exercise his will as a free moral agent, he becomes independent and self imposing; i.e, whether to conduct his ways after the pattern and nature of living taught by and learnt under the mother, or simply act and live according to his own preference and what seemed good in his eyes. And if it happens that such child chose the second way, and at the end landed in prison, dies, etc, would the mother be held responsible? Will her unconditional love be counted for vain? No! For her unconditional love was to save the child by showing her a better path to walk in, even when the child was rebellious, in prison, in sick bed, she was there for him, helping him, ministering to him, defending him, etc; until he finaly decided his fate.

So also is God. He chastises those that He love (Heb 12vs6, Pro.3vs12). His own law demanded punishment, yet out of love, he made a way of escape; and its only who will follow that path that shall find peace. Shall we continue in Sin that grace (love) may abound? And the Bible said " God forbid".

Only a fool would risk their eternal destiny on the
assumption that God would never cast anyone into
hellfire. Just look at the suffering in the world today
because of sin. Do you think eternity will be any
different for those who die in their sins? Oh, listen my
friend, please obey the Gospel so you don't end up in Hell. God Hates as Much as He Loves Although God loves all mankind; God also equally hates sin. God has an unconditional hatred for sin. It matters not how kind, generous and loving you may be-you will be cast into hellfire on Judgment Day if you refuse to obey the Gospel of Jesus Christ as the Bible commands (Revelation 20:11-15).

The Beatles sang their hit song, LOVE IS ALL YOU NEED. That is false. All the love in the world won't keep you out of Hell if you die in your sins.
You had better get born-again and then you can one day
die in the Lord and go to Heaven. “Blessed are the
dead which die in the Lord from henceforth: Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labours; and
their works do follow them” (Revelation 14:13). Every
person will one day either die IN THEIR SINS, or else they
will DIE IN THE LORD.God is a holy God, a morally perfect God who is incapable of doing wrong. God is a good God, whose
holiness demands justice. As such, sinful men must be
punished for violating God's holy Law. This is why we
read in Romans 6:23, “For the wages of sin is death...”
Mankind is inherently sinful and deserves to be punished in Hell. Adam brought sin and death into the world by
his own sin (Romans 5:12). We are all sinners, incapable of pleasing God in our own self-righteousness (Romans 3:10-23; Isaiah 64:6; Ephesians 2:8,9). Thankfully, God sent His only begotten Son into the world (John 3:16) to pay for our sins with His own blood (1st Peter 1:18,19; Acts 20:28). Jesus came into the world in the flesh, i.e., the Godhead became incarnate (John 1:1-3,14; 1st Timothy 3:16; Colossians
2:9). God did this because He loves us . . .

There is a time set when every thing will be winded up. So don't think God is slack or unable to deal with sin. There is time for everything. God works with time.

You guys use human justice systems to "analogise"
God's own justice system and yet fail to use human mercy in that analogy.

Even you, as a human being, can you watch your enemy suffering uninterruptedly for long periods of years without respite? Even if the person wiped away your family? Even if the person destroyed your career. Yea. U will be angry and hurt but after a while (maybe a year, 2 years, 3years, 5 years, 10 years), ur anger will calm down and u will subconsciously forgive that person.
So you see, Man cannot even be as cruel as that but u guys feel justified to attribute such cruelty to God.

Quite the contrary! You are the one using human system, thoughts, ways and behaviour to analogue and defines God's system of justice and pattern of doing things.

Like i said above, your understanding and acception of unconditional love entails that you can be wrong all through and God musn't give a dime about it. Thaty the love entails that one can continue in the ways that seemed right in his eyes all through his life, and there should be no penal code or restriction, even when it is inimical to his own being, not to talk of others. Your thesis on unconditional love, vis law and punishment, entails a complete realization of the Hobbesian state of nature. But unfortunately, it isn't so, and can never be so.

Brother, you are still understanding love. Once you are able to grasp the true meaning of love, you will then be able to comprehend the inalienable right of justice and judgement, pertaining to punishment.

May God grant you peace, grace and understanding to see through the fallacy of no consequence or reward for the life you live; amen!

And i will heed your advise to take a rest.

Godbless you! Stay well.

people deny hell some say it's forge but no one can tell if it's real or fake we have heard stories yea stories but stories can't be trusted we have king James . but people don't give a damm about it so what do we believe. Christians preach hell instead of salvation .atheist are clever when they argue with their life .Muslims add their own join . wentin we go believe .anyway if hell turns out to be real many people go burn oh.if na fake we go just die simple non existence so make I just dey hustle my own

Any man that says "God can not send people to hell for their sins"that same man is the ANTI-CHRIST,and so, that hell awaits him because he has succeded in overthrowing the faith of many.WARNING!!! let all that think they are wise be careful if not their wisdom will be turned into foolishness when eternity calls.REPENT!!! HELL IS TOO REAL TO BE FAKE.

Lol,the time most people would have used to roll their weaknesses to Christ through prayers,they came instead to argue what they have no understanding about.Defeat that weakness in you and you will change your ideas and conceptions about hell,lets not get too busy discusing unprofitable things but rather let's pursue after righteousness,purity, peace and holiness without which no man shall see the LORD.have a blessed week.

spencerwilliams:
Lol,the time most people would have used to roll their weaknesses to Christ through prayers,they came instead to argue what they have no understanding about.Defeat that weakness in you and you will change your ideas and conceptions about hell,lets not get too busy discusing unprofitable things but rather let's pursue after righteousness,purity, peace and holiness without which no man shall see the LORD.have a blessed week.

The fact is that you are only living in a sort of 'obedience' because of FEAR ! You are afraid that if you make a mistake and sin , you will be eligible for the lake of fire. This is not obeying God as a father because you love him, you try your best to obey because you are scared.

The biible says that whoever fears has not been made perfect in love.

What you are practising is self preservation to avoid punishment, it has nothing to do with a sacrificial love for others , it's about you making heaven and walking streets of gold while playing the harp for ever. You were called to make disciples of men even if it costs you everything.

You can argue from now till eternity but that does not change the fact that the hell fire doctrine is a DOCTRINE of DEMONS !

frosbel2:


The fact is that you are only living in a sort of 'obedience' because of FEAR ! You are afraid that if you make a mistake and sin , you will be eligible for the lake of fire. This is not obeying God as a father because you love him, you try your best to obey because you are scared.

The biible says that whoever fears has not been made perfect in love.

What you are practising is self preservation to avoid punishment, it has nothing to do with a sacrificial love for others , it's about you making heaven and walking streets of gold while playing the harp for ever. You were called to make disciples of men even if it costs you everything.

You can argue from now till eternity but that does not change the fact that the hell fire doctrine is a DOCTRINE of DEMONS !

One thing i always say that SIN is the cause of all these ideas if you are free from sin then you have no fear,you are likes that have tried to stop some particular sin and were unable maybe after series of efforts you came up with this ideology.Please just honestly answer this question:Was there ever a time in your life you beleived in hell i.e sinners going to hell?answer this question before i procede.

frosbel2, can you name ANY saint in either the OT or NT that was true to God ONLY because of fear of hell? Abraham? Isaac? Joseph?Enoch?Noah?Elijah?Job? (What motivated Job's retaining his integrity? Fear of hell?) Jeremiah?David?Isaiah?Ezekiel? etc or Peter, James,John,Paul,Timothy?

Or are there any of the contemporary heroes of the faith that were what they were simply because of ...'fear of hell'?



Besides, I ask again, what will be the end of the anti-christ and those who receives the mark? What will be the end of the devil and his angels?

Since you say hell is a doctrine of demons, what would be the end of those demons?

Scholar8200:
frosbel2, can you name ANY saint in either the OT or NT that was true to God ONLY because of fear of hell? Abraham? Isaac? Joseph?Enoch?Noah?Elijah?Job? (What motivated Job's retaining his integrity? Fear of hell?) Jeremiah?David?Isaiah?Ezekiel? etc or Peter, James,John,Paul,Timothy?

Or are there any of the contemporary heroes of the faith that were what they were simply because of ...'fear of hell !



Besides, I ask again, what will be the end of the anti-christ and those who receives the mark? What will be the end of the devil and his angels?

Since you say hell is a doctrine of demons, what would be the end of those demons?

None of the people you mentioned believed in a mythical hell!

frosbel2:


None of the people you mentioned believed in a mythical hell!

They did! Can you prove your claim?

spencerwilliams:
One thing i always say that SIN is the cause of all these ideas if you are free from sin then you have no fear,you are likes that have tried to stop some particular sin and were unable maybe after series of efforts you came up with this ideology.
Please just honestly answer this question:Was there ever a time in your life you beleived in hell i.e sinners going to hell?answer this question before i procede.

We serve God out of love not fear of hell .

Stop painting God as a monster . Stop equating him with wicked Nebuchadnezzar roasting humans in blazing fire .

Am still wondering why none of you could punish your sons and daughters by roasting them in fire if truly you are created in the image of a God that would do so .

Some pertinent scriptures:

Matthew23:33 - "You serpents, you brood of vipers, how are you to escape being sentenced to hell?"

Matthew 25:41 - "Then he will say to those on his left, 'Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.

Luke12:5 - "But I will warn you whom to fear: fear him who, after he has killed, has authority to cast into hell. Yes, I tell you, fear him!"


2 Peter 2:4 - "For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but cast them into hell and committed them to chains of gloomy darkness to be kept until the judgment;"

MizJanet:


Gosh! use your brain , a dead body is a corpse .

Your difficulty in comprehending basic language in my post stems from your narrow perception of mind. Whatever you understand from what I wrote is strictly - You Are On Your Own.

trustman:
Some pertinent scriptures:

Matthew23:33 - "You serpents, you brood of vipers, how are you to escape being sentenced to hell?"

Matthew 25:41 - "Then he will say to those on his left, 'Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.

Luke12:5 - "But I will warn you whom to fear: fear him who, after he has killed, has authority to cast into hell. Yes, I tell you, fear him!"


2 Peter 2:4 - "For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but cast them into hell and committed them to chains of gloomy darkness to be kept until the judgment;"

Despite the fact that it is plainly written in the Word of God, not as parable but as a fact, that hell exists as a place of eternal torment, some people without reasoning will interpret a plain language to mean something other than its original meaning thereby deceiving many and dragging them along to their destruction.

CaptainJune:


[s]
Your difficulty in comprehending basic language in my post stems from your narrow perception of mind. Whatever you understand from what I wrote is strictly - You Are On Your Own. [/s]

So silly , how can you use dead body while talking about spiritual death ? Guy , you are the confuse person

Jozzy4:


So silly , how can you use dead body while talking about spiritual death ? Guy , you are the confuse person

Quote my post in question where I talked about 'real death' in relation to spiritual death.

CaptainJune:


Quote my post in question where I talked about 'real death' in relation to spiritual death.

crucifying sinful desires mixed with dead body , height of confusion ,

Captain June

In conclusion, as you crucify your fleshly or sinful desires daily, you die to sin, and since sin has no power over a dead body , you become free from it .

Imagine crucifying your sinful desires mean you are a dead body .

Thats nonsense .