Truvel:
Pearlla, If U Are On Fb Add Me My Username Is Dan Doubra. There Are Things I Would Like 2 Ask U Privately?

Kobojunkie:
There can indeed be, but as far as Jeremiah 4(verse 1 through to verse 31) is concerned, it is still Jeremiah addressing God as regards what had become of the land of Judah.

But why do you have this belief in a pre-Adamic civilisation of men on an earth ruled over by Satan? Where does that truly come from?

petra1:

Kindly explain the verse below

[b ]Jeremiah 4:23 [/b]
23 I beheld the earth, and, lo, it was without form, and void;
and the heavens, and they had no light.

When did this incidence happen?
We shall come to Back It

petra1:


Satan Was the ruler of the world Who’s original name was Lucifer . He was Ruler over men on earth and also an Archangel in heaven . He led men in rebellion against God and angels in heaven . And God destroyed that world with a flood . That was before Adam was created . Millions of years ago.


Isaiah 14:12-18
12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning!
how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven,
I will exalt my throne above the stars of God:
I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:
14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.
15 Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.
16 They that see thee shall narrowly look upon thee, and consider thee, saying,
Is this the man that made the earth to tremble, that did shake kingdoms;
17 That made the world as a wilderness, and destroyed the cities thereof;
that opened not the house of his prisoners?
18 All the kings of the nations, even all of them,
lie in glory, every one in his own house.

Kobojunkie:
I can't explain a verse in isolation of the context in which it was presented in.
When dealing with material written and expressed in human language, context is key!

When I read through Jeremiah 4, I see that by the time I get to verse 23, Jeremiah is there describing the desolation that would became the land of Judah, a result of the evil way that the people lived(verse 18) and there refusal to heed the warnings from God(verse 19 - 22).

petra1:

So what time did the fulfillment take place

Truvel:
God Didn't Destroy D World B4 D Creation Of Adam & Eve It Was After Dem. It Was In Noah's Era God Destroyed D World. 2ndly, Satan Was Not D Ruler Of D World Neither Was He D Ruler Of Men On Earth, It Was After D Fall Of Adam & Eve He Became D Ruler. 3. There Is No Place In D Bible Dat Said Satan Was An Archangel.

Kobojunkie:
you mean exact year?
no clue but if memory serves, this prophecy is part reason why Jeremiah was dubbed the wailing prophet in his day. I think he, Jeremiah wailed for a period of about 35 years before the prophecy came to pass.

petra1:

Why did God ask Adam to re-plenish ? Which means refill ?

petra1:

What about the pre historic animals . Who’s fossil evidence show they were Millins of years old

petra1:


Why did God ask Adam to re-plenish ? Which means refill ?

What about the pre historic animals . Who’s fossil evidence show they were Millins of years old

petra1:


Look at it again

Jeremiah 4:23
23 I beheld the earth, and, lo, it was without form, and void;
and the heavens, and they had no light.

It says the earth was without form . Not the land of judah "The earth"

Secondly the heaven had not light . Apart from Genesis 1. Where else did this happen in history of man kind?
I will appreciate honesty

Kobojunkie:
do you refer to where God commands man to be fruitful and multiply?

Well, God did make the animals first.. We do not know for how long that work really did take except that He did it before man was created.

Kobojunkie:
As long as the language in question is human, context remains key.
Jeremiah, a man, was obviously, not a stranger to our ability to exaggerate from time to time. That makes more sense than suggesting it ok to pull a verse out of context to support an idea foreign to the context it exists in.

petra1:

Genesis 1:28
And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth,.

Plenish means fill
Replenish means refill or fill up again

The bible was clear it took 7 days. Secondly the age of the earth from Adam is just about 6000 years. Its easy to calculate from the bible. But we have bones of prehistoric animals dating millions of years

petra1:


Who did the exergeration Jeremiah ?

If a child ask you about this verse . When did the earth become void and empty and heaven had no light . What will be your response ?

You have said it’ a prophecy for Judah . But you haven’t told when it came to pass .

DappaD:
What proof do you have that Peter and Jude quoted from the boE? NONE right?

For all we know the boE attached such verses to make it seem legit.

petra1:
It was part of the Dead Sea scrolls . Among other books like Isaiah and co.

Secondly that’s the only book that contains the prophecy of Enoch

Where did Jude quote from

Kobojunkie:
The reason I ask is because my translation in fact says fill, not replenish. That is why I asked.

Yes, it says 7 days but since Moses, who supposedly wrote the story in genesis was not there and man was created on the sixth day, how can I be absolutely sure that it indeed meant day in man years. So?

Gombs:

Moses wrote those books by revelation from God!
However, it was reaffirmed 7days in the laws given to the children of Israel

petra1:


Satan can Use anything Secondly you can’t compared Satan with the angels . Satan was the ruler in the earth in the pre Adamite world . Read Isaiah 14

petra1:


It was part of the Dead Sea scrolls . Among other books like Isaiah and co.

Secondly that’s the only book that contains the prophecy of Enoch



Where did Jude quote from ?

DappaD:


This thread is nothing but upbuilding. I see no reason discussing in-depth about the demons(fallen angels)
However Satan is a fallen angel who didn't stand in the truth (John 8:44) and he is the ruler of the demons(who are still fallen angels) – Mark 3:22

If you say demons could possess humans and fallen angels couldn't, can you explain why Satan(who is a fallen angel and the ruler of the demons) was able to enter into Judas? – John 13:27

shadeyinka:

Anyone who has been used of God to conduct deliverance know that there is a difference between demons and fallen angels. Demons seem to have ALL the emotional weaknesses of human beings.

Do not forget that we have several classes of spirits we war against as Christians
Eph 6:12:
"For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the world's rulers, of the darkness of this age, against spiritual wickedness in high [places]."

Angels are full/complete beings as a union of their soul and spirits.
However,
Demons crave to occupy living beings (including animals) to have their full expression

Maximus69:


They're all fallen angels!

The Bible book of 1Corinthians 8:5 made us to understand that angels in heaven don't have the same rank, so when the sinned against God and were driven out of heaven we should be aware that some will work with witches, some with magicians, some with traditional healers and rulers, some with ritualists, some with cultists and others with Politicians, nevertheless they are all fallen angels, they may be operating in lower places or higher positions!

shadeyinka:

Ask yourself why "Legion" will ask for permission to go into pigs if they were fallen angels?
Mar 5:12:
"And all the demons begged Him, saying, Send us into the pigs, that we may enter into them."

Aren't Angels complete without a physical body?

Demons are called UNCLEAN SPIRITS because they are another class of spirit beings who DESIRE to live in a HOST.
Luk 11:24-26:
"When the unclean spirit has gone out of a man, he walks through dry places seeking rest . And finding none, he says, I will return to my house from which I came out. And when he comes, he finds [it] swept and decorated. And he goes and takes seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and entering in, they dwell there . And the last state of that man is worse than the first."

Do you think fallen angels need to seek a physical body to find rest?

Just a little experience in delivering the demonized will show you that there is difference between

Luk 10:20: "Yet do not rejoice in this, that the [evil] spirits are subject to you, rather rejoice because your names are written in Heaven."
AND
Jud 1:9: "But Michael, the archangel, when contending with the Devil, he argued about the body of Moses, he dared not bring a judgment of blasphemy, but said, Let the Lord rebuke you!"

Maximus69:


Fallen angels (demons) only possess people who already have dealings with them,
they can never possess anyone whose minds is filled with God's word {Matthew 12:43-45} , but when it comes to animals they can possess any at will! Genesis 3:1
The demons asked Jesus to allow them because they knew he has the power to stop them from possessing another creature in his presence!

shadeyinka:

Your assertion @bold has no scriptural bases and neither does it have any practical bases. Just a little experience will convince you that even though demons don't have the power to possess people at will, some people are born already demonized through the activities of their parents/grandparents (legal ground). Little wonder why God will order the Israelites to wipe out an entire community (babies, children, men, women, animals and things). These are polluted (UNCLEAN) and will conterminate the children of Israel.

Josh 6:18: "And you surely shall keep [clear of] the cursed thing, lest you make yourselves cursed when you take of the cursed things, and make the camp of Israel a curse, and trouble it."

1Sam15:3
Now go and strike Amalek and completely destroy everything that they have; do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, child and infant, ox and sheep, camel and donkey.’”

What was the offence of the children and infants? Why are they regarded as polluted and should be destroyed?


Josh 6:21: "And they completely destroyed all in the city, both man and woman, young and old, and ox, and sheep, and ass, with the edge of the sword."

Josh 7:15: "And it shall be, he who is taken with the cursed thing shall be burned with fire, he and all he has, because he has broken the covenant of the LORD, and because he has done wickedness in Israel."

Maximus69:


You're quoting what God asked the Israelites to do for sure but it's not because of demons that God asked the Israelites to wipe them out!

Maximus69:

Take note that the race will continue if their children should grow up and they will be told how their parents were killed, so to prevent them from growing up to come and start attacking God's people they must be wiped out.

Maximus69:

And as for their livestock God doesn't want his people to take anything out of Amalek because that could be tantamount to robbery which most warriors of the time does for a living!

shadeyinka:

So will you please give a concrete reason?
God could have asked the Israelites to save the children and babies to raise them in the way of righteousness: couldn't he?


For someone who had been in the military, this is disappointingly naive. Babies couldn't have any recollection other than what they've known (which is nothing).

Don't forget that the same God gave permission to the Children of Israel to marry virgins of their choice amongst the Canaanites.
Deu 21:10-13:
"When you go forth to war against your enemies, and the LORD your God has delivered them into your hands and you have taken them captive, and see among the captives a beautiful woman, and have a desire to her, that you would take [her] for your wife, then you shall bring her home to your house. And she shall shave her head and dress her nails. And she shall put off the clothing of her captivity, and shall remain in your house, and shall sorrow for her father and her mother a full month. And after that you shall go in to her and be her husband, and she shall be your wife."

If children could remember, how much more the beautiful women?

Your argument is lame!


But God also permits them sometimes to take children, gold, silver, animals etc
Deu 20:13-14:
"And when the LORD your God has delivered it into your hands, you shall strike every male of it with the edge of the sword. But the women , and the little ones , and the cattle, and all that is in the city , all the spoil of it, you shall take to yourself . And you shall eat the spoil of your enemies, which the LORD your God has given you."

So, why do you think our Righteous God ordered the complete extermination of a race while some other nations were relatively not so unfortunate?

Maximus69:


That was before they settled in the land of Canaan my friend, so the women and children will be taken to a place where the Israelites themselves haven't been before.
There is a great difference between those who never settled in a place and those who are already settlers.
When soldiers go for wars we destroy our enemies but when we ourselves have not gotten a place to settle, we carry everyone along so that we can all settle together as one family, but as for those who already knew where they're going, we make sure we put into consideration what is obtainable in our place of residence before taking anyone along!

shadeyinka:

Check up your arguments with bible history. I have quoted just two books for you: Deuteronomy and Joshua. In both books, the children of Israel had not possessed the land.

If what you are saying/your argument is correct, the command for selective absorption came before the command for total extermination.

BUT NO!
The extermination of Jericho and AI came way before Israel occupied the land (or which tribe inherited the burnt cities?). Same with the five kings of the Amorites
Josh 10:5: "And the five kings of the Amorites, the king of Jerusalem, the king of Hebron, the king of Jarmuth, the king of Lachish, the king of Eglon, gathered themselves. And they went up, they and all their armies, and camped before Gibeon, and made war against it."

Throughout the lifetime of Joshua, it was a tale of complete extermination of the Canaanites wherever they are engaged.

Josh 13:1: "Now Joshua [was] old, going on [in] days. And the LORD said to him, You are old, far along in days, [and] there remains yet very much land to be possessed."

Don't forget that it was Moses in his lifetime that shared up the land of Canaan even before they stepped there foot across the Jordan.

Josh 17:16,18:
"And the sons of Joseph said, The hill is not enough for us. And all the Canaanites who live in the land of the valley [have] chariots of iron, those who [are] of Beth-shean and its towns, and those who [are] of the valley of Jezreel. … But the mountain shall be yours, for it [is] a forest, and you shall cut it down. And the outer limits of it shall be yours. For you shall drive out the Canaanites , even though they have iron chariots and though they [are] strong."


Your argument hold no water.

Maximus69:


Jericho is part of the land God promised the Israelites Sir, that's what Rahab could say "i know JEHOVAH will give you this land"
{Joshua 2:9} Jericho is part of the land God promised them Sir! Exodus 3:8