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Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / How Do Spirits Exist? (7047 Views)
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Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by LordReed(m): 11:06am On Nov 24, 2021 |
TenQ: I didn't say you used it. I was using clearly established facts which you were rubbishing as lame. It has been clearly established that the mind is a product of the brain, no brain no mind but you called that lame when you can't even give any clearly established facts yourself. Instead I have said: Creates what doubt other than the criteria for knowing that a person is dead needs to be fine tuned because obviously our current level of instrumentation is not enough to see that these people are not dead yet. In some cases they are not even dead merely having what seems like an OBE. In all the places they have tested these NDEs by putting unseen messages directly above the patient, not one person has come back and reported what those messages are. So there clearly is no independent part of the human travelling during those episodes or else they would have seen those messages and reported them back. 2. So you can see how my foetus analogy is perfectly illustrated I ask for methodology but instead you produce one of the lamest analogies you could have chosen. For one a foetus cannot think so cannot conceptualise or problem solve. Secondly a foetus cannot even use its body not to talk of using tools so how would it detect anything. We have challenges with some scientific concepts that you could have used as an analogy but instead you chose a very unanalogous situation. But beyond that I didn't ask you for an analogy, I asked you for a methodology or do you not know the difference between the two? |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by KnownUnknown: 11:28am On Nov 24, 2021 |
FreeIgboho: No, I probably don’t like Sam Harris or any other supposed authority. He says the “I” is an illusion but I bet he still answers to Sam Harris and still refers to himself as “I”. Also, he’s one of those atheist whites who down Christianity but romanticize Buddhism and that’s where he got the no “I” nonsense. The only one assuming about time/space and other nonsense is you. And your assumption is based on the misunderstanding of a movie. If you’re 100% sure there is thinking, then you should be 100% sure that there is a brain doing the thinking. A brain housed in an individual’s skull does the thinking unless you can show me a disembodied thought. Again, you keep taking about there is no “I” so how can there be “we”? P.S. Sam Harris and the likes of him who use phrases like “western civilization started from the Greeks” or “judeo-Christian values” are no people I place much value in or give a damn about their views. Their views are obviously warped by ignorance and the mental illness ironically called “white supremacy”. 1 Like |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by Nothingserious: 11:28am On Nov 24, 2021 |
MaxInDHouse: Lol! Thank you. He is at liberty to explain to us. But I think it’s a very tight and uphill task to explain the Bible ( even the Old Testament) and excise the Messiah from the accounts. |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by LordReed(m): 11:45am On Nov 24, 2021 |
KnownUnknown: He says he hasn't even seen the movie, can you imagine. He hasn't seen the movie but he knows it's a perfect analogy. LMAO! |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by FreeIgboho: 12:51pm On Nov 24, 2021 |
LordReed: See?! Yet u want absolute proof that God exists! I knew eventually you’d say it yourself! The only thing we can be sure of in this our reality is that something exists. Everything else beyond that is probability including my/your existence. The same probability that makes it very likely there is someone behind all this - God! |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by FreeIgboho: 12:55pm On Nov 24, 2021 |
KnownUnknown: The man is a neuroscientist. That’s his expertise. I don’t think it’s yours. See what he says below. Tell us what part of it is false. (Notice how what he is saying is what I told you is POSSIBLE. Yet here he is, stating it as a fact!) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ut6cr89GDVk |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by TenQ: 1:02pm On Nov 24, 2021 |
LordReed:Some verified NDE accounts show the contrary. That is why some scientists would rather death be redefined away from the standard lack of electrical activities in the brain. LordReed:When some peoples OBE's are reporting real events outside the location of their bodies, a serious doubt is created in the standard scientific narration; don't you think so? The problem you are highlighting here is repeatability of both NDE and OBE experiences. Unfortunately, there seem to be no form of predictability in their outcomes. LordReed:There is no methodology one can propose over what you have no control over! Meaning that they are not subject to scientific studies. Even when one is casting out demons from a person, you don't have any control over what will happen or how it will happen. No one does! |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by LordReed(m): 1:02pm On Nov 24, 2021 |
FreeIgboho: Can you quote where I said I want absolute proof that a god exists? I have said it before and lemme repeat here so that you'll see it, I do hold out a probability that a god exists and that probability is currently at 1%. That is how improbable I think of the possibility. Meanwhile you have not answered any of the questions I posed to you and also note I did not mention god in any of the questions I asked, you are the one bringing up god. Note it so that when the discussion takes a turn that puts you in an untenable position you don't start laying blame elsewhere. LoL. 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by LordReed(m): 1:05pm On Nov 24, 2021 |
TenQ: Provide some examples so I can understand what you are talking about. There is no methodology one can propose over what you have no control over! LMAO! There you have it folks, we cannot probe their beliefs because it is out of their hands yet they truly believe it all. Ok o, just note what you have said here for future reference. LMFAO! |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by FreeIgboho: 1:09pm On Nov 24, 2021 |
KnownUnknown: What’s with your fixation with that movie? It’s just a vehicle for analogy!!! As for time/space, does it mean he didn’t exist when he wasn’t thinking? How can thinking NOW establish his existence yesterday? |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by KnownUnknown: 1:25pm On Nov 24, 2021 |
FreeIgboho: I don’t care that he is a neuroscientist. Besides, what he said is not based on neuroscience but metaphysics from the Buddhist perspective. Both your edited video and the full clip makes that clear. It’s contradictory word salad with the same old religious ideas. He says there is no self in one breath then talks about self transcendence in the other. The “I” exists, otherwise I wouldn’t be speaking to you. The sense of self and consciousness comes from the brain and we’ve seen people lose their sense of self when the brain starts malfunctioning regardless of anything the Buddhists say. Appeal to authority doesn’t work here. |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by KnownUnknown: 1:30pm On Nov 24, 2021 |
FreeIgboho: My fixation?! Aren’t you the one who posted the movie and made the absurd neo/matrix analogy? Rephrase those questions. |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by LordReed(m): 2:00pm On Nov 24, 2021 |
FreeIgboho: There we go, blaming other people for the very thing you brought up. How is he the one fixated on the movie when it is you always bringing up the movie? LMFAO! |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by sonmvayina(m): 2:14pm On Nov 24, 2021 |
Nothingserious: God and Messiah are two different beings...don't mix them. God is the creator and saviour of man. When you confess and forsake he forgives after all it is his commandments you broke. The Jewish Messiah is a man from the tribe of Judah meaning his father will be from Judah and his mother must be a Jewish woman. The idea of God mating with human is not part of Jewish religion. It is greek/Roman mythology. For the purpose of the Messiah see my new thread.. |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by sonmvayina(m): 2:22pm On Nov 24, 2021 |
Nothingserious: Where did it say the Messiah is a demi God coming to die for sins..... I will wait. No long story just give me quotes...I will check them. |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by sonmvayina(m): 2:24pm On Nov 24, 2021 |
FreeIgboho: Why someone and not something ?? |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by FreeIgboho: 3:02pm On Nov 24, 2021 |
KnownUnknown: Yes, but it was only in passing, I made it clear I was only using small part of it as analogy. Yet you keep harping on it like it’s central to the discussion! |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by MaxInDHouse(m): 3:03pm On Nov 24, 2021 |
Nothingserious:We find ourselves here and today all of us can see that 99.99999% of the problems we have on this planet is caused by our fellow humans. The only problem we can't figure out is oldage and death. The Bible made it clear that Adam and Eve brought about oldage and death. So if we are innocent of what we are suffering then there must be a way out of this, that's why we need a perfect human soul to redeem us from the cause of oldage and death. God's word made it clear that the Messiah will serve as the sacrificial lamb and will wash away all our sins. But he has been poisoned against anything having to do with Jesus. The first time i met him on this forum once he mentioned that he's been discussing with a Jew i pity him because those people are ready to agree with anything so far it's against Jesus. Can you imagine that this same sonmvayina believes in reincarnation and Babylonian methodology? Yet he wants to argue about idolatry! Did the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob see anything good in the nonsense and ingredients that any nation worshiping demons believe? The last time i tormented him with the truth of God's word the confused idiot began cursing me, saying God will punish me for not accepting his delusion. So i reminded him that according to reincarnation (which he believes) whether people die by gun, drowning, slaughter or sleep they're all going to reincarnate again, so what punishment is he talking about? He was totally confused because he just wish people take him serious whereas he doesn't have the knowledge to convince anyone! |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by LordReed(m): 3:17pm On Nov 24, 2021 |
FreeIgboho: It is not a SMALL part of YOUR discussion, it is central to your discussion which is why you always bring it up. And as I have asked you before what type of supernatural abilities are you able to display ala Neo? You have never said. You even said you are unable to distinguish between dream and real life, one quality of dreams is defiance of natural physical laws, so which have those have you been able to exhibit? |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by FreeIgboho: 3:20pm On Nov 24, 2021 |
sonmvayina: It doesn’t matter. Because one thing is highly like - it will be an entity totally not what we imagined or even capable and imagining! 1 Like |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by FreeIgboho: 3:24pm On Nov 24, 2021 |
LordReed: I made it clear I ONLY used it to show that, just as Neo thought everything was real when they were not, sane could be our case. That’s ALL! |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by FreeIgboho: 3:26pm On Nov 24, 2021 |
Lordreed KnownUnknown sonmvayina I hope we are all now all agreed that cogito is fallacious 1 Like |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by KnownUnknown: 4:08pm On Nov 24, 2021 |
FreeIgboho: Whatever floats your boat sweetheart. |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by KnownUnknown: 4:14pm On Nov 24, 2021 |
FreeIgboho: We could be playing out a script written by Plasma Beings residing inside the sun who use us as a form of hybrid entertainment. Earth is a prison colony created to pacify or punish brains in a vat located in the fourth dimension. Same could be our case, That’s ALL! |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by sonmvayina(m): 4:14pm On Nov 24, 2021 |
FreeIgboho: We are all suffering from collective amnesia.. |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by LordReed(m): 4:44pm On Nov 24, 2021 |
FreeIgboho: LoL how is thinking fallacious? |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by LordReed(m): 4:49pm On Nov 24, 2021 |
FreeIgboho: And we made it clear that movies are not real life. Matrix is not what is happening in real life, stop being so enamoured of an analogy you loose your grasp of real life. |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by TenQ: 4:59pm On Nov 24, 2021 |
LordReed:Google is your friend! LordReed:Please feel very free to quote me! TenQ:Even when one is casting out demons from a person, you don't have any control over what will happen or how it will happen. No one does! Scientific rules are not applicable to spiritual things: get that truth in your head! |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by FreeIgboho: 5:00pm On Nov 24, 2021 |
KnownUnknown: Now u r getting. No possibility can be definitively ruled out - except that nothing exists. |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by FreeIgboho: 5:01pm On Nov 24, 2021 |
LordReed: Cogito is short for cogito ergo sum, smart ass |
Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by FreeIgboho: 5:03pm On Nov 24, 2021 |
LordReed: The problem lies in definition of terms. I don’t think you quite get what is meant by analogy. See below
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Re: How Do Spirits Exist? by KnownUnknown: 5:09pm On Nov 24, 2021 |
FreeIgboho: I know the difference between sci-fi speculation and real life. You seem incapable of that. That’s what I get. |
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