There was once a thriving great city whose people dwelt in affluence. Those were days in antiquity when men listened only to oracles and worshipped idols.

This thriving great city suddenly became a host to many problems and calamities. The inhabitants died young. War, pestilences and severe hardship almost brought the city to extinction.

At the instruction of the king, the city priests contacted the Oracle and brought instructions from the gods.

The solution to the city's misfortunes require the adventurous journey of 100 men into a far away ancient city. They must cross seven rivers to the east of the city to get to this ancient town. Each of these 100 men must return with a bowl full of the dust of that town. 100 bowls of sand from the ancient town would heal the land.

As a matter of urgency, the king enlisted a group of 100 volunteers. They were mighty warriors from noble families. A day was fixed for the journey. The 100 volunteers prepared for the D day.

Just as the D day began to approach, odd news began to filter into the city. There's a small town en-route this ancient city. The 100 men must pass through that town to get into the city. There's no other route. However, the king of this small town was rumored to be hostile to travellers. He beheads every Traveller who does not wear a red cap. So was the rumor.

There was no way of ascertaining the veracity of this rumour since no one has ever travelled there from the city. So, some believed, while others disagreed.

This rumour divided the 100 travellers into 3 groups.

Group 1 : Those who believed the rumor and therefore bought themselves a red cap.

Group 2: Those who were unsure of the rumor but bought themselves a red cap to avoid distasteful eventualities.

Group 3: Those who disbelieved the rumor and never saw the need to get a red cap.

The D day came and all the 100 men set on their journey after receiving blessings from the king. The company was a mixture of those who wore a red cap, and those who didn't.

There was an old man in this city. The oldest of them all. After the 100 men had departed, he summoned his numerous children and said, 'Do you see this travelling company? Those who have a red cap are wise because, if in case, this rumour turns out to be true, these wise ones would save their heads a million times. And if it's a false rumor, they actually have nothing to lose. But those who journeyed without a red cap are fools, for if this rumour turns out to be true, they'll certainly lose their heads."

Conclusion
The company of those who wore a red cap are the believers. If there's no God out there in death, they have nothing to lose.

But the Atheists who are taking a godless journey into the unknown eternity are simply being reckless. If in case there's a God out there. They're losers.

HisSplendor:
There was once a thriving great city whose people dwelt in affluence. Those were days in antiquity when men listened only to oracles and worshipped idols.

The thriving great city suddenly became a host to many problems and calamities. The inhabitants died young. War, pestilences severe hardship almost brought the city to extinction.

At the instruction of the king, the city priests contacted the Oracle and brought instructions from the gods.

The solution to the city's misfortunes require the adventurous journey of 100 men into a far away ancient town. They must cross seven rivers to the east of the city to get to this ancient town. Each of these 100 men must return with bowl full of the dust of that town. 100 bowls of sand from the ancient town would heal the land.

As a matter of urgency, the king enlisted a group of 100 volunteers. They were mighty warriors from noble families. A day was fixed for the journey. The 100 volunteers prepared for the D day.

Just as the D day began to approach, news began to filter into the city. There's a small town en-route this ancient town. The 100 men must pass through that town to get into the ancient city. There's no other route. However, the king of this small town was rumored to be hostile to travellers. He beheads every Traveller who does not wear a red cap. So was the rumor. There was no way of ascertaining the veracity of this rumour since no one has ever travelled there from the city. So, some believed, while others disagreed.

This rumour divided the 100 travellers into 3 groups.

Group 1 : Those who believed the rumor and therefore bought themselves a red cap.

Group 2: Those who were unsure of the rumor but bought themselves a red cap to avoid distasteful eventualities.

Group 3: Those who disbelieved the rumor and never saw the need to get a red cap.

The D day came and all the 100 men set on their journey after receiving blessings from the king. The company was a mixture of those who wore a red cap, and those who didn't.

There was an old man in this city. The oldest of them all. After the 100 men had departed, he summoned his children and said, 'Do you see this travelling company? Those who have a red cap are wise because, if in case, this rumour turns out to be true, these wise ones would save their heads a million times. And if it's a false rumor, they actually have nothing to lose. But those who journeyed without a red cap are fools, for if this rumour turns out true, they'll certainly lose their heads."

Conclusion
The company of those who wore a red cap are the believers. If there's no God out there in death, they have nothing to lose.

But the Atheists who are taking a godless journey into the unknown eternity are simply being reckless. If in case there's a God out there. They're losers.

Agnosticism rocks.

I will be charitable to say I do agree with the story. there's nothing to lose if you wear the red cap. But your story ignored a possibility that the man may in reality kill only those with red cap, there's a possibility like any rumour to be opposite of what is being told.

have you considered the possibility God actually exists but only atheists would be allowed into heaven? I find it bizarre how theists never thought about that possibility. like we die and God goes "HopefulLandlord, I exist but the test is to weed out those that would believe something on no evidence, you passed. you may pass"

I guess you guys would find the thought highly disturbing lol



All in all, what you're preaching is a variation of the usual "Pascal's Wager" which says something like "Pretend to believe just to hedge your bet"

The main problem with Pascal's wager is the fallacy of False Dilemma. It only offers two options when there are at least five alternatives:
The Christian God and afterlife, some other god and afterlife, some god and no afterlife, atheism with afterlife, and atheism without afterlife. In addition, because of the multitude of possible gods, if any god is as likely as another, the probability of the Christian being right is P=1/n where n is the number of possible gods. If we assume that there is an infinite number of possible gods, the probability being right is infinitely small. Since there is an infinitely large probability of picking the wrong god, one could go to some other god's version of hell. This is referred to as the "avoiding the wrong hell problem"
The question of Pascal's Wager is easily defeated by the observation that the wager is predicated on the existence of only one god that being a Christian god. If the wager were efficient then why prefer any one god. All of humanities gods should be eligible for the possibility of existence and therefore you should worship all gods to fully satisfy Pascal's Wager. That of course would fly into the face of declarations of many those gods where that being should be worshiped above all others presumably because of that gods' penchant for envy/jealousy.

Is this how frail your believe in God is? I weep for you. Please, study the bible very well and make sure that God exist before trying to convince someone to believe in God too. Study and build your faith.

jibovico:
Is this how frail your believe in God is? I weep for you. Please, study the bible very well and make sure that God exist before trying to convince someone to believe in God too. Study and build your faith.

My faith in God is strong. I'm beyond the stage of probability. I have an active ongoing relationship with God.

That story is not a reflection of me but for my audience. Just to let them see the need to seek out God, so they can find Him.

"So, to the fools, I became as a fool so I can win some."

hopefulLandlord:
I will be charitable to say I do agree with the story. there's nothing to lose if you wear the red cap. But your story ignored a possibility that the man may in reality kill only those with red cap, there's a possibility like any rumour to be opposite of what is being told.

have you considered the possibility God actually exists but only atheists would be allowed into heaven? I find it bizarre how theists never thought about that possibility. like we die and God goes "HopefulLandlord, I exist but the test is to weed out those that would believe something on no evidence, you passed. you may pass"

I guess you guys would find the thought highly disturbing lol



All in all, what you're preaching is a variation of the usual "Pascal's Wager" which says something like "Pretend to believe just to hedge your bet"

The main problem with Pascal's wager is the fallacy of False Dilemma. It only offers two options when there are at least five alternatives:
The Christian God and afterlife, some other god and afterlife, some god and no afterlife, atheism with afterlife, and atheism without afterlife. In addition, because of the multitude of possible gods, if any god is as likely as another, the probability of the Christian being right is P=1/n where n is the number of possible gods. If we assume that there is an infinite number of possible gods, the probability being right is infinitely small. Since there is an infinitely large probability of picking the wrong god, one could go to some other god's version of hell. This is referred to as the "avoiding the wrong hell problem"
The question of Pascal's Wager is easily defeated by the observation that the wager is predicated on the existence of only one god that being a Christian god. If the wager were efficient then why prefer any one god. All of humanities gods should be eligible for the possibility of existence and therefore you should worship all gods to fully satisfy Pascal's Wager. That of course would fly into the face of declarations of many those gods where that being should be worshiped above all others presumably because of that gods' penchant for envy/jealousy.

So you mean you have a probability of being admitted into God's heaven even after denying His existence and blasphened and then, those who believed, worshipped and honoured God would be thrusted out? Clap for yourself. You're a very wise man!

Did you even remember that the guys wearing the red cap could easily dispose of their caps in the event that the king beheads those who wear it. Still, they have nothing to lose.

You talked about the probability of the Christian God being the true God. Have you wondered why there's a multiplicity of gods and religions in the first place? It's because man lost God, and in devising many ways to find Him, Satan deceitfully led him into many errors. Man is seeking that which he lost.

It's the responsibility of every man to prepare for his or her own eternity. Your argument is too logically weak to say the least.

HisSplendor:
There was once a thriving great city whose people dwelt in affluence. Those were days in antiquity when men listened only to oracles and worshipped idols.

This thriving great city suddenly became a host to many problems and calamities. The inhabitants died young. War, pestilences and severe hardship almost brought the city to extinction.

At the instruction of the king, the city priests contacted the Oracle and brought instructions from the gods.

The solution to the city's misfortunes require the adventurous journey of 100 men into a far away ancient city. They must cross seven rivers to the east of the city to get to this ancient town. Each of these 100 men must return with a bowl full of the dust of that town. 100 bowls of sand from the ancient town would heal the land.

As a matter of urgency, the king enlisted a group of 100 volunteers. They were mighty warriors from noble families. A day was fixed for the journey. The 100 volunteers prepared for the D day.

Just as the D day began to approach, odd news began to filter into the city. There's a small town en-route this ancient city. The 100 men must pass through that town to get into the city. There's no other route. However, the king of this small town was rumored to be hostile to travellers. He beheads every Traveller who does not wear a red cap. So was the rumor.

There was no way of ascertaining the veracity of this rumour since no one has ever travelled there from the city. So, some believed, while others disagreed.

This rumour divided the 100 travellers into 3 groups.

Group 1 : Those who believed the rumor and therefore bought themselves a red cap.

Group 2: Those who were unsure of the rumor but bought themselves a red cap to avoid distasteful eventualities.

Group 3: Those who disbelieved the rumor and never saw the need to get a red cap.

The D day came and all the 100 men set on their journey after receiving blessings from the king. The company was a mixture of those who wore a red cap, and those who didn't.

There was an old man in this city. The oldest of them all. After the 100 men had departed, he summoned his numerous children and said, 'Do you see this travelling company? Those who have a red cap are wise because, if in case, this rumour turns out to be true, these wise ones would save their heads a million times. And if it's a false rumor, they actually have nothing to lose. But those who journeyed without a red cap are fools, for if this rumour turns out to be true, they'll certainly lose their heads."

Conclusion
The company of those who wore a red cap are the believers. If there's no God out there in death, they have nothing to lose.

But the Atheists who are taking a godless journey into the unknown eternity are simply being reckless. If in case there's a God out there. They're losers.

Since it’s a rumor, what if they got it all wrong, or the rumor was actually spread by the enemy? and it is actually those that wears the red cap that get killed?
Red is an hostile color.
Since it’s a rumor how sure that the right color of the cap is red and not green, and that red cap actually signifies war?

And your conclusion is wrong, god is a title not a person, we have different gods claiming different things.
Yahweh is not same with allah, allah is not same with brahma, brahma is not the same with Akal Mura, so as the other thousand gods, you’ll have to wear hundreds of different color of caps(believe in hundreds of gods)then.

The Folly of Theism.

HisSplendor:


So you mean you have a probability of being admitted into God's heaven even after denying His existence and blasphened and then, those who believed, worshipped and honoured God would be thrusted out? Clap for yourself. You're a very wise man!

try to know the difference between probably and possibility

Did you even remember that the guys wearing the red cap could easily dispose of their caps in the event that the king beheads those who wear it. Still, they have nothing to lose.

maybe he detains them first then separates them based on their cap or no cap first? since we're discussing hypothetical

You talked about the probability of the Christian God being the true God. Have you wondered why there's a multiplicity of gods and religions in the first place? It's because man lost God, and in devising many ways to find Him, Satan deceitfully led him into many errors. Man is seeking that which he lost.

Story.

It's the responsibility of every man to prepare for his or her own eternity. Your argument is too logically weak to say the least.

Psychological projection at its best

hopefulLandlord:

try to know the difference between probably and possibility maybe he detains them first then separates them based on their cap or no cap first? since we're discussing hypothetical
Story.
Psychological projection at its best

Clap for yourself.

HisSplendor:


Clap for yourself.

I did

hopefulLandlord:


I did

I hope it made you feel real good?

HisSplendor:

I hope it made you feel real good?

Ain't that the goal?

hopefulLandlord:


Ain't that the goal?

Lol. A nice goal. Hahaha.

HisSplendor:

Lol. A nice goal. Hahaha.

glad you liked it

Maynman:


Since it’s a rumor, what if they got it all wrong, or the rumor was actually spread by the enemy? and it is actually those that wears the red cap that get killed?
Red is an hostile color.
Since it’s a rumor how sure that the right color of the cap is red and not green, and that red cap actually signifies war?

And your conclusion is wrong, god is a title not a person, we have different gods claiming different things.
Yahweh is not same with allah, allah is not same with brahma, brahma is not the same with Akal Mura, so as the other thousand gods, you’ll have to wear hundreds of different color of caps(believe in hundreds of gods)then.

The Folly of Theism.

There's only one God. The multiplicity of gods is a deliberate confusion sponsored by Satan. If you'll really seek God, He'll reveal Himself to you. Satan's deception not withstanding. If you reject Him, you're simply being reckless.

HisSplendor:


There's only one God. The multiplicity of gods is a deliberate confusion sponsored by Satan. If you'll really seek God, He'll reveal Himself to you. Satan's deception not withstanding. If you reject Him, you're simply being reckless.

god is a title not a person, you are quoting “satan” that’s only found in your religion.
In judaism where Christianity originates from, “satan” is not an entity but a title, only in your Christianity that “satan” became an entity.

“god” is an English word, was new or Old Testament written in English?
What was written in the place of “god” before the books were translated to English?
From your statement we know your god is a mere male(he, him).
You’ve been brainwashed and indoctrinated to worship yahweh, the israelite god.

I’m sure you are educated, yahweh is a god, yahweh and allah are 2 gods. Singular and Plural.

You using capital “G”, for your own deity doesn’t change anything, i wonder how you pronounce “god” and “God”

HisSplendor:
There was once a thriving great city whose people dwelt in affluence. Those were days in antiquity when men listened only to oracles and worshipped idols.

This thriving great city suddenly became a host to many problems and calamities. The inhabitants died young. War, pestilences and severe hardship almost brought the city to extinction.

At the instruction of the king, the city priests contacted the Oracle and brought instructions from the gods.

The solution to the city's misfortunes require the adventurous journey of 100 men into a far away ancient city. They must cross seven rivers to the east of the city to get to this ancient town. Each of these 100 men must return with a bowl full of the dust of that town. 100 bowls of sand from the ancient town would heal the land.

As a matter of urgency, the king enlisted a group of 100 volunteers. They were mighty warriors from noble families. A day was fixed for the journey. The 100 volunteers prepared for the D day.

Just as the D day began to approach, odd news began to filter into the city. There's a small town en-route this ancient city. The 100 men must pass through that town to get into the city. There's no other route. However, the king of this small town was rumored to be hostile to travellers. He beheads every Traveller who does not wear a red cap. So was the rumor.

There was no way of ascertaining the veracity of this rumour since no one has ever travelled there from the city. So, some believed, while others disagreed.

This rumour divided the 100 travellers into 3 groups.

Group 1 : Those who believed the rumor and therefore bought themselves a red cap.

Group 2: Those who were unsure of the rumor but bought themselves a red cap to avoid distasteful eventualities.

Group 3: Those who disbelieved the rumor and never saw the need to get a red cap.

The D day came and all the 100 men set on their journey after receiving blessings from the king. The company was a mixture of those who wore a red cap, and those who didn't.

There was an old man in this city. The oldest of them all. After the 100 men had departed, he summoned his numerous children and said, 'Do you see this travelling company? Those who have a red cap are wise because, if in case, this rumour turns out to be true, these wise ones would save their heads a million times. And if it's a false rumor, they actually have nothing to lose. But those who journeyed without a red cap are fools, for if this rumour turns out to be true, they'll certainly lose their heads."

Conclusion
The company of those who wore a red cap are the believers. If there's no God out there in death, they have nothing to lose.

But the Atheists who are taking a godless journey into the unknown eternity are simply being reckless. If in case there's a God out there. They're losers.

What did you call it? Unknown. Those fellows KNOW there is city enroute their destination, we on the other hand don't know anything after death.

HisSplendor:


You talked about the probability of the Christian God being the true God. Have you wondered why there's a multiplicity of gods and religions in the first place?

It's because man lost God, and in devising many ways to find Him, Satan deceitfully led him into many errors. Man is seeking that which he lost.

This argument really doesn't favor you as much as you think. If anything, it does the exact opposite. Especially when you look not only at the number of previous religions, but the nature of them.

The idea that "Man" lost "God" is a concept that exists within your religion, and a (pretty inaccurate) way for you to try to describe the past based on your highly subjective worldview.

As an example, I could believe in a religion that has multiple gods, and then claim that the existence of multiple religions is proof that the many gods are fighting for superiority or control over humans. It is an empty claim.

Before you can go ahead to say man lost "God", you need to first clearly define what this God is, and then show evidence for that particular God. So far, I'm yet to see a theist do that.

It's the responsibility of every man to prepare for his or her own eternity. Your argument is too logically weak to say the least.

I find it a tad bit ironic, that you'd accuse someone else of weak logic, when you literally created a thread to glorify one of the weakest arguments for a specific God, which is Pascal's wager.

Wilgrea7:

This argument really doesn't favor you as much as you think. If anything, it does the exact opposite. Especially when you look not only at the number of previous religions, but the nature of them.

Atheists and lies, same synonym. His argument has been standing and none has been able to successfully bring it down. All you people are doing is simply attack it but it has not fallen down.

Wilgrea7:

The idea that "Man" lost "God" is a concept that exists within your religion, and a (pretty inaccurate) way for you to try to describe the past based on your highly subjective worldview.

However, he chooses to describe it, is his right so it is either you give a valid objection or you have nothing to say

Wilgrea7:

As an example, I could believe in a religion that has multiple gods, and then claim that the existence of multiple religions is proof that the many gods are fighting for superiority or control over humans. It is an empty claim.

You are confusing the exercise of your right and power to believe any thing whether real or imagined with real eyeity and Truth.

You have a right to believe in one million gods, it is no one's business, but when you speak up, then you must speak The Truth.

And right now, no one asks you whether you believe in many gods or none at all, so your comment here is invalid.

LordReed:


What did you call it? Unknown Those fellows KNOW there is city enroute their destination, we on the other hand don't know anything after death.

We know you know but we know that you are using your right and power to refuse to know or pretense to not know exactly as a student can lie and deny that he does not know what happens to the food he eats. And there isn't any body in the world who can prove it to him.

Dtruthspeaker:


We know you know but we know that you are using your right and power to refuse to know or pretense to not know exactly as a student can lie and deny that he does not know what happens to the food he eats. And there isn't any body in the world who can prove it to him.

A dead person knows nothing, unless you can show me a currently dead person telling you anything they know.

Dtruthspeaker:


Atheists and lies, same synonym. His argument has been standing and none has been able to successfully bring it down. All you people are doing is simply attack it but it has not fallen down.

However, he chooses to describe it, is his right so it is either you give a valid objection or you have nothing to say

You are confusing the exercise of your right and power to believe any thing whether real or imagined with real eyeity and Truth.

You have a right to believe in one million gods, it is no one's business, but when you speak up, then you must speak The Truth.

And right now, no one asks you whether you believe in many gods or none at all, so your comment here is invalid.

Nothing you've written here makes the slightest bit of sense in relation to the topic, or to my response to the OP.

And I'm not getting into an argument with you over “rights" because it has nothing to do with the topic.

If you have an argument or rebuttal, then bring it forward.. if not, then

Wilgrea7:

Nothing you've written here makes the slightest bit of sense in relation to the topic, or to my response to the OP.

It does because I show your response is invalid.

Wilgrea7:

And I'm not getting into an argument with you over “rights" because it has nothing to do with the topic.

The word "argument" means Law is involved. And where there is Law, there are rights!

So, right now, your response is invalid.

LordReed:

A dead person knows nothing, unless you can show me a currently dead person telling you anything they know.

A dead phone may not know anything after its death but when it's Maker's Manual shows that the phone can always be repaired, then the dead phone is supposed to know, if it read and understood it's Manufacturers Manual, that it cannot die unless and until it's Manufacturer destroys it.

Dtruthspeaker:


A dead phone may not know anything after its death but when it's Maker's Manual shows that the phone can always be repaired, then the dead phone is supposed to know, if it read and understood it's Manufacturers Manual, that it cannot die unless and until it's Manufacturer destroys it.

I have stated how you can show I am wrong, your analogy is not useful to me.

LordReed:


I have stated how you can show I am wrong, your analogy is not useful to me.

You have no right to dictate how I show you are wrong.

Dtruthspeaker:


You have no right to dictate how I show you are wrong.

LoLz! I mentioned a practical way to show I am wrong, you brought useless analogy yet you want to drag. Bwahahahahaha!

LordReed:


LoLz! I mentioned a practical way to show I am wrong, you brought useless analogy yet you want to drag. Bwahahahahaha!

Your phone and it's manufacturer and their manuals and your knowledge of manufacturers and their products, is also a practical way

Dtruthspeaker:


Your phone and it's manufacturer and their manuals and your knowledge of manufacturers and their products, is also a practical way

That's is called an analogy since I didn't ask you about phones.

LordReed:

That's is called an analogy since I didn't ask you about phones.

And analogies is a way of seeing things that is impossible to see because of natural limitations

Dtruthspeaker:


And analogies is a way of seeing things that is impossible to see because of natural limitations

Which is not the definition of practical.

HisSplendor:
There was once a thriving great city whose people dwelt in affluence. Those were days in antiquity when men listened only to oracles and worshipped idols.

This thriving great city suddenly became a host to many problems and calamities. The inhabitants died young. War, pestilences and severe hardship almost brought the city to extinction.

At the instruction of the king, the city priests contacted the Oracle and brought instructions from the gods.

The solution to the city's misfortunes require the adventurous journey of 100 men into a far away ancient city. They must cross seven rivers to the east of the city to get to this ancient town. Each of these 100 men must return with a bowl full of the dust of that town. 100 bowls of sand from the ancient town would heal the land.

As a matter of urgency, the king enlisted a group of 100 volunteers. They were mighty warriors from noble families. A day was fixed for the journey. The 100 volunteers prepared for the D day.

Just as the D day began to approach, odd news began to filter into the city. There's a small town en-route this ancient city. The 100 men must pass through that town to get into the city. There's no other route. However, the king of this small town was rumored to be hostile to travellers. He beheads every Traveller who does not wear a red cap. So was the rumor.

There was no way of ascertaining the veracity of this rumour since no one has ever travelled there from the city. So, some believed, while others disagreed.

This rumour divided the 100 travellers into 3 groups.

Group 1 : Those who believed the rumor and therefore bought themselves a red cap.

Group 2: Those who were unsure of the rumor but bought themselves a red cap to avoid distasteful eventualities.

Group 3: Those who disbelieved the rumor and never saw the need to get a red cap.

The D day came and all the 100 men set on their journey after receiving blessings from the king. The company was a mixture of those who wore a red cap, and those who didn't.

There was an old man in this city. The oldest of them all. After the 100 men had departed, he summoned his numerous children and said, 'Do you see this travelling company? Those who have a red cap are wise because, if in case, this rumour turns out to be true, these wise ones would save their heads a million times. And if it's a false rumor, they actually have nothing to lose. But those who journeyed without a red cap are fools, for if this rumour turns out to be true, they'll certainly lose their heads."

Conclusion
The company of those who wore a red cap are the believers. If there's no God out there in death, they have nothing to lose.

But the Atheists who are taking a godless journey into the unknown eternity are simply being reckless. If in case there's a God out there. They're losers.

Even with anything attributed to God or a God, what may be well?