[size=20pt]The Man Who Rewrote Genesis.[/size]

Septuagenarian Modupe Oduyoye is an exegete, language expert, polyglot etc., all rolled into one. In this piece, Yemi Ogunsola examines how this international scholar explores many African and Semitic languages to shed new light on the Book of Genesis and many difficult Yoruba words.BY YEMI OGUNSOLA

https://yemitom./2012/05/05/on-modupe-oduyoyes-review-of-genesis/

When in 1972, Modupe Oduyoye, language expert and exegete, unleashed his book “The Vocabulary of Yoruba Religious Discourse” on the public, it sent shock waves throughout the linguistic community. Exegetes are experts who undertake critical study of texts, especially the Bible.

Oduyoye’s theories were bold, daring. He seemed to harbor no reverence for any hallowed folk etymology, but what his phonological tools told him. He challenged and often discreditedmany conventional etymological conclusions of the time.

However, his arguments were difficult to fault. They were intellectually water-tight and many times air-tight.

For one, they demolished once and for all, all notions that a ‘monolingual” approach is sufficient to find the root meanings (etymology) of difficult words in Yoruba – or any language for that matter. In many of his explanations of Yoruba words, Oduyoye drew from languages from outside Yoruba.

Secondly, Oduyoye demonstrated most vividly, the relationship, already acknowledged by language experts, between Semitic languages like Hebrew, Akkadian, Aramaic, Ugaritic, and many African languages like Hausa, Tiv. Efik, Yoruba, Ibibio, Igbo, Fon, Twi etc.

Oduyoye’s book was actually in response to the publication in 1969 of the report of the first consultation of African theologians held in Ibadan in 1966 with the title: “Biblical Revelations and African Beliefs.”

The report was subsequently recommended for the General Assembly of the All African Congress of Churches in September 1969. Oduyoye read and reviewed the publication.

Contributors to the conference included eminent scholars like the late Professor Bolaji idowu; Rev. E.A.A. Adegbola and Monsignor (Ezeanya. Oduyoye wasn’t very satisfied with many of the conclusions.Now he joined the “fray” armed to the teeth.

Oduyoye had studied Hebrew at Yale in 1964, Comparative Semitic Linguistics at the Linguistics Institute of the Linguistics Society of America on a grant from the American Council of Learned Societies in 1965, Arabic at Yale from 1965 to 1966 and Middle Egyptian in London from 1969 to1970. Added to this was his intimate knowledge of the traditions of his people, the Yoruba, a considerable knowledge of many Nigerian and African languages and a passionate curiosity about words and their origins. So Oduyoye undertook a review of the theological conference with the best tools.

While the scholars who contributed papers at the conference put up commendable efforts, Oduyoye could see that they were sorely limited by their, mostly monolingual tools.Oduyoye’s tool was different. It was comparative theology at its keenest. With profuse references to linguistic authorities in Afro-Asiatic (Hamito-Semitic) languages, Oduyoye sliced through hitherto impregnable words with the cold objectivity of an intellectual guillotine.

Who, for instance, would fault Oduyoye when he pointed out that Igbo “dibia” (medicine man) is cognate (has the same origin) with Arabic “tibia” (Physicnan, doctor)? Or that Yoruba ajo is cognate with Hebrew Haj and ArabicHajj? And that “Alhaji” is cognate with Yoruba Alejo?

You see, in philology, (the scientific study of the nature and growth of words and languages) consonants like k, l, s, t, etc are the tell-tale that give away the relationships between words. These consonants are to words what bones are to fossils. Though vowels (the flesh) may decay or change as words travel over time and space, the consonants (bones) remain. It is these consonants (consonantal roots) that philologists use to track words to find their meanings or genealogy.

But then, some consonants are “liquid”, that is, change form from language to language.Thus, when the English word “guava” gets to Yoruba-speaking peoples, the consonant “v”, being absent Yoruba pronounciation becomes “b” or “f””. So guava becomes “goba” or “gofa”. Similarly “l” often becomes “r”, “s” becomes”sh” (e.g. among Ibadan indigenes) or “th” or even “z”.Philologists look out for these consonantal changes (liquidity) in the “detective work of tracking words.

Armed with these basic rules of comparative philology, Oduyoye tracked the irun-prefix in Yoruba Irunmale

(divinities) hitherto thought to be “400” to the Arabic” word harem and Hebrew herem both of which convey the idea of “sacred” or “holy”. The r-m-consonantal roots are clear, but the “h” is missing in Yoruba, Oduyoye says, because “Yoruba nouns generally do not begin with an /h/ or any h-type sound.”

From Ijebu “Lisa” (chief of first rank) to Igbo “Olise” (“God” as in Olisemeka) to “Lesa” among the Ambo of Malawi, the Barotse, the Bemba, the Kaonde, Lala, Lamba, Oduyoye, tracks the “l-s” consonantal root (which liquid forms are r-s” “l-z” “r-th” which all convey the idea of “head” “chief” first”) to Hebrew “rosh” (first) to Arabic “ras,” Aramaic “resh” and Akkadian “rishu”. And to Yoruba “Orisha”. In fact Hebrew “Harison-iym” is translated “Ancestors” in Psalm 79.8 of the Jerusalem Bibe Oduyoye says, the “-iym” being a mere plural suffix in Hebrew

Oduyoye also laces Yoruba Religious Discourse, with interesting “linguistic gossips in the foot notes like generous crumbs of stock-fish in an already deliciousOsiki soup.

However, Oduyoye’s glaring success did not get into his head. He acknowledged the pioneering efforts of eminent scholars like Archdeacon Olumide Lucas (who was teacher to his father) with whom he actually corresponded while writing the book: ‘The thoughtful restudy of past scholarship is not criticism for the sake of criticism, but an attempt to elucidate the principles involved in the discovery of truth… in doing this, however, it is right that we express our gratitude and respect to those whose work is being used and restudied, and, without whose pioneering zeal and daring,the present evaluation will not have been attempted.” Oduyoye wrote, quoting yet another authority.

So when seven years later, in August 1979, the Bishop of the Anglican Diocese of Odogbolu, (now in Ogun State) the Rt. Rev. I.B.O. Akintemi, invited Oduyoye to lead a series of Bible studies at the diocese’s clergy schools, it was an opportunity to take apart Genesis 1 – 11 with the scalpel of Hamito-semitic (Afro Asiatic) philology.

Puzzles usually glossed over by other interpreters came under Oduyoye’s scrutiny. “Why” Oduyoye asks, “does the Hebrew language have a world with a plural suffix (-iym) as its word for “God” when Hebrew religion is anti-polytheistic?”

“Who,” Oduyoye asks “are the sons of the Gods of Genesis 6:1?”

Traditional interpretation will say “angels” or “Israelites”, but Oduyoye says “no” to both.

Hear Oduyoye “And thus I dug up the questions those obvious in the English version and those patent only to one who reads from the Hebrews text. The true nature of the literary corpus we were studying thus becomes clear, and the need for interpretation could not be questioned…” The result, expectedly, was extraordinary. And for the , it was fascinating, if a mite disturbing.  What would these unusual interpretation do to the faith of Christians? One of them wondered aloud.

Oduyoye’s response was simple: “Christian preaching certainly needs a stronger pillar to lean upon than a basis of obscurantism.”

Oduyoye himself was and remains an eminent member of the Church having served in many capacities, including being the literature secretary of the Christian Council of Nigeria.

Oduyoye had first informed his cleric students that. Hebrew, the original language of the Old Testament texts and other Semitic languages like Aramaic, Akkadian, MEgyptian, Ugarithic etc all belong to the same Afro-Asiatic (Hamito Semitic) language group as many Africa languages like Hausa, Efik, Ibiobio, Yoruba, Igbo Fulfide, Twi, Fon etc. Thus, in seeking explanations to passages of Genesis 1- 11, Oduyoye drew from these languages.

Having equipped himself with considerable acquaintance with many African languages, Oduyoye stood, as it were, at a vantage point where he has an unusually panoramic view of the innards of these languages. The substance of this Bible studies, Oduyoye later compiled in a book with the title: “The Sons of the Gods and the Daughters of Men.”

On the whole, the 132- page book, published in 1984 by Orbis Books, Maryknoll, New York, impresses upon the reader that Genesis 1 – 11 contains a lot of folk or popular etymology as “tall stories for popular consumption” which are told not for their basis in fact but by way of the lay man’s attempt to explain things that are obscure to him.

Oduyoye had dealt at length with the problem of folk etymology in Yoruba Religious Discourse. In it, he cited the drum signal used then to reproduce the intonation pattern of the English statement: “This is the Nigerian Broadcasting Service.” Which some Yoruba folk erroneously interprete as

“Ninu Ikoko dudu la ti n se’be. It is inside a black pot that we cook stew”

He then cites such popular etymology in the Book of Genesis:

“that Eve was so named because she was the mother of all life; that Isaac was so named because he grabbed his twin brother by the heels while they were still in the womb; that Cain was so named because the mother said at birth” I have acquired a man with the help of God”… that Marah was so named because there Israelites found the water bitter”

“Babel” for instance, which according to the Bible, was derived from the fact that it is where God confused the tongue of men..

First, Oduyoye dismissed the claim that the whole world had one language by reminding us that earlier in Gen 10 we had been told that the son of Yaphet, Ham and Shem had been classified according to their different tongues.

Confused in Hebrew is “balal”. But the Genesis writers are saying that “Babel” (b-b-l) is derived from Balal (b-l-l).

Oduyoye says “no”. “The (writer of Genesis)  is basing etymology on a single leg of sound similarity without any consideration for the other leg of meaning similarity. Hebrew “balal” means “mingle” mix, confuse, confound cognate therefore with Chichewa ideophone “balala-balala” scatter, disperse.

“Here, etymology has two legs to stand upon. Phonology and semantics. But what does Babel” mean? “Babel is Hebrew. It is the name of the Babylonian capital whose only gate was memorably designed with religious motiffs. It came to be known by the Babylonians asbaab ilu the gate of God.’ Babel could therefore not be so called because Yahweh balal the speech of all the earth.” Oduyoye then goes blunt: “The etymology of Genesis 1-11 are based on fancy, not fact. They serve the purpose of mythology, not that of linguistics or philology. As far as the Genesis writers were concerned, a word in a strange language must connote something similar in a similar- sounding word in Hebrew. The semantic tour de force produces a good story, and in mythology, the story is the end.”

Oduyoye also drew attention to how Genesis writers borrowed generously form polytheistic mythology, but then superimposed their own brand of “monotheistic theology” on it. Genesis 2:4 for instance talks of thetowledot (genealogy) of the heavens and the earth.

A genealogy gives the list of children just like in the genealogy Shem. But the Genesis writers, Oduyoye says, don’t want to hear talk of “sons and daughters” born of heaven and earth, which inevitably implies procreation . Instead they introduced YHWH (Yahweh/Jehovah) as a solo creator. “To introduce YHWH ‘eloh-iym into an ancient mythology in which the male heaven and the female earth were procreative agents—- persons or spirit or gods—- is to turn mythology into (Hebrew) theology,”Oduyoye comments.

Other glimpses of mythology shows  in statements like that in Gen 6: that ‘the sons of the gods (heaven) married the daughters of men (earth) and gave birth to gibbor-iym (powerful ones).

In essence, what Genesis writers did is to rewrite mythology to suit their own religious (theological) purpose—- which is to push Yahweh as the sole creator who moulds (forms).

Another major record in the Bible which gives away this doctoring of ancient mythology is the very first sentence in the Bible. In the original Hebrew Bible, it reads:

“In the beginning eloh-iym (the gods) created the heavens and the earth. “Why,” Oduyoye asks does the Hebrew language have a word with a plural suffix (-iym) as its word for ‘God’ When Hebrew religion is anti-polytheistic?”

In repainting the existing picture of the polytheistic mythology of the time the Genesis writers left many patches of the old paint. And in several cases, the old paint shows from underneath the new.

Later translators of the Hebrew into Greek had to grapple with this tell-tale ambiguities. And in their efforts, they messed up many translations.

For instance, though Hebrews/Judaists insist that Yahweh is the only God, they left words like ­Ben-ey ha-eloh-iym (sons of the gods) in places like Genesis 6. Where do these fit in Hebrew theology? Who are the gods and who are their sons?

Oduyoye however tells us that such “sons of the gods” are not unknown in African tradition. He quotes Joshua N. Kudajie. Aspects of Religion and Morality in Ghanaian Traditional Society with particular reference to the Ga Adangme.”:

“The sons and daughters of Naa Nyamo (Ga “Father God”) are known to us as jemawoji ‘the gods of the world’. They are powerful and intelligent beings who walk about the world, but they have their own abodes in the seas, Lagoons, mountains and other natural objects. Having been delegated by Naa nyamo to be his vicegerents, they are in active contact with the world of nature in man.”

Oduyoye now compares this extract with Job 1:6:

“Now there was a day when ben-ey ha elo-iym (sons of the lords) came to present themselves before YHWH and Satan also came among them…..”

Oduyoye then draws the inference that ben-ey ha eloh-iym are” divine beings like Satan (Ngas go sot ‘the people of knowledge and power’) “We can not escape the answer that ben-ey ha eloh-iym in Gen 6 refers so to the same divine beings whom the Ga of Ghana know asjemawoji, whom the Akan of Ghana know as abosom….”

Then he adds: “The two examples of divine beings named in genesis and Job (Nimrod and Satan) are reflected in West Africa.

as Yoruba Lamurudu, a legendary hero andas Ngas go sot “persons of knowledge and power.” In Yoruba these would be the Orisa

So, how do translators of Hebrew Genesis to Greek cope with these mythological beings?

Badly: They gave different translations to the same words.

Hear oduyoye “The Septuagint (bible) renders ben-ey ha eloh-iym into Greek as hoi angeloitou theou“messengers of God” in Job 1:6 but as hoi huioi tou theou “the sons of God” in Gen. 6:2….”

A freak word which never existed in English was also introduced: “angel”.

“Those who know the ordinary meaning of Greek angeloi know that it means only “messe

ngers” just as Hebrew male’ak-iym means ‘messengers” ordinarily.

“But when mythical thinking enters into it, Greek angeloi and Hebrew male’alk-iym are rendered into English as angels… the Jews who translated the Hebrew Bible (old Testament) into Greek in Alexandria avoided the mythology of ben-ey ha eloh-iym in Gen.6:1 and Job 1:6 but gave us another myth —- that of angels…”

Perhaps some of Oduyoye’s most sensitive remarks are on what he calls “anti-Hamitism” — hatred for the descendants of Ham and Canaanites in the Genesis accounts. Why rain curses on Canaan when it was Ham who by accident saw his drunken father’s (Noah) unclothedness? Oduyoye asks.

Many Bible readers will gloss over this anomaly or rationalize it. But not Oduyoye. It is a ploy to justify the annihilation of theCanaanites, he says:

“The truth is that the story is one of many told by the Hebrews to ridicule nations against whom they harbor a grudge.”

Four of such nations, he says are

*Egypt because of what one of its Pharaohs did to the ancestors of the Jews:

*Canaan who the Jews considered “Idolaters” and therefore could be annihilated in the name of Yahweh

*Moab whom the Hebrews say were born from an incestuous relationship between Lot and his two daughters;

*Babel whom the Jews considered too ambitious and therefore sees the ruins of its imposing ziggurats as punishment from Heaven.

Earlier, Odoyoye had also dealt with another personalty whom he said the Hebrew writers tried to run down because of his greatness: Nimrod, a blackman (Kushite) whom, quoting Genesis, oduyoye described as one of the gibbor-iym (Yoruba al-agbara) cited in Genesis as the ‘first on Earth to be a mighty man.”

Nimrod, according to Oduyoye is actually YorubaLamurudu (N-m-d / l-m-d) and he was the first empire builder whose kingdom spread from Babylon ot Nineveh.

Given this anterior greatness of the Kushite Nimrod, the first gibbor, the writers of Genesis did with Nimrod what they did with Nebuchadnezzar: For no reason other than his greatness, they stated that Nimrod’s greatness was offensive to God (Yahweh).”

Then he adds; “The fact is that the jews had never been great (except during the empire of David and Solomon). On the contrary, they had suffered from great nations many of these included in the kingdom/empire of Nimrod. Babylonians… Assyrians”

Oduyoye return again and again to this issue of racism shown by the Jews in their records. On page 100, he declares: “It is the business of blacks to expose the inherent anti-Hamitism, which resulted in the paradigmatic extermination of the Canaanites by those who,when the tide is turned, have been complaining of anti-Semitism.”

Then Oduyoye zeroes in on the Nigerian situation: “We are asked not to believe that the Abore have any relationship with the ‘iber-iym, and yet what the Iber-iymdid to the Canaanites in the name of Yahweh the Abore have done to the sons of Kush from Sokoto to Ilorin in the name of Allah.”

Citing the –b-r consonantal root among other evidence, Oduyoye had told us in the opening of Chapter 7 (page 63) that the Hebrew and Fulani (BororoEber is the name of the ancestors of the ben-ey Eber “sons of Eber.” These were, in the Bible, the ‘iber-iym ‘the Hebrews.

“Eber, the name of their ancestor is comparable to the name by which the wandering Fulani of West Africa are known: Abore in Nigeria (Borno) and in Chad, Bororo in Nigeria (Adamawa… Their language is called ful-ful-de in Nigeria.”

The ‘b-r root in the name ‘Eber and in the name ‘iber-iym(Hebrews), Oduyoye says occur in Hebrew ‘abar ‘(cross over, trespass, pass on, past by); twi boro (to trespass); Yoruba afara (bridge); Ibara (ford); Ibara-mu (Across the nose); eburu [Shortcut (across an area)].

Oduyoye then declares: “the ‘iber-iym, (Hebrews)go that name because being nomads, they were always passing by the cities of the Canaanites and never settling among them ‘-b-r means “pass on, pass by in judges 19: 12b, 18 and in Ruth 4:1

The sons of the Gods and The daughters of Men is a many-layered work which value continues to be uncovered with repeated reading.

Many more fascinating information are enclosed in its pages: like the link between Adamu Orisa (of the Awori Eyo masquerade in Lagos State) and Hebrew r’ison Adam, the link between Qayin (Cain) and Ogun the Yoruba Patron Saint of Smiths.

The latter link is particularly interesting in its detective nature. On the latter, Oduyoye notes that Hebrew Qayinis cognate with the Arabic word for smith(s)qayn.

Reminding us of the q/g/k consonantal liquidity, Oduyoye says the words are cognate with the Yoruba Ogun and Fon Gun both meaning “patron saint of smiths.” Other cognates include Hamn kuno (Investor of iron smelting) and Ebira Egene (the caste of Smiths)

He reminds us too tat the name Akin (valiant man) is most prevalent in Ondo which shares the n-d  consonantal root with the land of Nod to which Qayn headed after leaving Eden. And is there a link between the city of Hanok (Enoch) and the Nok culture of Jos Plateau in Nigeria? And can the name Yoruba be a distant relation of Europa?

While the book’s appendix gives further detail on some words already tackled in the body-proper and summarises the main pillars of Oduyoye’s arguments, the index is a mini Afro-Anglo-Semitic dictionary.

I'll have to come back and take my time to read this.....

Thanks so much for this great piece, how excellent!
This is a building-brick to the culmination of prophecies.
The prophecies of the ancestors shall come to pass, and flourish.

Thanks so much for this great piece, how excellent!
This is a building-brick to the culmination of prophecies.
The prophecies of the ancestors shall come to pass, and flourish.

.

2prexios:
Thanks so much for this great piece, how excellent!

This is a building-brick to the culmination of prophecies.

The prophecies of the ancestors shall come to pass, and flourish.

yw bro!

Modified

Hey metaphysical,
What is your theory about the whole issue of Yoruba origin and why do you believe in the AfroAsia claim of Yoruba origin?

I think macof is afraid of Arabs and Jews and believes any mention of Yoruba in connection with these cultures is sactilege. Please enlighten him.

OPCNAIRALAND:
Hey metaphysical,
What is your theory about the whole issue of Yoruba origin and why do you believe in the AfroAsia claim of Yoruba origin?

I think macof is afraid of Arabs and Jews and believes any mention of Yoruba in connection with these cultures is sactilege. Please enlighten him.

I don't think you've been here long enough to appreciate the mindsets you are dealing with on Yoruba origin.

One of the most valuable commodities in the history of mankind is crude oil. These are decomposed wastes from organisms that at one time had life. This is testimony to the principle of time and energy. A living energy today will perish tomorrow and transform next day into a new form of energy usable to sustain a life which in its own turn will perish, transform and sustain another life that is destined to go through same cycle.

Out of this scientific cycle there is cultural wisdom. Those who have passed on....ancestors, are sustainers of the living. In other words, life is dynamic! Energy is dynamic! Recycling, or reincarnation, is dynamic!

Why should the people of Ife, the cradle of life, be STATIC, and not experience life in its dynamism

My own theory is similar to Dr Oduyoye's. I can never compare myself to him in scholarship and expertise but I have my own niche for unraveling mysteries. It started with the scriptures and I soon started to notice commonalities in Genesis and Yoruba cosmogeny. The deeper I dug the more meanings threw itself at me. I had no idea who Dr Oduyoye was. There were two other regular contributors here back then, my brother amor4ce and tony. One of them introduced Dr Oduyoye here, and the moment I read his brief I fell in love with his works.

Let me cut short, go through my past posts and threads and you will understand what my theories are.

We worship Olokun, the deity of the ocean but the word ocean came from probably Latin, Roman language. We have known Olokun before we knew the word Ocean.

Now look at this... Ocean = Ocun = Okun
So who was the originator, was it Yoruba or Latin?
Who learnt the name from the other?


In fact, Ocean = Ocun = Osun
Similar to Oracle = Orica = Orisa


These ideas are provocative and bring out the curiosity in those seeking truth in the dynamism of life.

By the way, could Life itself be a derivative of L'Ife.....as in primordial beginning of mankind? If the theory holds, then words like Eve, Love, Live, Nineveh....are all ideals principal to Ile Ife. We cannot therefore argue against the primordial beginning of mankind or of Yoruba in Ile Ife. But how did Eve end up in Eden, how did Eden end up in Afroasia, how did Nineveh end up in Babylonia?


We are on a quest to connect the dots for places where Yoruba had footprints. People are afraid that our quest is to donate Ife brginning to the Arab or the Jew....these people are crazy!

MetaPhysical:


I don't think you've been here long enough to appreciate the mindsets you are dealing with on Yoruba origin.

One of the most valuable commodities in the history of mankind is crude oil. These are decomposed wastes from organisms that at one time had life. This is testimony to the principle of time and energy. A living energy today will perish tomorrow and transform next day into a new form of energy usable to sustain a life which in its own turn will perish, transform and sustain another life that is destined to go through same cycle.

Out of this scientific cycle there is cultural wisdom. Those who have passed on....ancestors, are sustainers of the living. In other words, life is dynamic! Energy is dynamic! Recycling, or reincarnation, is dynamic!

Why should the people of Ife, the cradle of life, be STATIC, and not experience life in its dynamism

My own theory is similar to Dr Oduyoye's. I can never compare myself to him in scholarship and expertise but I have my own niche for unraveling mysteries. It started with the scriptures and I soon started to notice commonalities in Genesis and Yoruba cosmogeny. The deeper I dug the more meanings threw itself at me. I had no idea who Dr Oduyoye was. There were two other regular contributors here back then, my brother amor4ce and tony. One of them introduced Dr Oduyoye here, and the moment I read his brief I fell in love with his works.

Let me cut short, go through my past posts and threads and you will understand what my theories are.

We worship Olokun, the deity of the ocean but the word ocean came from probably Latin, Roman language. We have known Olokun before we knew the word Ocean.

Now look at this... Ocean = Ocun = Okun
So who was the originator, was it Yoruba or Latin?
Who learnt the name from the other?


In fact, Ocean = Ocun = Osun
Similar to Oracle = Orica = Orisa


These ideas are provocative and bring out the curiosity in those seeking truth in the dynamism of life.

By the way, could Life itself be a derivative of L'Ife.....as in primordial beginning of mankind? If the theory holds, then words like Eve, Love, Live, Nineveh....are all ideals principal to Ile Ife. We cannot therefore argue against the primordial beginning of mankind or of Yoruba in Ile Ife. But how did Eve end up in Eden, how did Eden end up in Afroasia, how did Nineveh end up in Babylonia?


We are on a quest to connect the dots for places where Yoruba had footprints. People are afraid that our quest is to donate Ife brginning to the Arab or the Jew....these people are crazy!

good, now you have made this clear. If I'm to conclude and summarize this long epistle:
you're saying Yoruba origins isn't from Arabs or Hebrews
You're saying Yoruba culture influenced the cultures of euroasia

I'm I right?

OPCNAIRALAND:
Hey metaphysical,
What is your theory about the whole issue of Yoruba origin and why do you believe in the AfroAsia claim of Yoruba origin?

I think macof is afraid of Arabs and Jews and believes any mention of Yoruba in connection with these cultures is sactilege. Please enlighten him.

by metaphysical 's reply to this, I saw no claims of yoruba being an Afroasiatic language but rather a possible yoruba origin for Afroasiatic and Indo-European languages


again I ask, what has fear got to do with this? I also disagree with people bringing forth claims of Yoruba - Egypt connection, so where is this idea that I something against arabs and jews coming from? Egyptian culture in fact holds more Elements present in Yoruba culture than arabs and hebrews.
oh yes enlighten me if you can. .doing so with this evidence I so desire
I don't buy into pseudohistory and pseudolinguistics

macof:


good, now you have made this clear. If I'm to conclude and summarize this long epistle:
you're saying Yoruba origins isn't from Arabs or Hebrews
You're saying Yoruba culture influenced the cultures of euroasia

I'm I right?

Your task here should be for a single purpose.
Dr Oduyoye has made claims that Yoruba has footprints in AfroAsia, disprove these claims with substantial evidence and zero out any possibility of Yoruba existence in that region.

Sometimes ago, I was searching for the meaning of erigialo, which is an alias for Orunmila,

then search engine brought me the closest word to it that has been grabbed by it's cache.

en rigialo (cades). I was like, is this a message or serendipity? If you don't appreciate little things, you will miss the secret of a lifetime meant for you.

why was palm tree (Ope, the symbol of orunmila) so conspicuous in this very short verse and the word so compatible with Yoruba stuffs?

The Song of Songs ( Songs
1:14 ) speaks of the "vineyards
of En Gedi." The words of
Ecclesiasticus 24:18, "I was
exalted like a palm tree in
Cades" (’en aígialoîs), may
perhaps be understood of the
palm trees of Ein Gedi.
The indigenous Jewish town of
Ein Gedi was an important
source of balsam for the Greco-
Roman world until its
destruction by Byzantine
emperor Justinian as part of his
persecution of the Jews in his
realm. A synagogue mosaic
remains from Ein Gedi's heyday,
including a Judeo-Aramaic
inscription warning inhabitants
against "revealing the town's
secret" – possibly the methods
for extraction and preparation of
the much-prized balsam resin,
though not stated outright in the
inscription – to the outside
world. [4]
According to the Miholjanec
legend , Stephen V of Hungary
had in front of his tent a golden
plate with the inscription: "Attila ,
the son of Bendeuci, grandson
of the great Nimrod, born at Ein
Gedi: By the Grace of God King
of the Huns, Medes, Goths,
Dacians, the horrors of the
world and the scourge of
God. ""[ citation needed]"

compare 'en aígialoîs' with erigialo, and ein gedi with 'ehin gbeti'.

the same kind of topography and etymological implications exist.

Boju o ba t'eyin igbeti, oju oni teko

meaning if the fortress is not compromised,

Lagos will not be compromised.

Why the similarity?

My answer is, people who were very familiar with ein gedi named a part of Lagos as eyin gbeti (marina) before the Portuguese.

ein gedi was remembered also for palm tree, eyin is palm kernel in Yoruba.

That part of Lagos Lagoon once has Palm at the beach as you can see from Taqwa bay at a close distance.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Masada

My brother, nothing do you. The ones disputing these claims are missing couple of bolts in their heads.

They lack substsnce snd truth but love to twist words into acrobatic shapes and intrigue audience into applause. They open posts with giggles, punctuate it with giggles snd end it wiyh giggles. Their objective is to mock.....i have amassed records and facts to mock them.

I want them to gather leagues and come in here for the show.

MetaPhysical:


Your task here should be for a single purpose.
Dr Oduyoye has made claims that Yoruba has footprints in AfroAsia, disprove these claims with substantial evidence and zero out any possibility of Yoruba existence in that region.

Why didn't you answer my question?

I'm sorry I cannot see, from your opening posts how "Dr Oduyoye" declares Yoruba footprints in Afroasiatic languages.

from your opening posts, he merely proposes similarities with different languages - Igbo, Arabic, Akkadian, Hebrew, Yoruba etc. . there was no authoritative declaration that Yoruba language is Afroasiatic

let's see this:

"Hebrew “rosh” (first) to Arabic “ras,” Aramaic “resh” and Akkadian “rishu”. And to Yoruba “Orisha”

Hebrew -Rosh means "head" "leader". I take it the other words in those languages mentioned being Semetic languages would mean the same thing as in Hebrew.
which in yoruba is "Olori" not Orisa.

Lamurudu is yoruba rendition of Nimrod

while, this is absolutely correct. but the knowledge of a "Nimrod" came through the quran that was brought by Muslims not earlier than the 18th century


I've disproved these claims metaphysic, please bring more if you have.

macof:


Why didn't you answer my question?

There is nothing hidden or ambigous in my position. That question has been answered so many times it has become my trademark.

I'm sorry I cannot see, from your opening posts how "Dr Oduyoye" declares Yoruba footprints in Afroasiatic languages.

from your opening posts, he merely proposes similarities with different languages - Igbo, Arabic, Akkadian, Hebrew, Yoruba etc. . there was no authoritative declaration that Yoruba language is Afroasiatic

First of all, Afroasia is not a language or a culture, it is a geographical zone. Dr Oduyoye did not propose....he CLAIMED with AUTHORITY of someone with intimate knowledge of Yoruba, English, Latin, Arabic, Hebrew languages, cultures and theology, that Yoruba tongue, culture and worship is present in the civilizations of Egypt, Assyria, Akkadia. In these places Hebrew, Arabic, Aramaic is the tongue and the region is Afroasia.

let's see this:

Hebrew -Rosh means "head" "leader". I take it the other words in those languages mentioned being Semetic languages would mean the same thing as in Hebrew.
which in yoruba is "Olori" not Orisa.

You are going to need a far better resource than google to discredit Dr Oduyoye. He is talking about Yoruba antiquity and ancient Hebrew, not modern Hebrew.

I told you already this area of quest is for deep thinkers. You will need understanding in String Theory to comprehend what letter R in oRisha stand for and in the context Dr Oduyoye presented it. A simple google interpretation will do you no good.

People that say his claims are watertight and airtight have probed for flaws in it, finding none they gave up!

After you grasp the String equivalent for R then you do same for S.......in the process you will discover more than just _R_S_ and hopefully your light bulb will come on that you can appreciate that the Arokin of Oyo is not crazy, that Araba of Ife is not crazy, Archbishop Olumide Lucas is not crazy, Dr Modupe Oduyoye is not crazy and that those of us here sharing the knowledge are not crazy.......most of all, scientists and anthropologists are not crazy for conducting independent studies with conclusiins that Yoruba indeed was present in Eurasia.

while, this is absolutely correct. but the knowledge of a "Nimrod" came through the quran that was brought by Muslims not earlier than the 18th century


I've disproved these claims metaphysic, please bring more if you have.

You are a joker.

Anyway, you call it an absolute fact that Nimrod is Oduduwa. Where did you get this....how did you arrive at this irrefutable fact that a Nimrod placed in Babylonia, in distant Assyria, is same as Oduduwa, the progenitor of Yorubas?

Nimrod was known and mentioned in Bible, which predated Quran. Can you find another excuse?

Hope you remember the Ado thread? You spot the place with Megido. I think its all coming back to me now, thanks to this thread.

I was laughing and imagining slamming macof with 'Macof ben Ebora' as his new hebrew baptismal name and asking him to name the first son of Oduduwa if he must reject the name, this afternoon.

Something told me the name ebora rhymes with Deborah, so I made a google search. At a corner I found Gezer. It seems like what the Egun call Ado, namely, 'gese' pronounced 'gay zay'.

My brother just few days ago told me Ado starts from isolo, and that the founder came through the Ado river.

There are certain things that awe me in the link below, there are retelling of the afro asia tale: Amuwa, Amun, Ota, Tanis, afi ponpondo yoju ketu, Aegean, Agan, Igan-mode afele ja.

The Ado claim to be scions of Alamunwa to jagun molu. Are we dealing with archeological language here? Why is Yoruba language unfolding like an archeological escavation?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gezer

Geologists teach that the Arabian Peninsular used to be part of the African continent, but speculate on its northern and northeastern limits. What if it actually included Mesopotamia. This would explain the presence in southern Mesopotamia of 'Nimrod' who was allegedly a Cushite and grandson of Ham, and also be a confirmation of the assertions of Sultan Bello and some Arab writers that the Nimrod, his people the 'Yoruba' (according to Bello) and other progenies of Ham once lived in that region. However, the geologists say that the northeasterly split of the Arabian Peninsula from the African continent which resulted in the Red Sea rift took place over 20 million years ago. What if this dating is not true? What if it is much recent? Within the last 20 years some volcanic islands have been formed in the Red Sea as the rift expands till date. The rift is mentioned in the Arab account of the formation of the Bab al-Mandab (Gateway of Grief), which has to be recent, and which the Arabs now publicly dismiss as mere legend. What if it isn't for nothing that ancient maps/atlases differ from the ones made since 1300 or thereabout? It would also explain the difficulty in locating the part of the Red Sea of the biblical exodus.

What if the mass migrations of the Arabs to Europe withing the last 2 years till date have occurred in ancient times and the Arabs similarly migrated into Mesopotamia and the Levant and the Arabian Peninsula? Remember that they did invade North Africa.


@MetaPhysical, I greet you well.

This Will Take Me A Whole 3days To Read And Understand - I'm Coming, I Wanna Defecate!

MetaPhysical,

Oduyoye's piece reads like Kamal Salibi's "The Bible Came From Arabia". In any case, I wouldn't dismiss the proposition that Yoruba ancestors once lived around the Nile or within the Arabian peninsular. The similarities of Yoruba root words with their Asian counterparts in Oduyoye's exposition couldn't be dismissed as mere coincidences. Something is surely going on here!

To those interested in learning and gaining more knowledge on this quest of Yoruba origin and beginnings check the following link, interesting collection.


http://www.academia.edu/5030583/The_Black_Arabian_Origins_of_the_Yor%C3%B9b%C3%A1_and_Ol%C3%B3d%C3%B9mar%C3%A8_Isl%C4%81m_and_If%C3%A1_as_Sibling_Rivals

@Metaphysical ,the link didn't open.

https://www.academia.edu/5030583/The_Black_Arabian_Origins_of_the_Yorùbá_and_Olódùmarè_Islām_and_Ifá_as_Sibling_Rivals



If above doesnt work use title from screenshot to find a comptible version.

MetaPhysical:
https://www.academia.edu/5030583/The_Black_Arabian_Origins_of_the_Yorùbá_and_Olódùmarè_Islām_and_Ifá_as_Sibling_Rivals



If above doesnt work use title from screenshot to find a comptible version.

Thanks

Can someone please help me with the price of the entry fee to the following Tourist Centers in Ondo State
*Owo Museum of Antiques/Owo palace
*Okomu National Park
*Idanre Hills Akure
*Igbokoda Water Front