Well, what then is the meaning of this text:

I Cor. 14:2 - "For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries."

# he speaks not to men, but to God

# no man understands him

# in spirit he speaks mysteries.

syrup:

Well, what then is the meaning of this text:

I Cor. 14:2 - "For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries."

# he speaks not to men, but to God

# no man understands him

# in spirit he speaks mysteries.

abeg ask them oh, i bet they're as myopic as the guy behind "da vinci code"[

i only became a member to say,  that the worlds idea of tongues is very wrong,  its not "ablahhh blah fala blah blah"  its not repeated words, its known languages,  its beautiful and intricate,  its much more than repeated words that rhyme with each other,   its an actuall language,  it is your spirit talking to God.  but without an interpreter, you yourself do not understand it, (check 1 cor. 12-14,  )  your not suppose to speak it without an interpreter, because it is edifing the speaker not the church,   i have attended a penecostal (however u spell it) and it is funny,  in a horrid way,  one person starts doing the "ablah lablah" words and then they all do,  there is no interpreter, and basically i have concluded, since all of their words sounded very close to the same with each other that it is a learned tradition,  not real tongues.  i have heard real authentic tongues,  its scary,  its real,  it cant be repeated, its so complex,  never the same,  there was no interpreter,  but im trying to find one,  those who claim to speak in tongues i wish they could hear the real tongues, then compare,  i dare it to come close,  it wont,  if it does,  it does,  but it is not given to everyone, not even close,  its given to very very few,  and those who do it to edify themselves,  stop,  and stop lying to yourself,  get your emotions in line,  is it real? or is it just a learned tradition,  i dont mean to offend anyone,  its just the truth,  once again,  check 1 cor. 12-14,  there u will find the backing for all of this

@ bowe

welcome on board and good thing u started on this thread but to tell you something the tongues that needs to be interpreted isn't the regular tongues rather it's the tongues that has to do with prophesying that should be interpreted, when you hear bunch of pentecostals speaking in tongues it is them talking to God and not for anyone to understand what they are saying but when u go to a pentecostal church and u hear one person alone speaking aloud in tongues and the others keeping quiet, that is the kind of tongue that paul said if there's no one to interpret be quiet and watch this, everytime it is genuine there is always an interpreter or the speaker gets the interpretation of it. at least in my church the spirit of discernment operates and once someone is prophesying in tongues and another starts to speak that person is hushed by a soft pat on the shoulder. so it's not that they are imitating or learning to speak, it takes you to experience it to know what it's all about.

Michael Trofimov pleaded not guilty by reason of insanity in the murder of his father. Trofimov, who had recently joined a religious group, was found was his hands around his father's neck "speaking in tongues and screaming for God." His uncle said, "He was a good young man and then he started going to these [religious] meetings."

Interesting use of tongues 

A young Pentecostal girl dared her girlfriend in church to shout out some nonsense syllables just to see if someone would stand up and "interpret the tongue." So the girl shouted, "coca-cola, coca-cola, coca-cola" and a church member promptly stood up and "interpreted the tongue" as a message from God.

Coca Cola also makes your burp!

Could burping be a secret language

wHATEVER!

Lioness --- no more tongues from you? Or have you cut some off?

ra sha kima tu ratos kumanikina yeara tosaasa
pre re kinti nututut rastablastarefastu ramankis ka ratat maknatstg ye sa
mashalilatalanakimahunuaytany




Once again, I believe in Tongues people

lol lioness

tampax bistogravy mazdadpickup ha ha licktleeoo McDonalds lalala tr la la
lolipop kudasa oh my giddy aunt la la la snickety lemon pie blurg blurg ole biscuit barrel!
I shotthesherif buti swear itwas in selfdefence ohyeah snotty bottom


I also beleive it tongues 


So does my little cute friend 

[img]http://www.citycat.ru/cats/i236/my_tongue.jpg[/img]

I just don't think tongues believes in you Rev. 


But thats a cute kitten.
Adorable, lovely, blue eyed kitten

@ Reverend

I must say I have become quite accustomed to your sense of humour. Keep it up, u'll lighten the darkest days for anyone. Keep it up.

Speaking in tongues can be done privately and publicly. Privately , when praying-the Bible says you are edifying yourself and speaking mysteries to God. Publicly, during church congregational worship-but, it should also be followed with an interpretation. The Bible states that if you speak in tongues without interpreting the tongues then its tantamounts to prophesy.

Speaking in tongues during a public child dedication ceremony sends a wrong message to those who do not get an interpretation of what is being said, to the unbeliever and to the unbelieving  believer. Methinks, that the Pastor who did the tongue-speaking during the ceremony did not properly identify if he doing it publicy (in a church setting) or privately (in personal prayer mode).

The dividing line gets thinner when 90% of the attendee's of the child dedication ceremony are church members ,in that case the Pastor may want to enter into the public tongue mode-but it must be accompanied with an interpretation-its not just a Christian feel good factor that excludes unbelievers-it must make sense publicly, albeit one is speaking mysteries to God.

erhm! are you a pastor?

    erhm! are you a pastor?      

Ikamefa,

Is there anything wrong with being a Pastor? Just like Eddy Murphy's alter ego said in "Coming to America", "If loving the Lord is wrong I dont wont to be right".

aint nuffin wrong in being a pastor , in most cases speaking in tongues in a public xtian setting is not usually followed by
interpretations, lets just say i agree with yah!

aint nuffin wrong in being a pastor , in most cases speaking in tongues in a public xtian setting is not usually followed by
interpretations, lets just say i agree with yah

When I grew up in Word based Christian fellowships if someone speaks in tongues in church another will interprete it, or the same person would interprete it. Interpretation of tongues is one of the spiritual gifts in the Bible but it seems this art has been long lost in the church because folks are not taught the truth of the Word.


BTW,on a lighter note I thought most Babes do list "God-fearing" amongst the qualities they look for in their Husbands, a Pastor with a good secular job is still a hotcake.

LondonCool:



When I grew up in Word based Christian fellowships if someone speaks in tongues in church another will interprete it, or the same person would interprete it. Interpretation of tongues is one of the spiritual gifts in the Bible but it seems this art has been long lost in the church because folks are not taught the truth of the Word.


BTW,on a lighter note I thought most Babes do list "God-fearing" amongst the qualities they look for in their Husbands, a Pastor with a good secular job is still a hotcake.

you are right once again
Some Gals would give their all to marry a Pastor ! Even a Brova who is a likkle bit spiritual ( has a sense of God ) would do. while on the other hand some Gals preffer the rough necks, i mean the bad boys the " badder " _{forgive me lord of english)} the better


different strokes for different folks i guess

I'd pick a spiritual-funckified broda any day.
Aint nothing real with 'em bad niggers yeah

I'd pick a spiritual-funckified brother any day.
Aint nothing real with 'em bad niggers yeah

Could you kindly define what a "spiritual funckified brother" is please ?

@All Who Speak In Tongues,

The real test about speaking in tongues is when a person is speaking in tongues there should be SEVERAL INDEPENDENT INTERPRETATIONS.If the individuals come to the same conclusion it means that the message is correct but if they all come up with different results that means there is no such thing as speaking in tongues

Spiritual funckified brother?
He places God 1st in all things
He is sincerely born again
He happily lives live and enjoys every moment but remembers his limits
He loves good things of life

He respects his dreams/goals but never forgets who he is in Christ Jesus.

LondonCool:

Could you kindly define what a "spiritual funckified brother" is please ?

Speaking in tongues is an evidence of Holy Spirit baptism & characterised by a discernible language (tongue) unknown 2 the speaker but recognised/interpreted by others-acts 2:1-8
The gibberish being uttered by many pple gleefully is not biblical

The essence of Holy Spirit baptism is to embolden and empower a xtian 2 work effectively in God's vineyard & not 2 speak in 'tongues' whenever it catches their fancy.
As stated in an earlier post, this activity only edifies the speaker.

Feelgood,

feelgood:

Speaking in tongues is an evidence of Holy Spirit baptism & characterised by a discernible language (tongue) unknown 2 the speaker but recognised/interpreted by others-acts 2:1-8
The gibberish being uttered by many people gleefully is not biblical

Goodman,you hit the nail on the head or is it head on the nail.na your papa born you.

we i see people especially proffessing Christians argue about speaking in tongues in public or private, i really get amazed, no body argues about speaking French, Yoruba, Ibo etc in public, no one sees anything wrong with it, whether interpreted or not. But the one language which is God's every1 wants to stop, brethren this argument is inspired by devils, i understand there are those that want to learn but when u put it down, something is wrong.

the truth is anyone who denial speaking in tongues, his Christianity is questionable, i wonder at such same way I'll wonder at a Yoruba man who doesn't speak, argues about speaking his language in public.

We are from Zion, we have a language, it is tongues, we communicate with God in It, we can also communicate with ourselfs.

Stop this tongues argument, only believe andgrow in the life and ability God has given us.

@pblessed
Tongues is not a language - rather it is another ( old english) word for language. Acts 2: 1-8 is a clear example that it is discernible/interpreted by one or more of the hearers but not 2 the speaker.
Actually satan uses this 2 deceive many

I really don't know what speaking in togues is all about but i believe now adays some people just do it for the sake of seeming spiritual. I have no problems with people yelling and speaking in togues maybe one of these days i will come to understand the concept but till then i will like to beg them to reduce their yelling a tad bit so i can hear my own thoughts when i am communicating with my God

Speaking in tongues is a gift of God's Holy Spirit. The question is, does what people demonstrate in certain churches to day, the real gift of which the bible speaks?

This is my personal take on the issue. The gift has been grossly mis-understood. Its so mis-understood to the point that it is believed that if one doesn't speak in tongues its becasue they lack the evidence of the Holy Spirit. This is dangerous theology. In fact it is wrong theology. Let me explain.

1. Paul in his time has downplayed the gift, but most churches are doing the opposite today. Read 1 Cor. 14

2. Paul made it clear based on rhetorical questions in 1 Cor. 12 that not all have the same gifts. Those churches that expect all members to exercise the gift are going against biblical teachings.

3. The nature of tongues as practised by some churches today, is different from that which was used back in the early church. Acts 2 recorded how and why the gift was utilised. The word "tongue" meant language. Such languages were intelligently spoken. That is why those Jews who came from 16 different nations, who had come to Jerusalem to celebrate the feast of the passover, as well as pentecost, were able to hear in the language in which they were born. The tongues spoken by the apostles were identifiable.

4. The gift of tongues does not serve the purpose of showing that one has recieved the Spirit of God,any more than say the gift of prophecy. In fact Paul made it clear that the gift of prophecy was more important than that of the gift of tongues, as far as edifying the church is concerned. See 1 Cor. 14 Back in Paul's time having a gift didn't indicate one's level of righteousness, unless it was buffered with love. Back then Paul stressed that a gift without love was meaningless. It meant nothing. Paul went on to say that the churches of God were not to encourage confusion. If a person were to utter something he or she deemed important in a foreign tongue, he or she needs an interpretor, and such a conversation should be done in courses.

In summary modern-day tongue speaking isn't biblical. If you ask me its just another of Satan's attempt to distract people from the real issues of truth. I am not here to judge anyone's relation with Christ, but If something isn't biblical I cannot support it.

@ Syrup

Well, what then is the meaning of this text:

I Cor. 14:2 - "For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries."

# he speaks not to men, but to God

# no man understands him

# in spirit he speaks mysteries.

First and formost the word "unknown" is a supplied word, meaning, it wasn't apart of the original Greek. So now that we are left with the word tongue, we can now see a new meaning to what Paul is talking about.

In other words if a person in the time of Paul spoke in a tongue that was foreign, it would become a mystery to those who didn't speak the language. It wasn't to God because He knew all languages. So in essence such a person was speaking to God for His own benefit, and not for the benefit of the congregation.

Thats why Paul said before that such a person only edified himself, and not the church. Its only as such a tongue is interpreted that the entire congregation can be built up, or edified.

The general notion is that when one speaks in tongues it puts that person in a special relationship with God, in that , that person somehow is communcating in such a way that is not intended to be understood, by the one speaking, or by His own brethren.

I usually ask such persons if they themselves understand what they speak, and invariably they say, no. But if you read 1 Cor. 14 Paul says the opposite. Listen to what Paul says:

1 Pursue love, and desire spiritual gifts, but especially that you may prophesy. 2 For he who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men but to God, for no one understands him; however, in the spirit he speaks mysteries. 3 But he who prophesies speaks edification and exhortation and comfort to men.

Listen to Paul again:

Therefore tongues are for a sign, not to those who believe but to unbelievers; but prophesying is not for unbelievers but for those who believe. 23 Therefore if the whole church comes together in one place, and all speak with tongues, and there come in those who are uninformed or unbelievers, will they not say that you are out of your mind? 24 But if all prophesy, and an unbeliever or an uninformed person comes in, he is convinced by all, he is convicted by all. 25 And thusthe secrets of his heart are revealed; and so, falling down on his face, he will worship God and report that God is truly among you.

Cannot get it any plainer than that can you?

Tongues as a gift no doubt has its place and purpose, but only when there is a need for it. When there is a room full of people all speaking the same language then there is no need for tongues as a gift. If there was a language barrier as was the case of the early church, then the need for the gift would be paramount. When Jesus commissioned His disciples to go into all the world as a witness He had to supply the gift right away. There was no time for them to learn it.

Anyone who became a christian then automatically recieved the gift. In conclusion the gift is only as relevant as when there is a need for it. There have been cases when SDA evangelists experienced what occured at Pentecost, where listeners who were from different countries and who spoke languages other than what was preached in found themselves hearing in their own languages, when there was a shortage of interpreters.

Let God be praised.

Bobbyaf:

First and formost the word "unknown" is a supplied word, meaning, it wasn't apart of the original Greek.

With good sense the KJV supplied the word "unknown" without detracting from the flow of the text; just as the word "gift" in I Cor. 14:1 was supplied without affecting the sense of the text.

The gift of tongues expounded by the apostle Paul goes beyond the mere language of men - that is why the line in your quote: "no one understands him; however, in the spirit he speaks mysteries." If it is merely human effort, then it is no more a phenomenon "in the spirit" nor legitimately a "mystery" - for the fact that in the first place "no one understands him", neither does the speaker himself understand what he says in the Spirit.

The gift of "interpretation of tongues" is predicated upon the gift of tongues. It is not merely a question of "translation" (which men can easily accomplish as polyglots); rather, it is a charisma given by the Spirit of God to 'interpret' what is being spoken 'in the spirit'. The sheer mention that "no one understands him" indicates the power of tongues in the Spirit.

In the whole Church at Corinth, folks were present who could understand one another's speech in their native languages and dialects - including, for example, Italian, Aramaic, Greek or Hebrew (see the background in Acts 18 - Jews and Greeks, some of which had come lately from Italy). There were more than one person who could speak, at least, one of these languages. But when a believer speaks in tongues 'in the spirit' and 'no one' understands him or her, the context becomes apparent that it is a phenomenon altogether distinct from what might otherwise have been attained by human wisdom, effort, intellect or genius.

There were already all types of languages in the world during the earthly ministry of the Lord Jesus Christ - and He knew that. But when He was commissioning the disciples in the power of the Holy Spirit, He noted that "they shall speak with new tongues" (Mark 16:17). The gift of 'tongues' and of the 'interpretation of tongues' are gifts given to the Church by the risen Lord - and they don't come as a discount, nor are they optional to other gifts.

We find the gist of the whole passage in two verses in I Corinthians 14 here

(a) "Follow after charity, and desire spiritual gifts [including the gift of tongues], but rather that ye may prophesy"; (vs. 1)

(b) "Wherefore, brethren, covet to prophesy, and forbid not to speak with tongues." (vs. 39)

Blessings.

Only if there is a need for it, that is the gift. My take is different in that I believe the gift should not be expressed in gibbrish as can be seen in most churches. That is not what the gift is all about. Its not about getting emotional and out of control. That didn't happen at Pentecost.

Paul says in 1 Cor. 14 that he would rather speak with 5 words that are intelligent than speak a 1000 words that lead to confusion, and that is exactly what is going on in these churches.

The gift of tongus is not a private gift, given to use as a special tool to reach God. Thats what some are taught, but that teaching is not biblical. Tongue means language. Paul says that language is intelligent and understandable. Some christians have put a different meaning to 1 Cor. 14:2

They use the word mystery as if its some special experience that only the speaker can encounter while speaking in tongues. Common sense dictates that we read the entire passage and see what exactly Paul is talking about. Verse 2 is not giving support to people using the gift of tongues to mean that it affords them the previlege to speak all sorts of gibbrish, and attribute that to some mystery prayer and specal communication with God. That is not what the bible is talking about.

Listen to what Paul says:

I wish you all spoke with tongues, but even more that you prophesied; for he who prophesies is greater than he who speaks with tongues, unless indeed he interprets, that the church may receive edification.

Notice the bold. The one who speaks in tongues needs to interpret once he speaks a foreign tongue. Thats not the case in the churches when a person gets up and speaks some un-intelligible language. Their claim is that they are speaking to God, but Paul is saying the opposite. He is saying shut up until you can interpret your language.

It is pointless having everyone speak in what is believed to be some spiritual language, when Paul is pushing the gift of prophesying. No one stands to benefit when even the visitor who knows not God walks into a service and is expected to speak in tongues. I have been to their churches and see how they operate. Imagine a visitor who doesn't know God is being expected to talk in tongues. Thats not the formula that Jesus taught.

He said "go into all the world and teach all nations, " When one is taught the rudiments of faith, then and only then can one be baptised. Neither Paul nor Jesus is pushing ignorance. Neither expect the churches to operate in confusion.

I once met a young lady who confessed to me that when she was a member of a particular church she was forced to speak in tongues. The leaders used all sorts of tactics to win her heart. They jerked her into tongues speaking, as they do most of the visitors who happen to come to the alter. She later told me that she faked it to avoid the pressure. This is a man-made invention of the gift, and has absolutely nothing to do with how the bible describes the gift.

I couldn't help but laugh. If they had God's Spirit how come they didn't detect the pretence?

I hate to say this, but all these charismatic churches are using works without realizing it. They teach that if one doesn't have the gift its a sign that one doesn't have the fulness of God's Holy Spirit. They see that expression as the evidence. But listen to what Luke had to say about the whole matter.

Acts 5:32
32 And we are His witnesses to these things, and so also is the Holy Spirit whom God has given to those who obey Him.”

Dr. Luke qualifies the manner in which God gives His Spirit to those who should get it. Total submission to God's requirements and teachings. Obedience to God's ways and will is what will bring the Spirit to us. That is why I marvel when I see people walk into a church service and are expected to fall head over heal with Jesus Christ just like that.

It isn't enough to just be able to speak in "tongues", while living a life of denial of God's basic truth.

I suggest one reads the entire passage of Cor. 14 to see the context of Paul's words.