See the above

The above is a confirmation that your "god" give order to kill and is himself a killer. What kind of god is that?. And again your are going to tell me that I biaised the words in your bible or that when your "god" ordered the killing of innocents babys it was out of "contex".

JeSoul:

Once you've stripped yourself all your bias and prejudice against God and the bible and can be somewhat objective please re-ask the above questions and I am sure one of us christians will be glad do our best and answer.
See the above.

We've done that times without number. Toneyb knows quite well he is only repeating the same thing over and over again. I've taken the pains to go over many of the old testament commandments to kill entire tribes and the reason behind it.
A few days ago we dealt with the canaanites and the jebusites.

These folks with stone hearts are not interested in learning . . . they just fill up space with the same nonsense. I'm not sure they even read the responses.

I've taken the pains to go over many of the old testament commandments to kill entire tribes and the reason behind it.

So what is the reason behind all this evil killing of innocent people?.

Horus:

So what is the reason behind all this evil killing of innocent people?.

Even if i told you . . . you'd still repeat the question tomorrow.

davidylan:

Even if i told you . . . you'd still repeat the question tomorrow.

Why do you think that?. You should not have any particular opinion about me, I am not here to harm anybody, I just like to deal with Facts and Facts only.

Horus:

Why do you think that?. You should not have any particular opinion about me, I am not here to harm anybody, I just like to deal with Facts and Facts only.

Where have i heard this before? Oh yeah from hux, toneyb . . . and countless others who repeat the same mindless questions again and again and again regardless of how many times you respond to them.

davidylan:

We've done that times without number. Toneyb knows quite well he is only repeating the same thing over and over again. I've taken the pains to go over many of the old testament commandments to kill entire tribes and the reason behind it.

You have taken no pain to go through nothing. All you did was give ridiculous "reasons" for your god telling his chosen men of Israel to kill others. Why is it wrong for allah to tell his men to kill off unbelivers and right for your god to do the same?

A few days ago we dealt with the canaanites and the jebusites.

only because you see those as reasons. when is unbelief a reason to kill off others? Why not preach to them if your god is a loving god?. 

These folks with stone hearts are not interested in learning . . . they just fill up space with the same nonsense. I'm not sure they even read the responses.

Interested in learning what? You believe that what is written in the bible is true even when it does'nt make any sense.  The person that has a stone heart is you who sees the nonsense in other people's faith but fail to see the nonsense in yours.

toneyb:

You have taken no pain to go through nothing. All you did was give ridiculous "reasons" for your god telling the his chosen men of Israel to kill others. Why isit wrong for allah to tell his men to kill off unbelivers and right for your god to do the same?

If by "ridiculous" you mean bible-based FACTUAL ANSWERS that unfortunately do not affirm your pre-existing bias, then so be it.

davidylan:

If by "ridiculous" you mean bible-based FACTUAL ANSWERS that unfortunately do not affirm your pre-existing bias, then so be it.

This was not directed at me but let me jump in here. The question is not whether there are reasons or not. the question is whether those reasons are good, justified and founded on rational basis. You begin with your own bias that the bible is the word of God and hence it is true. As Mazaje said on the other thread the bible was written by human beings, so you have NO examples of a god giving any moral commands to any body. All you have is an ancient society deciding what actions are anti-social, or social and ancient humans deciding what actions are humane and inhumane, acceptable and unacceptable and ascribing it to their god like every other society that have a god do.

We don't know what state of mind these people were in when they wrote what ever they wrote, we don't know how they distorted the facts to make them look good. I don't believe in any god but lets assume that I do, any God that does what the Old testament God did is an evil God. By the way Just as toneyb has noted the Old Testament God admitted that he did evil and he apologized for it.

"Thus says the Lord, the God of Israel, to whom you sent me to offer your prayer: If you remain quietly in this land I will build you up, and not tear you down; I will plant you, not uproot you; for I regret the evil I have done you."(Jeremiah 42:9-10)

JeSoul:

Sarcasm thinly veiled as conversation/discussion. Sorry brotha, of such, I refuse to be a participant.

Ouch   , that hurt, that wasn't sarcastic now was it? well if people can so much read any meaning into the words of the omnieverything god (whose word should be law as you say) why should a mere mortal like me expect any better treatment?
Strip away the layers of perceived sarcasm and the truth is as clear as day. God is man's creation hence the reason why he is evil, his creators are evil see?

revenge:

@poster , Thunder wil strike you one day, remember Curse god and Die, i pity your soul

davidylan:

Where have i heard this before? Oh yeah from hux, toneyb . . . and countless others who repeat the same mindless questions again and again and again regardless of how many times you respond to them.

Me too have i heard this before? NO ANSWER to the question again and again and again regardless of how many times you ask them an explanation about why your god is telling his "chosen" killers to kill  innocents babys,childrens,womans,elders, what kind of "god" is that?. If it is the way your "god" is showing his "love" I wonder what it will be when this same "god" will show his anger?. What is next?, a Genocide?

davidylan:

Be afraid . . . be very afraid . . . God is "evil" and He will burn all sinners in hell.
This thread will stand against you on that day. Be very afraid.

You seem to revel in that thought.

This is what I dont get about you religious fuccs. Often in the mind state of ''I love Jesus, I love all human beings, Die non-believer ''.

You're supposed to be on the higher moral peddlestool yet you always rub your hands with glee when talking about how us ''non-believers'' will get it on ''that day''and so on.

Some disturbing ish man

You must be a Black pieces of shit bitch!,i wonder what you even know in this world,really dont get it twisted,you are a big FOOL !!!!!!!!.,and if you dont take you fake time im going to cast raw spell on you where_ever you are located around these planert ,now explain me what a hell you know about "religion"-[b]F[/b]uck the God  you're saving,Im more than him,im GOD and the I AM THAT I AM!, now you are the one to Die  since you are already insulting God,"i sent a wicked thunder to trace you right there in your house"-so that in your next life you wont dream to play with spiritual discussion.,
OshiezÖ_gieto

revenge:

@poster , Thunder wil strike you one day, remember Curse god and Die, i pity your soul

God is evil?Well,it all depends on what is referred to as GOD here.The "one true God" is as many as there are humans.The god of the OT is just another one of them.If that creature is whom you guys are referring to as evil,then,according to the OT,He was evil.But to even call that creature "God" is a blasphemy.
I think modern christians are already regretting that the early christian fathers did not take the lead of Marcion and barnished this ancient albatros of a deity from their holy texts.It would have been a whole lot more convenient for modern christians today.
Having to explain away all those atrrocities committed by this socalled "god of love" is nigh impossible,no matter how hard any christian or jew tries.
Davidylan is battling an already lost and hopeless battle of trying to explain away those attrocities because there is no explaining them away.

davidylan:

Even if i told you . . . you'd still repeat the question tomorrow.

So in other words you dont know. Stop frontin and admit you lost here.

Just a simple answer and this thread could have been over a long time ago.

jagunlabi:

God is evil?Well,it all depends on what is referred to as GOD here.The "one true God" is as many as there are humans.The god of the OT is just another one of them.If that creature is whom you guys are referring to as evil,then,according to the OT,He was evil.But to even call that creature "God" is a blasphemy.
I[b] think modern christians are already regretting that the early christian fathers did not take the lead of Marcion and barnished this ancient albatros of a deity from their holy texts.It would have been a whole lot more convenient for modern christians today.[/b]
Having to explain away all those atrrocities committed by this socalled "god of love" is nigh impossible,no matter how hard any christian or jew tries.
Davidylan is battling an already lost and hopeless battle of trying to explain away those attrocities because there is no explaining them away.

Lol . . . is this what atheists tell themselves to cajole themselves into believing christians 'avoid' the OT?

JeSoul:

Lol . . . is this what atheists tell themselves to cajole themselves into believing christians 'avoid' the OT?

Through out my life as a Christian no body has ever told me that the god of the OT accepts human sacrifice.

At the LORD's command, a man of God from Judah went to Bethel, and he arrived there just as Jeroboam was approaching the altar to offer a sacrifice.  Then at the LORD's command, he shouted, "O altar, altar!  This is what the LORD says: A child named Josiah will be born into the dynasty of David.  On you he will sacrifice the priests from the pagan shrines who come here to burn incense, and human bones will be burned on you."  (1 Kings 13:1-2)

He [Josiah] executed the priests of the pagan shrines on their own altars, and he burned human bones on the altars to desecrate them.  Finally, he returned to Jerusalem.  King Josiah then issued this order to all the people: "You must celebrate the Passover to the LORD your God, as it is written in the Book of the Covenant."  There had not been a Passover celebration like that since the time when the judges ruled in Israel, throughout all the years of the kings of Israel and Judah.  This Passover was celebrated to the LORD in Jerusalem during the eighteenth year of King Josiah's reign.  Josiah also exterminated the mediums and psychics, the household gods, and every other kind of idol worship, both in Jerusalem and throughout the land of Judah.  He did this in obedience to all the laws written in the scroll that Hilkiah the priest had found in the LORD's Temple.  Never before had there been a king like Josiah, who turned to the LORD with all his heart and soul and strength, obeying all the laws of Moses.  And there has never been a king like him since.  (2 Kings 23:20-25 )

"Suppose you hear in one of the towns the LORD your God is giving you that some worthless rabble among you have led their fellow citizens astray by encouraging them to worship foreign gods.  In such cases, you must examine the facts carefully.  If you find it is true and can prove that such a detestable act has occurred among you, you must attack that town and completely destroy all its inhabitants, as well as all the livestock.  Then you must pile all the plunder in the middle of the street and burn it.  Put the entire town to the torch as a burnt offering to the LORD your God.  That town must remain a ruin forever; it may never be rebuilt.  Keep none of the plunder that has been set apart for destruction.  Then the LORD will turn from his fierce anger and be merciful to you.  He will have compassion on you and make you a great nation, just as he solemnly promised your ancestors.  "The LORD your God will be merciful only if you obey him and keep all the commands I am giving you today, doing what is pleasing to him."  (Deuteronomy 13:13-19)

Then, with Micah's idols and his priest, the men of Dan came to the town of Laish, whose people were peaceful and secure.  They attacked and killed all the people and burned the town to the ground.  There was no one to rescue the residents of the town, for they lived a great distance from Sidon and had no allies nearby.  This happened in the valley near Beth-rehob.Then the people of the tribe of Dan rebuilt the town and lived there.  They renamed the town Dan after their ancestor, Israel's son, but it had originally been called Laish.

The bible even acknowledge that the chosen men of Yahweh attacked a town that was peaceful and secure, killed all the people and took over their land, their only reason was that the other people worshipped a different god. As toneyb has said why not preach to them why kill them and burn off their town? these passages are NEVER mentioned in churches. There are SO many Christians that do not know that such passages exist in the "Holy" bible.

The old testament god sends a lion to kill a man because he refused to beat up another man.

Meanwhile, the LORD instructed one of the group of prophets to say to another man, "Strike me!"  But the man refused to strike the prophet.  Then the prophet told him, "Because you have not obeyed the voice of the LORD, a lion will kill you as soon as you leave me."  And sure enough, when he had gone, a lion attacked and killed him.    (1 Kings 20:35-36 )

Yahew the advocate of racism, death, slavery and more death. Why not preach to them? why kill them?

When the LORD your God brings you into the land you are about to enter and occupy, he will clear away many nations ahead of you: the Hittites, Girgashites, Amorites, Canaanites, Perizzites, Hivites, and Jebusites. These seven nations are all more powerful than you.  When the LORD your God hands these nations over to you and you conquer them, you must completely destroy them.  Make no treaties with them and show them no mercy.  Do not intermarry with them, and don't let your daughters and sons marry their sons and daughters.  They will lead your young people away from me to worship other gods.   Then the anger of the LORD will burn against you, and he will destroy you.   (Deuteronomy 7:1-4)

Religion is a very sweet delusion as some one pointed out on the other thread. The face of Christians turn red when they hear of the "atrocities" attributed to Allah, but they don't even flinch when hearing about how God/Jehovah slaughtered all the babies in the OT or the elimination of entire ethnic groups including innocent women and children. The old testament God advocates lies, rape, slavery and murder.

Since all most atheists on NL do is copy and paste and reiterate the same arguements and points of contention . . . I will copy and paste and reiterate the same answers many of us christians have given to you. No be only una sabi ctrl+c and ctrl+v.

  For starters go to this most recent thread  https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-273481.0.html   David & Bobbyaf discussed on the OT. Search my sister Pilgrims name, she has discussed with more detail on several OT topics than anyone can handle. No need for repetition.

When someone comes up with a fresh perspective or issue or question, it shall be deserving of a fresh response.

jesoul - what OT laws do you abide by?

as i have said, the Christian God isn't the all powerful all knowing god if he doesn't have the capability to do evil.

bawomolo:

jesoul - what OT laws do you abide by?

as i have said, the Christian God isn't the all powerful all knowing god if he doesn't have the capability to do evil.

This mean that this Christian god is also an evil-minded god.

JeSoul:

Since all most atheists on NL do is copy and paste and reiterate the same arguements and points of contention . . . I will copy and paste and reiterate the same answers many of us christians have given to you. No be only una sabi ctrl+c and ctrl+v.

For starters go to this most recent thread https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-273481.0.html David & Bobbyaf discussed on the OT. Search my sister Pilgrims name, she has discussed with more detail on several OT topics than anyone can handle. No need for repetition.

When someone comes up with a fresh perspective or issue or question, it shall be deserving of a fresh response.

You have not responded in any way, all you guys do is give excuses that MAKE no sense for example, Christians go around haranguing the prophet of Islam for marrying a 9year old girl, no matter how the moslems explain Christians never buy what ever the moslems say. But the same Christians have forgotten that their own father Abraham was an incestuous person. Christians give explanations like Ohh in those days God allowed incest because he wants the tribe or blood of the tribe to be strong. as if that is an answer. Who tells you guys that in the days of mohammed pedophilia was a crime? I hear Christians say that Allah ordered the indiscriminate killings of people in the Koran, but the OT god did the same thing too. I respect the Muslims for one thing, they own up to the koran more than Christians own up to the bible.

Christians always give ridiculous excuses for the very embarassing parts of the bible by saying "Ohh the passage is not meant to be taken literally or "it is an allegory" as if that is a sincere explanation. When faced with those embarassing parts of the bible the answers are always "ohh that is the old testament". that is not an answer because why did the OT god give out very sexist laws? why did he tell people to steal? why did he encourage people to tell lies? why did he tell people to kill their family members for no reason at all?

(Moses) stood at the entrance to the camp and shouted, "All of you who are on the LORD's side, come over here and join me." And all the Levites came. He told them, "This is what the LORD, the God of Israel, says: Strap on your swords! Go back and forth from one end of the camp to the other, killing even your brothers, friends, and neighbors." The Levites obeyed Moses, and about three thousand people died that day. Then Moses told the Levites, "Today you have been ordained for the service of the LORD, for you obeyed him even though it meant killing your own sons and brothers. Because of this, he will now give you a great blessing." (Exodus 32:26-29)

Then again Christians go around trying to sell the same OT god as a good, just, merciful and loving god .

I am the LORD, I change not. therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed.”Malachi 3:6
James 1:17: "Every good and perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of the heavenly lights, who does not change like shifting shadows."

As toneyb said on the other thread what evidence is there for its truthfulness of Malachi 3:6 and James 1:17 when we have the bible God changing his position all over the bible?

the same bible says that his OT laws were perfect.

Psalms 19:7 The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul: the testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple

Jagunlabi says it best when he said that most modern christians are already regretting that the early christian fathers did not take the lead of Marcion and barnished this ancient albatros of a deity from their holy texts. Even Christian apologist lwhen debating the existence god begin by saying that they are not here to debate the OT morality there are just there to debate the existence of god.

bawomolo:

jesoul - what OT laws do you abide by?

   By OT laws do you mean the set of commands God gave the Isrealites? If so then I don't abide by any of them. We're taught in the NT that those laws were for a season and pointed to Jesus Christ who would come and replace them, giving us a better way of being justified by faith instead of by our actions.

  Now that being said there are many elements of the Law which still hold value today. When the Law says do not steal, kill or covet etc there is instrinsic value in such commands. And When we see commands of the Law echoed in the NT then it is obviously still valid and I by God's grace live by them.

as i have said, the Christian God isn't the all powerful all knowing god if he doesn't have the capability to do evil.

  Why? becos Bawo says so?
As I submitted to you before and will quote it:

As I pointed out look at the natural disasters God carried out in the OT. They are all meted out as punishment.  Is it evil for a judge to condemn a serial killer to death? For the courts to send to deathrow the soul who rapes and murders a child? In the same way it is not evil for God to punish those people as He saw fit for their atrocious transgressions.
You and others may not accept it by your earthly moral 'standards' but this is the biblical explanation and position for why God did those things.

  This is not a God who is bored and starts wacking innocent people just to show off. The bible even says God hates the death of the evil man.

Ezekiel 18:23
Do I take any pleasure in the death of the wicked? declares the Sovereign LORD. Rather, am I not pleased when they turn from their ways and live?

Ezekiel 33:11
Say to them, 'As surely as I live, declares the Sovereign LORD, I take no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but rather that they turn from their ways and live. Turn! Turn from your evil ways! Why will you die, O house of Israel?'

Now that being said there are many elements of the Law which still hold value today. When the Law says do not steal, kill or covet etc there is instrinsic value in such commands.

how do you determine which has value and which doesn't.  would an OT law on tattoo's matter?

  This is not a God who is bored and starts wacking innocent people just to show off. The bible even says God hates the death of the evil man.

is it necessary to kill people just because they worship another God? is it that serious.

Are you saying Justifiable homicide isn't evil in nature?

JeSoul:

  This is not a God who is bored and starts wacking innocent people just to show off. The bible even says God hates the death of the evil man.

Only that the bible tells a very different story. The bible even says that God makes wicked people for his own pleasure.

The Lord has made everything for his own ends, even the wicked for the evil day.Proverbs 16:4

so the bible also tells a very different story from what you are asserting.

will make Mount Seir utterly desolate, killing off all who try to escape and any who return.  I will fill your mountains with the dead. Your hills, your valleys, and your streams will be filled with people slaughtered by the sword.  I will make you desolate forever. Your cities will never be rebuilt. Then you will know that I am the LORD.   (Ezekiel 35:7-9)

if this passage doesn't show that the OT god loves killing unbelivers then I don't know what does. What a way for people to know that you are their lord.

This verse also shows that the OT god loves killing unbelievers and is happy when they are killed.

"Then I heard the LORD say to the other men, "Follow him through the city and kill everyone whose forehead is not marked. Show no mercy; have no pity! Kill them all – old and young, girls and women and little children. But do not touch anyone with the mark. Begin your task right here at the Temple." So they began by killing the seventy leaders. "Defile the Temple!" the LORD commanded. "Fill its courtyards with the bodies of those you kill! Go!" So they went throughout the city and did as they were told."   (Ezekiel 9:5-7)

Ezekiel 18:23
Do I take any pleasure in the death of the wicked? declares the Sovereign LORD. Rather, am I not pleased when they turn from their ways and live?

Ezekiel 33:11
Say to them, 'As surely as I live, declares the Sovereign LORD, I take no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but rather that they turn from their ways and live. Turn! Turn from your evil ways! Why will you die, O house of Israel?'

The bible was wrıtten by very different men who all have very different pespectıve of who their god is and how they believe he should operate. Hence the contradictions and confusion. The writer of Ezekiel has a very different view of God compared to say the writer of levitıcus or Judges. those differences are there for all to see. Some of the OT writers belıeve that God is responsible or punishes them when ever they see bad thıngs happenıng to them while others blame other people for thier problems.   juxtapose the verse you quoted ın Ezekiel with the one below and tell me ıf the OT god does not revel in kıllıng peopleç

"The glory of Israel will fly away like a bird, for your children will die at birth or perish in the womb or never even be conceived.  Even if your children do survive to grow up, I will take them from you.  It will be a terrible day when I turn away and leave you alone.  I have watched Israel become as beautiful and pleasant as Tyre.  But now Israel will bring out her children to be slaughtered."  O LORD, what should I request for your people?  I will ask for wombs that don't give birth and breasts that give no milk.  The LORD says, "All their wickedness began at Gilgal; there I began to hate them.  I will drive them from my land because of their evil actions.  I will love them no more because all their leaders are rebels.  The people of Israel are stricken.  Their roots are dried up; they will bear no more fruit.  And if they give birth, I will slaughter their beloved children."    (Hosea 9:11-16)

Cursed be he who does the Lords work remissly, cursed he who holds back his sword from blood.   (Jeremiah 48:10)

i.e You have to kill.

For since with this city, which is called by my name, I begin to inflict evil, how can you possibly be spared?  You shall not be spared!  I will call down the sword upon all who inhabit the earth, says the Lord of hosts.

This passage even says that the OT god inflicts evil himself.

Here are the OT gods happy killers.

Praise the LORD!  Sing to the LORD a new song.  Sing his praises in the assembly of the faithful.  O Israel, rejoice in your Maker.  O people of Jerusalem, exult in your King.  Praise his name with dancing, accompanied by tambourine and harp.  For the LORD delights in his people; he crowns the humble with salvation.  Let the faithful rejoice in this honor.  Let them sing for joy as they lie on their beds.  Let the praises of God be in their mouths, and a sharp sword in their hands – to execute vengeance on the nations and punishment on the peoples, to bind their kings with shackles and their leaders with iron chains, to execute the judgment written against them.  This is the glory of his faithful ones.  Praise the LORD!   (Psalms 149:1-9)

For every OT passage you provide that says the OT god does not like killing people i can ALWAYS provide much more that says otherwise.

JeSoul:

   This is not a God who is bored and starts wacking innocent people just to show off. The bible even says God hates the death of the evil man.

The bible also says that he loves wacking innocent people.

Then the LORD said to me, "Son of man, give the people this message from the LORD: A sword is being sharpened and polished.  It is being prepared for terrible slaughter; it will flash like lightning!  Now will you laugh?  Those far stronger than you have fallen beneath its power!  Yes, the sword is now being sharpened and polished; it is being prepared for the executioner!  "Son of man, cry out and wail; pound your thighs in anguish, for that sword will slaughter my people and their leaders – everyone will die!  It will put them all to the test! So now the Sovereign LORD asks: What chance do they have?  "Son of man, prophesy to them and clap your hands vigorously.  Then take the sword and brandish it twice, even three times, to symbolize the great massacre they will face!  Let their hearts melt with terror, for the sword glitters at every gate.  It flashes like lightning; it is polished for slaughter!  O sword, slash to the right, and slash to the left, wherever you will, wherever you want.  I, too, will clap my hands, and I will satisfy my fury.  I, the LORD, have spoken!"   (Ezekiel 21:8-17)

The OT god is very happy when he kills people, he even claps his hands in happiness when he kills. As tonneyb has said you can quote passages that talk about the OT god not happy with killing people and i can also quote verses from the OT which says he is VERY happy to kill unbelievers.

The LORD answered: Because they have abandoned my law, which I set before them, and have not followed it or listened to my voice, but followed rather the hardness of their hearts and the Baals, as their fathers had taught them; therefore, thus says the LORD of hosts, the God of Israel: See now, I will give them wormwood to eat and poison to drink.  I will scatter them among nations whom neither they nor their fathers have known; I will send the sword to pursue them until I have completely destroyed them.   (Jeremiah 9:12-15)

Those killed by the sword are far better off than those who die of hunger, wasting away for want of food.  Tenderhearted women have cooked their own children and eaten them in order to survive the siege.  But now the anger of the LORD is satisfied.  His fiercest anger has now been poured out.  He started a fire in Jerusalem that burned the city to its foundations. (Lamentations 4:9-11)

The OT god's anger is only satisfied when he spills the blood of unbelivers(mostly innocent women and children). so you are VERY wrong when you say that the bible says otherwise. For every bible passage that you quote to show that the OT god is good there are many more as toneyb has said that say otherwise. He is even happy that women eat their children because of hunger.

Toneyb & Bindex
    I'm sure you lovely fellas feel passionately about the subject but please re-submit your perceived grievances against God and bible when you can be somewhat objective in a discussion.

Bawo,

bawomolo:

how do you determine which has value and which doesn't.  would an OT law on tattoo's matter?

 I'm glad you asked. Remember this topic? https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-267506.0.html#msg3808956

is it necessary to kill people just because they worship another God? is it that serious.

 Of course not and I'm not sure where you're getting this. Jesus teaches us to love those who hate us. And while this may seem to clash with the OT God if you look closely it really doesn't.

The problem a lotta people have reconciling the supposed contradicting nature of the God of the OT and NT is simple: we have this twisted idea that God should be all love and never angry. That He should be only dishing out good but never "evil" as in punishment for wrong doing. And when this made-up round God doesn't fit into the square bible we then proceed to declare Him "evil" or "non-existent".

Are you saying Justifiable homicide isn't evil in nature?

  Well I can certainly see how it can be argued that way. However I would counter by asking to look instead at the big picture. I may be committing an "evil" towards one who is more than deserving of it but I am doing a good that by miles and lightyears overshadows any negative.

I would feel zero remorse if I killed a man who was trying to murder my mother or father, or if I stopped a rapist from destroying a young child, or towards the suicide bomber on death row who killed innocent people.

If you can explain the OT god's wickedness away like this,then definitely you'll have to accept the same explanations for other gods,including the arabic god,Allah.No?

JeSoul:

The problem a lotta people have reconciling the supposed contradicting nature of the God of the OT and NT is simple: we have this twisted idea that God should be all love and never angry. That He should be only dishing out good but never "evil" as in punishment for wrong doing. And when this made-up round God doesn't fit into the square bible we then proceed to declare Him "evil" or "non-existent".     Well I can certainly see how it can be argued that way. However I would counter by asking to look instead at the big picture. I may be committing an "evil" towards one who is more than deserving of it but I am doing a good that by miles and lightyears overshadows any negative.

I would feel zero remorse if I killed a man who was trying to murder my mother or father, or if I stopped a rapist from destroying a young child, or towards the suicide bomber on death row who killed innocent people.

JeSoul:

Toneyb & Bindex
I'm sure you lovely fellas feel passionately about the subject but please re-submit your perceived grievances against God and bible when you can be somewhat objective in a discussion.

I dont feel passionatley against this subject, you said that the OT god does not feel happy when he kills people and i just pointed that to be a very wrong statement using the bible.

Psalms 137: 8-9 "O daughter of Babylon, who art to be destroyed; happy shall he be, that rewardeth thee as thou hast served us. Happy shall he be, that taketh and dasheth thy little ones against the stones."

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So there it is again for you.

The problem a lotta people have reconciling the supposed contradicting nature of the God of the OT and NT is simple: we have this twisted idea that God should be all love and never angry. That He should be only dishing out good but never "evil" as in punishment for wrong doing. And when this made-up round God doesn't fit into the square bible we then proceed to declare Him "evil" or "non-existent".

Only that the OT god goes around killing people that commited no wrong at all. What did the babies do wrong? There are passages in the bible where the OT god tells his chosen men to kill entire cities just because a few of the people living in the cities entice his chosen men and tell make them serve other gods. I should expect a just god to kill only the culprits(by the way when has worshipping other gods become a crime that deserves the death penalty, you guys don't ever accept the same explanations for the moslems do you?)

I would feel zero remorse if I killed a man who was trying to murder my mother or father, or if I stopped a rapist from destroying a young child, or towards the suicide bomber on death row who killed innocent people.

The only problem is that your god told his chosen men to, rape women, murder the parents of others and steal their properties and i will be happy to provide bible verses for you.

The Lord is a man of war: The Lord is his name (Exodus 15:3). The Aramic (Hebrew) word used for war in this quote is milkhawmaw meaning “battle, war.” Then if you go to Exodus 26:25, God says “I (God) will bring a sword (khehreb) upon you, , I will send pestilence (dehber “cattle disease”) among you; , ” However, in Exodus 20:13, God commands the children of Israel “thou shalt not kill.” Which contradicts Exodus 32:27-28 where God says “, Thus saith the Lord God of Israel, put every man his sword by his side, and go in and out from gate to gate throughout the camp, and slay every man his brother, and every man his companion, and every man his neighbour, and there fell of the people that day about three thousand men.” By using the word “fell,” they mean, “killed dead by God’s command.” So your God just order’s people he created killed. Not helped or changed, but turn’s men into killers, and other men killed. Think ,this is a good, loving, caring God, right?. Wrong. This is the Devil. The Bible is a book of the Devil doing all Kinds of evil as God.

Bindex you keep raising the same points and I'll keep giving you the same answer: I cannot "discuss" with you becos it is apparent you cannot be objective and approach the subject matter divorced from your prejudice.

It would only be an exercise in futility and I don't want to waste both your time and mine. Please see the below quote

JeSoul:

Since all most atheists on NL do is copy and paste and reiterate the same arguements and points of contention . . . I will copy and paste and reiterate the same answers many of us christians have given to you. No be only una sabi ctrl+c and ctrl+v.

For starters go to this most recent thread https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-273481.0.html David & Bobbyaf discussed on the OT. Search my sister Pilgrims name, she has discussed with more detail on several OT topics than anyone can handle. No need for repetition.

When someone comes up with a fresh perspective or issue or question, it shall be deserving of a fresh response.

Cheers.

jagunlabi:

If you can explain the OT god's wickedness away like this,then definitely you'll have to accept the same explanations for other gods,including the arabic god,Allah.No?

   I don't know enough about the core concepts of Islam to say with authority what their position is on the matter. But I guess I do submit another person could very well put forth my argument as justification for the 'actions' of their god. It doesn't mean I have to accept it, just like you don't have to accept mine either.

  However I always come back to this. What was the context in which this supposed "wickedness" happened? All to often antagonists only choose to focus on the cop who killed the burgler instead of sympathising with the trail of victims the criminal left in his wake AND the future victims the cop's actions have prevented. Too often they misplace their compassion with the murderer instead of the judge rightly sends him to death row.