scholes0:


Just wanted to highlight this because a particular Benin workmate of mine whose name I won't mention still said at work TODAY that benins came "from Yoruba", in his exact words: "Bini people na Yoruba people na, abeg wetin be difference sef"

It was I the Yoruba that was even telling the Benin man that Benins didn't come from Yoruba although a large portion of the population might have in the past. I have never experienced Benin-Yoruba attrition in real life. Yes there might be arguments about Obas and Oduduwa and What not, but that's it. The ambience between both groups is verrry cordial. Inter-marriages btw both are not even really seen as inter marriage.

Edos are Yorubas.

There is no need arguing that..

MelesZenawi:



Edos are Yorubas.

There is no need arguing that..

Believe whatever you want. It doesn't change facts.


Edo is not and can never be Yoruba. They are different

sotall:


Believe whatever you want. It doesn't change facts.


Edo is not and can never be Yoruba. They are different

Oga listen

These two people Edos and Yorubas looks alike, answer similar names, reasons alike, politically alike, bit language divergent, has same title for kings,


Infact looking at Edo man , u will mistake them as Yorubas.


To me it us quite irritating people saying Yorubas and edos are different....even when physical features and history says otherwise.

MelesZenawi:


Oga listen

These two people Edos and Yorubas looks alike, answer similar names, reasons alike, politically alike, bit language divergent, has same title for kings,


Infact looking at Edo man , u will mistake them as Yorubas.


To me it us quite irritating people saying Yorubas and edos are different....even when physical features and history says otherwise.

Dont argue unintelligently in a public forum as big ad nairaland. It rubbishes your education and enlightenment.

Since when did phenotypic features in humans means same tribes?

Except you have an eye defect, the average Yoruba man looks different from an Edo man.

The language is different

The dressing is different

The tribal mark is different.

If you are learned, you will understand that the few similarities in culture between Edo and Yoruba is due to culture mixing as a result of the proximity of the two tribes.
This happens everywhere.

Stop the misinformation and go and educate yourself

MelesZenawi:



Edos are Yorubas.

There is no need arguing that..

To the average Igbo, Edo is Yoruba and to the average Yoruba, Edo is omo Ibo. This confusion is largely due to ignorance.

ghostwon:
Look at this time traveller telling us stories with no dates and no proofs and which didn't take place before his eyes.

Myths and other fictions are not history. You call me revisionist and then proceed to tell stories with no proof.

Facts: ife was a small village when the British arrived and took over without a single shot.

Benin was an empire and fought against the British.
Precolonial map of Benin below.
The people rewriting history are the guys who fed you all these lies which you repeated as your gospel.

Oh boy you still dey waste time with that guy?
His pain is so much.
I wonder how pained he feels when during History of Africa on BBC, Egypt, Benin, Ethiopia, Mali and Ashanti is what it's all about.

Without Oba of Benin gallivanting to Caribbean, Americas or anywhere to sell the history first.

Even in UK, by the age of 8, most kids have already covered history of Benin.
Simple reason is Oyinbo have details of the empire in their books and archives. Some over 500 years old.

samuk:


To the average Igbo, Edo is Yoruba and to the average Yoruba, Edo is omo Ibo. This confusion is largely due to ignorance.

Pure lie.

I have never seen Yorubas refer to Edos as Omo Ibo.....


Yorubas themselves sees Edos as Yorubas because of striking similarities and that's why most Edos let me put it at 85% has strong links with Yorubas in all they do.

But saying Yorubas sees Edo as Omo ibo...na lie...


Well I am yet to understand the difference between both because nobody has given a strong proof to distinguish between both.

Mraphel:

There are many tribes in Edo, Benin, Ishan and the Akoko edos have similarities with Yorubas but others in Edo does not.

If you go to Benin today some Bini people will tell u Edo and Yoruba are d same.

If u go to Auchi, and others you will see tribe that has no similarities to Yorubas.

Beside all non Yorubas are omo ibo. ( which translates to people from the bush) is corrupted to Igbo by the british

@bolded as you stated shows both are same people.

ghostwon:


I guess you were not only there in the 1400's but that you were also in the heads of the europeans and that you watched stayed there and observed over the centuries. That would be the only logical explanation for your statement. You are not only a time traveler but also a mind reader.

You claim europeans met only costal kingdoms, yet their maps show kingdoms very far away from the coasts, e.g mali.
The capital of Benin empire is not a costal city neither ! But the europeans visited it even though many towns are between Benin city and the coast, they saw Lagos, they saw Warri, but they had to go to the nerve center of the empire, Benin city.

You are trying very hard to rubbish actual history and replace it with your fabricated fiction.
Your logics: "the people who witnessed our ancestors and wrote what they saw were wrong, I did a time travel and also read their minds. I who was not born when history was taken place, I know better than those who actually saw what was taking place and wrote it down."

With these your superpowers, can you tell me what is happening in my house right now, let us put your superpowers to test.
You are a medium with magical powers.

Shiver99 is quite correct. You don't have to have existed in the past or read minds to tell things that can be identified with study and common sense
If in 2020, you still think 16th-18th century Europeans knew enough about African empires and states then you have a problem my man.
How do you expect people who never left the coast to know enough about big empires and wealthy Kings in the hinterlands?

European sources of that period have been studied and most details found to be misconceptions and errors. Even kingdoms that they heard about from the coast were mispositioned on the map or given too much territory on the map


Here is a 16th century map of africa by Sebastian Münster....the best (compared to other maps) i have seen of this period, yet even filled with so much errors.
let me give you just one interesting example...
right around the middle you can see Regnum Organe which refers to Ile-ife (ie. kingdom of the Oghene). The kingdom is awfully mispositioned and given a territory that boarders Nubia, it is also futher north than Mali (Regnum Melli)

Think about it, it's not a difficult situation to understand

samuk:


To the average Igbo, Edo is Yoruba and to the average Yoruba, Edo is omo Ibo. This confusion is largely due to ignorance.

this is not true. To the average Yoruba, edo is actually just "a distant Yoruba group"
No Yoruba person who grew up in Yorùbáland around Yoruba influences would think Edo are igbo

macof:
this is not true. To the average Yoruba, edo is actually just "a distant Yoruba group"
No Yoruba person who grew up in Yorùbáland around Yoruba influences would think Edo are igbo

Wow.

macof:
this is not true. To the average Yoruba, edo is actually just "a distant Yoruba group"
No Yoruba person who grew up in Yorùbáland around Yoruba influences would think Edo are igbo

Then there are many ignorant Yoruba people who grew up in Yorubaland. I have seen many who grew up in Ibadan, Lagos and so on and refer to everybody after Ore as Igbo.

Even many Igbo believe Benin & Yoruba are virtually same. You cannot imagine the level of ignorance among the larger ethnic groups. The Yoruba do not surprise me. Most only travel within SW until Abuja became popular. Many Yoruba probably know more about Peckham & Hackney than Nigeria. Aside military, NYSC, NNPC and banking jobs that take some Yoruba outside SW, most do not go out. Those professional cadre would have mixed with many ethnic group through higher education & work anyway. But still VERY many Yoruba display outstanding ignorance.

Even Igbo that usually cross Edo State to enter SW, many still err in that regard.

In any case, having several tribes within Benin Empire was the normal thing. We didn't see it as unusual. Even today Edo State TV reads news in Igbo, Yoruba, Urhobo, Izon, etc.

But of late this accommodating attitude stemming from imperial times now seems a weakness. That will have to change. It seems everyone is now going towards tribal supremacy, nationalism, etc.

AreaFada2:


Then there are many ignorant Yoruba people who grew up in Yorubaland. I have seen many who grew up in Ibadan, Lagos and so on and refer to everybody after Ore as Igbo.

Even many Igbo believe Benin & Yoruba are virtually same. You cannot imagine the level of ignorance among the larger ethnic groups. The Yoruba do not surprise me. Most only travel within SW until Abuja became popular. Many Yoruba probably know more about Peckham & Hackney than Nigeria. Aside military, NYSC, NNPC and banking jobs that take some Yoruba outside SW, most do not go out. Those professional cadre would have mixed with many ethnic group through higher education & work anyway. But still VERY many Yoruba display outstanding ignorance.

Even Igbo that usually cross Edo State to enter SW, many still err in that regard.

2.
In any case, having several tribes within Benin Empire was the normal thing. We didn't see it as unusual. Even today Edo State TV reads news in Igbo, Yoruba, Urhobo, Izon, etc.

But of late this accommodating attitude stemming from imperial times now seems a weakness. That will have to change. It seems everyone is now going towards tribal supremacy, nationalism, etc.

Well I think such ignorance is innocent and understandable. Edo and Yoruba do share immense similarities

2.
you have no option but to accommodate the diversity in Edo state because otherwise a problem will arise. Its not their fault that they are in Edo state
Maybe treat the minorities in Edo state respectfully and Nigeria can treat the minorities more as they wish.
So don't act as if you are doing them a favour

macof:


Well I think such ignorance is innocent and understandable. Edo and Yoruba do share immense similarities

2.
you have no option but to accommodate the diversity in Edo state because otherwise a problem will arise. Its not their fault that they are in Edo state
Maybe treat the minorities in Edo state respectfully and Nigeria can treat the minorities more as they wish.
So don't act as if you are doing them a favour

It's obvious you have a different agenda. Your own is possibly to Stoke disaffection.

My point is simple enough. Benin has and had people of different ethnicities for centuries. Many distinguished themselves and are now even part of Benin elite. Like Governor Obaseki whose great great grandfather came from Anioma.

AreaFada2:


Then there are many ignorant Yoruba people who grew up in Yorubaland. I have seen many who grew up in Ibadan, Lagos and so on and refer to everybody after Ore as Igbo.

Even many Igbo believe Benin & Yoruba are virtually same. You cannot imagine the level of ignorance among the larger ethnic groups. The Yoruba do not surprise me. Most only travel within SW until Abuja became popular. Many Yoruba probably know more about Peckham & Hackney than Nigeria. Aside military, NYSC, NNPC and banking jobs that take some Yoruba outside SW, most do not go out. Those professional cadre would have mixed with many ethnic group through higher education & work anyway. But still VERY many Yoruba display outstanding ignorance.

Even Igbo that usually cross Edo State to enter SW, many still err in that regard.

In any case, having several tribes within Benin Empire was the normal thing. We didn't see it as unusual. Even today Edo State TV reads news in Igbo, Yoruba, Urhobo, Izon, etc.

But of late this accommodating attitude stemming from imperial times now seems a weakness. That will have to change. It seems everyone is now going towards tribal supremacy, nationalism, etc.

You guys should stop reading news in Igbo please. It is spoiling our agenda. Read it in Yoruba, Benin, Urhobo and Izon only.

AreaFada2:

It's obvious you have a different agenda. Your own is possibly to Stoke disaffection.

My point is simple enough. Benin has and had people of different ethnicities for centuries. Many distinguished themselves and are now even part of Benin elite. Like Governor Obaseki whose great great grandfather came from Anioma.

Obaseki is an Edo man please.
Stop this narrative please.

AreaFada2:

It's obvious you have a different agenda. Your own is possibly to Stoke disaffection.

My point is simple enough. Benin has and had people of different ethnicities for centuries. Many distinguished themselves and are now even part of Benin elite. Like Governor Obaseki whose great great grandfather came from Anioma.

The grand parents were benins
The oba had appiint them to rule the anioma people obaseki had left anioma areas back to edo because life wasnt easy for him there

MelesZenawi:


Obaseki is an Edo man please.
Stop this narrative please.

I just tiya

If you want to tell a stiey tell it proper and not half baked

gregyboy:


The grand parents were benins
The oba had appiint them to rule the anioma people obaseki had left anioma areas back to edo because life wasnt easy for him there

You are a blatant liar.

Oba of Benin presides over few local governments in Edo state.

I wonder how someone was so influential just to lose it in twinkle of an eye.

The Benin narrative is full of lies and moreover that was then and not now.

Anything Benin ends in Edo state and similarities with yorubas.

That's all.

MelesZenawi:


You are a blatant liar.

Oba of Benin presides over few local governments in Edo state.

I wonder how someone was so influential just to lose it in twinkle of an eye.

The Benin narrative is full of lies and moreover that was then and not now.

Anything Benin ends in Edo state and similarities with yorubas.

That's all.

Am talking of as early as 19century

gregyboy:


Am talking of as early as 19century

Years has passed, many things has happened and why are you spreading such narrative as if it was yesterday?

gregyboy:


The grand parents were benins
The oba had appiint them to rule the anioma people obaseki had left anioma areas back to edo because life wasnt easy for him there

Story. That is Obaseki family story. Twisted possibly by chief Obaseki to persuade the British if they could make him Oba when Oba Ovonramwen was in Calabar. Claiming his ancestor was once a Benin Prince sent to rule in Anioma. Read about Obaseki's ancestor Ogbeide Oyoo and Oba Adolor.

We know the current Obas, Obis and others who were Benin Princes in Benin history. Like Eleko/Oba of Eko/Lagos, Ogiamie Olu of Warri, etc.

But Obaski's ancestors are unknown in Benin before Oba Adolor brought them from Anioma about 1848. If we know Benin Princes from 1480s and 1500s, why won't we know his " alleged princely ancestors"? If at all they were Benin, they weren't rulers anywhere. Otherwise Oba Adolor would have restored him to that Anioma throne. Because the family claim they were cheated out of that Anioma throne. Such rulers must be sent a native chalk confirming their vassal position by a every Oba of Benin. In 1818, Deji Arakale of Akure refused that chalk. He even murdered Osague, the Oba's emissary.

On Benin soldiers' advancement to Akure he fled to the Ewi of Ado-Ekiti but the Ewi promptly sent him away. All the rulers he ran to refused him. Eventually one of such rulers at Uhen instead of helping him, delivered him to the head of Benin army chief Ezomo. The Deji was promptly beheaded for his rebellion.

The man Oba Ovonramwen gave the newly created Obaseki chieftaincy title in 1888/1889 was his childhood friend. The father of this childhood friend was son of an Anioma immigrant called Osifo Oyoo, who Oba Adolor met in quasi Anioma exile while still strategizing to get his throne.

This Anioma friend followed him to Benin when he became Oba. His friend became an Omada. One of those young men who stand by the Oba bearing a sceptre called Ada.

Recognised Benin Princes do not do sceptre bearer. That first rubbishes the idea that they were known Princes appointed to rule anywhere in the empire previously.

Like any hustling immigrant Oyoo was strategizing to rise through the ranks and certainly had ambitions for his children. Making his son close to the future king was one sure way out. He made it as his son became the first Obaseki of Benin.

MelesZenawi:



Are you okay @ bolded.

So Asaba is now Benin kingdom?

better face that una little kingdom and stop talking trash.

Anything Benin kingdom is in Edo state and ends there..

Why aren't others speaking Edo language?

I no blame u....Lol

Una kingdom starts and ends there.

Even Esan who are their cousins no even send them they want to bring their madness to Igbo Anioma area ....look at tiny Benin

AmuDimpka:


Even Esan who are their cousins no even send them they want to bring their madness to Igbo Anioma area ....look at tiny Benin

Must you display your ignorance publicly, have you not be following the thread? Did you not read where Nnamdi Azikiwe said the old Benin empire extended to Onitsha and he was a descendant.

MelesZenawi:


You are a blatant liar.

Oba of Benin presides over few local governments in Edo state.

I wonder how someone was so influential just to lose it in twinkle of an eye.

The Benin narrative is full of lies and moreover that was then and not now.

Anything Benin ends in Edo state and similarities with yorubas.

That's all.

You are now being mischievous, if Nnamdi Azikiwe said Onitsha was founded by descendants of Old Benin empire, why asked about Asaba that is just a stone throw from Benin City.

samuk:


You are now being mischievous, if Nnamdi Azikiwe said Onitsha was founded by descendants of Old Benin empire, why asked about Asaba that is just a stone throw from Benin City.

Please Asaba to Benin and Asaba to Onitsha which one is more nearer?

Listen to yourself if you're not being mischievous...by saying Benin founded Igboland..is that not what you mean?

We have over time x-ray similarities but found none , so how come these places were founded by Benins..

Bring a Benin and Igbo man...the difference will be clear

bring Benin and Yoruba man... the similarities is way inseparable.

While not doubting certain things but you're totally economical with the truth.

Let me deviate a little bit....even an asaba man will support biafra same as onitsha man but a Benin man will be against it same way a Yoruba man would.

So how come the people that founded a place now thinks differently and against same people that he founded and co-habits.

Why the difference?

AreaFada2:

Story. That is Obaseki family story. Twisted possibly by chief Obaseki to persuade the British if they could make him Oba when Oba Ovonramwen was in Calabar. Claiming his ancestor was once a Benin Prince sent to rule in Anioma. Read about Obaseki's ancestor Ogbeide Oyoo and Oba Adolor.

We know the current Obas, Obis and others who were Benin Princes in Benin history. Like Eleko/Oba of Eko/Lagos, Ogiamie Olu of Warri, etc.

But Obaski's ancestors are unknown in Benin before Oba Adolor brought them from Anioma about 1848. If we know Benin Princes from 1480s and 1500s, why won't we know his " alleged princely ancestors"? If at all they were Benin, they weren't rulers anywhere. Otherwise Oba Adolor would have restored him to that Anioma throne. Because the family claim they were cheated out of that Anioma throne. Such rulers must be sent a native chalk confirming their vassal position by a every Oba of Benin. In 1818, Deji Arakale of Akure refused that chalk. He even murdered Osague, the Oba's emissary.

On Benin soldiers' advancement to Akure he fled to the Ewi of Ado-Ekiti but the Ewi promptly sent him away. All the rulers he ran to refused him. Eventually one of such rulers at Uhen instead of helping him, delivered him to the head of Benin army chief Ezomo. The Deji was promptly beheaded for his rebellion.

The man Oba Ovonramwen gave the newly created Obaseki chieftaincy title in 1888/1889 was his childhood friend. The father of this childhood friend was son of an Anioma immigrant called Osifo Oyoo, who Oba Adolor met in quasi Anioma exile while still strategizing to get his throne.

This Anioma friend followed him to Benin when he became Oba. His friend became an Omada. One of those young men who stand by the Oba bearing a sceptre called Ada.

Recognised Benin Princes do not do sceptre bearer. That first rubbishes the idea that they were known Princes appointed to rule anywhere in the empire previously.

Like any hustling immigrant Oyoo was strategizing to rise through the ranks and certainly had ambitions for his children. Making his son close to the future king was one sure way out. He made it as his son became the first Obaseki of Benin.

Anioma is a recent acronym. Which particular place in Anioma?

MelesZenawi:



Anioma is a recent acronym. Which particular place in Anioma?

Do you want to know for real education or to cast doubt? So that I can tell you the debt of detail commensurate with your motive.

AreaFada2:
Do you want to know for real education or to cast doubt? So that I can tell you the debt of detail commensurate with your motive.

There is no motive here. The acronym you are using is recent and not in unison with the years you are calling.

Anioma is a recent cojoined words and your explanation doesn't match with the word.

So explain with time and name in line with the year you are mentioning if not then it will sound fabricated.

MelesZenawi:


There is no motive here. The acronym you are using is recent and not in unison with the years you are calling.

Anioma is a recent cojoined words and your explanation doesn't match with the word.

So explain with time and name in line with the year you are mentioning if not then it will sound fabricated.

The year is already in my previous post.

Allegedly it was Nsukwa Kingdom/Chiefdom.

But Prince Erediauwa (who became Oba Adolor) was in exile actually in Ewohinmi, which was his mother's village. Today in Esanland. But he was also visiting areas like Isi that was under Nsukwa those days. If you know that area, all not too far from Agbor. So some accounts even say they were from Agbor.
Saying Anioma is just for convenience to let people without knowledge of the area understand the location.

What we know in Benin is that Ogbeide Oyoo came with Prince Erediauwa from Ewohinmwin/Isi/Nsukwa. His son rose from scepter bearer to Ineh (the head of palace society of chiefs who cater for the princes/princess & the queens' welfare). Ineh is also head of the Royal Guild of Bronze Casters. Through that position he made his son Agho Obaseki the playmate of the Crown prince who became Oba Ovonramwen in 1888.

A separate Palace society of chiefs, the Iweguae takes care of the Oba's personal household. Leader is Chief Esere. Yet another palace society of chiefs, the Iwebo, are Keepers of the King's Regalia & Wardrobe, This is led by Chief Uwangue.

Iwebo chiefs in imperial times used to become very wealthy. Because they were also in charge of finance/taxes, tributes from vassal lands, commerce and trade.

AreaFada2:


The year is already in my previous post.

Allegedly it was Nsukwa Kingdom/Chiefdom.

But Prince Erediauwa (who became Oba Adolor) was in exile actually in Ewohinmi, which was his mother's village. Today in Esanland. But he was also visiting areas like Isi that was under Nsukwa those days. If you know that area, all not too far from Agbor. So some accounts even say they were from Agbor.
Saying Anioma is just for convenience to let people without knowledge of the area understand the location.

What we know in Benin is that Ogbeide Oyoo came with Prince Erediauwa from Ewohinmwin/Isi/Nsukwa. His son rose from scepter bearer to Ineh (the head of palace society of chiefs who cater for the princes/princess & the queens' welfare). Ineh is also head of the Royal Guild of Bronze Casters. Through that position he made his son Agho Obaseki the playmate of the Crown prince who became Oba Ovonramwen in 1888.

A separate Palace society of chiefs, the Iweguae takes care of the Oba's personal household. Leader is Chief Esere. Yet another palace society of chiefs, the Iwebo, are Keepers of the King's Regalia & Wardrobe, This is led by Chief Uwangue.

Iwebo chiefs in imperial times used to become very wealthy. Because they were also in charge of finance/taxes, tributes from vassal lands, commerce and trade.

Well from your submission, one thing stand out and that is the name Ewohinmwin...today Esan and it will be more understandable if we conclude that Obaseki has full ties with Esans. The rest sounds like make up of a sojourn to another land.

Benins can't be claiming Igboland when they actually reasons against same people. People that have been together for too long are known to have common understanding and struggles.

Why is this particular case difference...can you explain?