Is there such thing as eternal security
What is eternal security
Can a christian sin
Can a christian lose salvation
Can a christian lose salvation by committing a sin.
How many times can a man be born again.

There has been misconceptions about the topic . I'm calling on our bible scholars to enlighten us. This is for purpose of knowledge . Pls no insult ,abuses or personal attacks. let the bible speak . Any other relevant material can be quoted . Agree or Disagree politely .

Pls remember :

2 Timothy 2:24-25
And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient, In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;

This is my new monicker formerly joagbaje cc image123, Olaadegbu, Gombs ,Goshen360, Frosbel, mrpresident1, debosky,scholar8200 , candour.I will add more names as I remember .

petra1:
Is there such thing as eternal security
What is eternal security
Can a christian sin
Can a christian lose salvation
Can a christian lose salvation by committing a sin.
How many times can a man be born again.

We are saved by faith. Now can a believer fall or depart from the faith?Are there any warnings to believers of this possibility? If yes, what are the consequences if that happens?

Your answer to this answers all the above.

Scholar8200:
We are saved by faith. Now can a believer fall or depart from the faith?Are there any warnings to believers of this possibility? If yes, what are the consequences if that happens?

Your answer to this answers all the above.

Thanks for your response . Well the purpose of the thread was firstly to identify the different concept of the doctrine of eternal security then also other topics mentioned . I have always believed that eternal security doctrine was based on the idea that a christian can never sin. So by that ,whatever he does wrong would not count . Man is a spirit and whatever the body does would not constitute a sin. And the scripture used most times is

1 John 3:9
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

I don't agree with this doctrine and interpretation . But in my recent discussion with image123 he gave me a different understanding of eternal security it has branches . And he believed that I'm also a teacher of eternal security. Which I don't agree with . So what is really the definition of eternal security . And I want us to look at the concept of sin on this thread also. Thank you.

I want to read and learn... my heart pricks me everynow and then about my salvation

petra1:


Thanks for your response . Well the purpose of the thread was firstly to identify the different concept of the doctrine of eternal security then also other topics mentioned . I have always believed that eternal security doctrine was based on the idea that a christian can never sin. So by that ,whatever he does wrong would not count . Man is a spirit and whatever the body does would not constitute a sin. And the scripture used most times is

1 John 3:9
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

I don't agree with this doctrine and interpretation . But in my recent discussion with image123 he gave me a different understanding of eternal security it has branches . And he believed that I'm also a teacher of eternal security. Which I don't agree with . So what is really the definition of eternal security . And I want us to look at the concept of sin on this thread also. Thank you.

Let's consider:

My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
1 John 2:1

1. It says we are to sin not- that is the norm, a state of true soul health
2. It says IF not WHEN any man sins. Meaning it might come as a surprise, not a normal aspect of the new life.
3. It says we have an Advocate with the Father. Meaning If sin comes in, we will once again need the mediation of our Advocate, not a flippant claim of, "God sees me through Jesus hence it does not matter". The imagery here is what was painted in the OT when a trespasser came to the High Priest with a sacrifice. However, now, He is the Advocate, He is the sacrifice, we come by faith and repentance.
4. Does this mean we are free to continue in the sin-and-repent vicious circle?

6 [b]No one who abides in Him [who lives and remains in communion with and in obedience to Him—deliberately, knowingly, and habitually commits (practices) sin. No one who [habitually] sins has either seen or known Him [recognized, perceived, or understood Him, or has had an experiential acquaintance with Him
1 John 3:6[/b]AMP

petra1:
Is there such thing as eternal security
What is eternal security
Can a christian sin
Can a christian lose salvation
Can a christian lose salvation by committing a sin.
How many times can a man be born again.

There has been misconceptions about the topic . I'm calling on our bible scholars to enlighten us. This is for purpose of knowledge . Pls no insult ,abuses or personal attacks. let the bible speak . Any other relevant material can be quoted . Agree or Disagree politely .


Remember :

2 Timothy 2:24-25
And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient, In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;


I will add more names as I remember .

This is my new monicker formerly joagbaje cc image123, Olaadegbu, Gombs ,Goshen360, Frosbel, mrpresident1, debosky,scholar8200

I'm gonna learn much here. Candour, please come.

where is that my jotter self... Scholar8600 is tempting me to click the follow button.

sonofthunder:
where is that my jotter self... Scholar8600 is tempting me to click the follow button.

Yield to the temptation

petra1:

This is my new monicker formerly joagbaje cc image123, candiru .I will add more names as I remember .

Okay, but give me some time though. Who is candiru? Is Candour still on this forum, as Candour?

Gombs:


I'm gonna learn much here. Candour, please come.

Na una dey teach o. I'm all ears

Image123:


Okay, but give me some time though. Who is candiru? Is Candour still on this forum, as Candour?

I still dey but i got tired of religious and doctrinal arguments.

I still come here though, read anything of interest, SMH at some nonsense and leave

Candour:


I still dey but i got tired of religious and doctrinal arguments.

I still come here though, read anything of interest, SMH at some nonsense and leave

Hehehehehehehhehehehehehe, lol. No wahala. i see you're more on properties section now. Come an sow one duplex into my life. God bless you.

Image123:



Hehehehehehehhehehehehehe, lol. No wahala. i see you're more on properties section now. Come an sow one duplex into my life. God bless you.

Haba image123, eyi o ma da o

After all the seeds you have chopped already?

Candour:


Haba image123, eyi o ma da o

After all the seeds you have chopped already?

Seedtime and harvest have not ceased bro, you have no excuse.
come no let us divert oga Jo thread oh, i no fit come dey beg oh.

Image123:


Seedtime and harvest have not ceased bro, you have no excuse.
come no let us divert oga Jo thread oh, i no fit come dey beg oh.

No wahala. Make i dey harvest dey go while Jo and him crew dey teach us

petra1:
Is there such thing as eternal security
What is eternal security
Can a christian sin
Can a christian lose salvation
Can a christian lose salvation by committing a sin.
How many times can a man be born again.

There has been misconceptions about the topic . I'm calling on our bible scholars to enlighten us. This is for purpose of knowledge . Pls no insult ,abuses or personal attacks. let the bible speak . Any other relevant material can be quoted . Agree or Disagree politely .

Pls remember :

2 Timothy 2:24-25
And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient, In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;

This is my new monicker formerly joagbaje cc image123, Olaadegbu, Gombs ,Goshen360, Frosbel, mrpresident1, debosky,scholar8200 , candiru .I will add more names as I remember .

It has been a long time I stop commenting on NL and spreading this good news of the gospel of the GRACE OF CHRIST, because of many startup project I am into this days.

But, I will donate an ample time to contribute my possible best on this thread.

Eternal security is what people usually call "once saved always saved". IT TAKES A HUMBLE HEART to understand the truth of this gospel when PREACHED IN A BIBLICAL WAY. Most people who fight against this gospel are people who are filled with PRIDE OF SELF RIGHTEOUSNESS.

Each time people who are ignorant of this gospel hear this gospel, they term it "licence to sin", or they would make it look as if the preacher is saying that we should now start to sin because of grace, but that's absolutely not true.

NO GOOD GRACE PREACHER WILL EVER USED GRACE TO PROMOTE SIN RATHER TO TAKE OUR CONDEMNATION.


WHAT IS ETERNAL SECURITY?

To understand this beyond all doubt, YOU MUST UNDERSTAND THE MESSAGE OF THE CROSS. That is the BASIS and the FOUNDATION OF THE GOSPEL OF GRACE.

MESSAGE OF THE CROSS IS SUMMARISED IN ONE WORD- GRACE

A times, preachers who are perverting the grace of God, always define grace as a empowerment for right living. And they would go further to ignorantly tell people that "saved by grace" means being empowered to live a sinless perfect life, of which EVERY LIVING SOUL in this world can honestly bear me witness that NO ONE IS SINLESS PERFECT, even paul and the dead saints. That's so epic!

1john 1:8;"If we say we have no sin, we DECIEVE ourselves, and the truth is not in us"


Grace is NOT an empowerment for right living, rather ONE OF THE virtues it PRODUCES is empowerment for right living. How does it produce empowerment for right living? When you hear the real gospel of grace, it makes you to CLEARLY see the love of God for you, and by that love you would like to live a life that would honour him, and that DOESN'T MEAN THAT YOU ARE AUTOMATICALLY SINLESS PERFECT but it increases your love for God.

What is grace?

1. Grace is LITERALLY an unmerited and undeserved favour of God that has been OFFERED FREELY AS A GIFT.

Grace is not a cheap gift as many anti-grace preachers would say, it is a FREE GIFT WE RECEIVE THROUGH SIMPLE FAITH(believing). IT IS NEVER MERITED OR EARNED by right living but RECEIVED THROGH FAITH.

Rom 5:15;"But not as the offence, so also is the FREE GIFT. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more THE GRACE OF GOD, AND THE (free)GIFT BY GRACE which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many."


2. Grace is Jesus PERSONIFIED!

John 1:14,16,17;"14) And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) FULL OF GRACE and truth.
16) And of his fulness have all we received, and GRACE FOR GRACE.
17) For the law was given by Moses, but GRACE AND TRUTH CAME BY JESUS CHRIST."


3. Grace is the finished work of christ REVEALED!

Icor 15:1-4;"1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the GOSPEL which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
3 For I delivered unto you FIRST OF ALL that which I also received, how that Christ DIED FOR OUR SINS according to the scriptures;
4 And that he was BURIED, and that he ROSE AGAIN the third day according to the scriptures:"

What gospel was paul talking about? For the sake of the biblical evidences you asked for in the op, the bible MUST be left to speak.

Acts 20:24;"But none of these things moved me, neither count I my life dear unto myself, so that I might finish my course with joy, and the ministry, which I have received of the lord jesus, to testify the GOSPEL OF THE GRACE OF GOD."


4. Grace is not a licence to sin but a LICENCE to live above condemnation even without the deed of the law.

Rom 3:28;"Therefore, we conclude that a man is justified by faith WITHOUT THE DEED OF THE LAW."

Rom 4:5;"But to him that WORKETH NOT, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, HIS FAITH is counted for righteousness."

Can a christian sin? Yes!


1john 1:7-10;"7. But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus his Son CLEANSES(note: continuous) us from all sin.
8. If we say we have no sin, we DECEIVE ourselves,
and the truth is not in us.
9. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
10 If we say we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us."

1john2:1-2;"1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And IF ANY MAN SIN, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
2 And he is the PROPITIATION(atoning sacrifice) for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world."

Please, bear in mind that the sins of the whole world(past, present and future), including yours, were atoned ONCE at the death of christ at the cross. Jesus will not take the punishment of any sin you may commit, HE HAS TAKEN THEM ALL ONCE. And because he took ALL of it, your salvation in him is secured if you can believe. Why is it secured? To sin more? No! But to be FREE FROM SIN-CONCIOUSNESS AND CONDEMNATION.

Col 2:13;13 "And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, HAVING FORGIVEN YOU ALL TRESSPASSES"

How were we dead in our sins? By works of right living? No! But by the faith we have in the DEATH Jesus took on OUR BEHALF.


1john 2:12;"12 I write unto you, little children, because your sins are forgiven you for his name's sake."
Why are our sins forgiven? Because of his name's sake, in other words, because Jesus has taken the punishment that we deserve on our behalf at the cross.

1john 5:16:"16 If any man see his BROTHER SIN a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it."


THE FACT THAT CHRISTIANS CAN NEVER COMMIT SIN IS A HERESY, LIE AND PRIDE BORNE OUT OF SELF RIGHTEOUSNESS. I know that there are verses of john that look contradictory, but will be talked about on a different answer.


Can a christian ENJOY sinning? No! If he does he is seriously ignorant of christian growth and the salvation he has received and that would make him loose his reward but not eternal life.

2cor5:19;"To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, NOT IMPUTING THEIR TRESSPASSES UNTO THEM; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation."


CAN A CHRISTIAN LOOSE HIS SALVATION? YES and NO.

YES, only if he starts to rely on works of righteousness which comes through obedience to law or if he REJECTS the grace as a source of righteousness and start to look for it by works of righteousness.

Gal 5:4;"Christ is BECOME OF NO EFFECT unto you, whosoever of you are JUSTIFIED(seeking righteousness) by the law; YE ARE FALLEN FROM GRACE"


Romans 9:30-33;"30 What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which FOLLOWED NOT after righteousness, HAVE ATTAINED to righteousness, even the RIGHTEOUSNESS WHICH IS OF FAITH(not works of right living).
31 But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, HATH NOT ATTAINED to the law of righteousness.
32 WHEREFORE? Because they sought it NOT BY FAITH, but as it were by the works of the law. FOR THEY STUMBLE at that stumblingstone;
33 As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a stumblingstone and rock of offence: and whosoever BELIEVETH(faith) on him shall not be ashamed."



NO, he will not loose it, if he is trusting and relying on jesus who has been declared the PERFECT righteousness of God.

1cor 3:12-15;"12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;
13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
14 If any man's work abidewhich he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: BUT HE HIMSELF SHALL BE SAVED; yet so as by fire"

NOTE: the man who will suffer loss is the person whose works were bad and as such got burnt. The person will suffer loss of his reward but HE HIMSELF SHALL BE SAVED. Why? Because eternal life is a gift we receive by faith.

Eph 2:8-9;"8 For by grace are ye saved THROUGH FAITH(believing); and that not of yourselves: IT IS THE GIFT OF GOD:
9 NOT OF WORKS(right living), lest any man should boast."

Romans 6:23;"23 For the wages of sin is death; BUT THE GIFT OF GOD IS ETERNAL LIFE through Jesus Christ our Lord."

Our wages has been paid by jesus' death which took place on our behalf, therefore offering us the free gift of God which is eternal life even without the deed of the law, romans 3:28.

Romans 4:25;"WHO WAS DELIVERED FOR OUR OFFENCES, and was raised again for our justification."


HOW MANY TIMES CAN A MAN BE BORN AGAIN?

Biblically, it is meant for ONCE by simple FAITH ON WHAT Jesus HAS DONE ON OUR BEHALF.


I expect more questions please, to know how I can help out. Stay in grace!

Candour:


Na una dey teach o. I'm all ears

Longtime bro
How's the Family doing

Image123:


Okay, but give me some time though. Who is candiru? Is Candour still on this forum, as Candour?

Hmmmm,na wahoo
So u still dey area?(NL)?
How's life n ur family,hail them for me

@OP
Who actually gives these Eternal Security?

petra1:


Thanks for your response . Well the purpose of the thread was firstly to identify the different concept of the doctrine of eternal security then also other topics mentioned . I have always believed that eternal security doctrine was based on the idea that a christian can never sin. So by that ,whatever he does wrong would not count . Man is a spirit and whatever the body does would not constitute a sin. And the scripture used most times is

1 John 3:9
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

I don't agree with this doctrine and interpretation . But in my recent discussion with image123 he gave me a different understanding of eternal security it has branches . And he believed that I'm also a teacher of eternal security. Which I don't agree with . So what is really the definition of eternal security . And I want us to look at the concept of sin on this thread also. Thank you.

Please, while quoting scriptures, it is so important to note that it doesn't contradict the bible for a CONCISED understanding of God's word.

1john 3:9 does not mean that Christians are sinless perfect and that they can never commit sin.

PLEASE, THE BELOW IS A GOOD COPY AND PASTE. I FIND IT MORE HELPFUL THAN WRITING ANOTHER LONG ANSWER.

We dip into the Ask Pastor John podcast inbox.
“Pastor John, my name is Jake from Mexico. What
does 1 John 5:18 mean?” End of question. And I’ll go ahead and read the text from the ESV: “We know
that everyone who has been born of God does not
keep on sinning, but he who was born of God
protects him, and the evil one does not touch him.”
Pastor John what does this mean?

I am not sure what part of this verse Jake is
stumbling over. There are three he could stumble
over.

1. One could be: “Those born of God do not keep on
sinning.” What does that mean?
2. A second would be: “He who is born of God
protects them.” What does that mean?
3. A third would be: “The evil one does not touch
him.” Whoa. Really? What does that mean?

So I am not sure which of those three he is
stumbling over, so maybe I better say a word about
each one.

And what I am thinking is maybe Jake is reading the
King James Authorized Version or the New American
Standard Version of that first clause, because it is
even more perplexing. It says: “We know that
whosoever is born of God sinneth not.” That is the
King James. Or the New American Standard says:
“We know that no one who is born of God sins.” So I
would join Jake, if I read those, and say, “Huh.
Really? Christians don’t sin?”


That sounds truly problematical: Christians never
sin. I met a woman one time who did believe that.
She threw 1 John 5:18 and 1 John 3:9 at me. And I
asked, “Well, what do you call the bad things you
do?”


And she had invented a lot of names for her sins,
like: mistakes and flaws and shortcomings and
imperfections, but she was adamant. I don’t sin.
Now the ESV is right to translate “we know that
everyone who has been born of God” — and then it
translates — “does not keep on sinning,” which
helps a little bit, maybe. First John 3:9 has the same
issue: “No one born of God makes a practice of
sinning for God’s seed abides in him and he cannot
keep on sinning because he has been born of God.”
Now I could pull rank with Greek here — which I will
— and then I will back up and say that is not the key issue.


The idea of the Greek present tense
[ἁμαρτάνει / ἁμαρτάνειν] which is being used is that those who are born again, and have the Spirit of God in them, cannot ever make peace with sin, settle in with sin, make sin a friend, be okay with sinning, just go on sinning as though no war needs to be made against it, and nothing will come of it if we do.


The present tense says: No, you can’t do that, you
can’t make a practice of sinning like that.
But if you don’t know Greek, you don’t have to trust
me at this point, because there are a couple of other
reasons why non-Greek readers know that this text
does not mean that Christians don’t ever do anything wrong.


First John 5:16, two verses earlier: “If anyone sees
his brother” — a Christian — “committing a sin not
leading to death, he shall ask, and God will give him
life.” So he can’t mean that Christians don’t sin,
because he just gave instruction for how to help
Christians who do sin.


The same thing is true in 1 John 1:8–10. “If we say
we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth
is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and
just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all
unrighteousness. If we say we have not sinned, we
make him a liar, and his word is not in us.”


So in the meaning of 1 John 5:18, I think here in the
context, the first and obvious meaning would be:
The one who is born of God does not sin unto death;
that is, we don’t make peace with sin, settle into a
pattern of sinning that will destroy us in the end,
prove that we are not truly born of God and are not
truly Christians. Christians walk in the light and,
according to 1 John 1:8–10, WALKING IN THE LIGHT IS NOT SINLESSNESS. It is walking in a way that you have eyes to see in the light the ugliness of what you just did and you are sorry for it. You confess it. You keep short accounts with God and you move on.


So I think “does not sin” means (1) doesn’t commit the sin unto death and (2) doesn’t settle into a pattern of sinning that proves you have no spiritual life in you.

Second issue: “He who is born of God protects him.”
I think that means that Christ — who is called the
one born of God, the only begotten of God, the
eternally virgin born Spirit, but born by the Spirit
Son of God, Christ — guards us from the devil. He
intercedes for us and he is with us to the end of the
age helping us. And his blood covers us and keeps
us safe from Satan’s accusations because none of
them can hold, because Christ has died for us, thereby taking our punishment.


Third issue: “The evil one does not touch him.” The
devil’s accusations and temptations and harassments can hurt us terribly, but they can never destroy us. There is no deadly touch. There is no poisonous bite. His fangs were removed at the cross, and his lethal poison is taken away from believers. He cannot destroy us.


So I take “cannot touch us” to mean can’t touch us
with any deadly touch. He can hurt us terribly. I don’t want to minimize Satan’s realty in this world.
He can throw us in prison and he can move others to kill us, according to Revelation 2:10, but he can’t
hurt us ultimately. He can’t touch us with the touch
of destruction and eternal damnation in hell. That has been taken out of his hand by the blood of Jesus. Jesus did that when he died on the cross according to Colossians 2:15. He disarmed the principalities and powers when he died and shed his blood. So the only begotten of God is, indeed, our perfect and everlasting protector.


I hope it helps, stay in grace!

ichuka:

Longtime bro
How's the Family doing

We're all doing very well. Thanks

I trust yours are fine too?

Scholar8200:
We are saved by faith. Now can a believer fall or depart from the faith?Are there any warnings to believers of this possibility? If yes, what are the consequences if that happens?

Your answer to this answers all the above.

Yea, you are correct 100% that we are saved by simply believing the gospel(faith).

Yea, a believer can fall from faith(belief in the finished work of christ), The question becomes how?
First of all, a believer DOES NOT FALL from faith(grace) because he did something wrong. NEVER! We are dealing with biblical evidences.

YES, only if he starts to rely on works of
righteousness which comes through obedience to
law or if he REJECTS the grace as a source of
righteousness and start to look for it by works of
righteousness.


Gal 5:4;"Christ is BECOME OF NO EFFECT unto you,
whosoever of you are JUSTIFIED(seeking
righteousness) by the law; YE ARE FALLEN FROM
GRACE"


Romans 9:30-33;"30 What shall we say then? That
the Gentiles, which FOLLOWED NOT after
righteousness, HAVE ATTAINED to righteousness,
even the RIGHTEOUSNESS WHICH IS OF FAITH(not
works of right living).
31 But Israel, which followed after the law of
righteousness, HATH NOT ATTAINED to the law of
righteousness.
32 WHEREFORE? Because they sought it NOT BY
FAITH, but as it were by the works of the law. FOR
THEY STUMBLE at that stumblingstone;
33 As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a
stumblingstone and rock of offence: and whosoever
BELIEVETH(faith) on him shall not be ashamed."

ichuka:
@OP Who actually gives these Eternal Security?

Jesus, through his finished work.

Scholar8200:
Let's consider:

My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
1 John 2:1

1. It says we are to sin not- that is the norm, a state of true soul health
2. It says IF not WHEN any man sins. Meaning it might come as a surprise, not a normal aspect of the new life.
3. It says we have an Advocate with the Father. Meaning If sin comes in, we will once again need the mediation of our Advocate, not a flippant claim of, "God sees me through Jesus hence it does not matter". The imagery here is what was painted in the OT when a trespasser came to the High Priest with a sacrifice. However, now, He is the Advocate, He is the sacrifice, we come by faith and repentance.
4. Does this mean we are free to continue in the sin-and-repent vicious circle?

6 [b]No one who abides in Him [who lives and remains in communion with and in obedience to Him—deliberately, knowingly, and habitually commits (practices) sin. No one who [habitually] sins has either seen or known Him [recognized, perceived, or understood Him, or has had an experiential acquaintance with Him
1 John 3:6[/b]AMP

1. I totally comply with your no 1.

2. Your no.2 should not imply to mistaken sins alone, but to ANY KIND OF SIN. Please, don't forget that SIN IS SIN, we should not always try to bring the word "mistaken sin" into discussions like this because MOST sin that man commit is DELIBERATE. But, not withstanding, I would like you to list out sins that can be seen as mistaken and not deliberate before it is committed.

3. I view your no.3 answer as something TOTALLY FLAWED. What do you mean by "...we will ONCE AGAIN need the mediation of our Advocate,..."

You FULLY ignored that "mediation" in that context means reconciling/justifying. That's why you made it look like we ONLY need to be mediated when we sin and that is a TOTAL FALSEHOOD.

If we are only mediated "once again" when we commit sin, so it means that we don't need to be mediated when we are doing the right thing? In other words, when we live rightly God sees us as people who are righteous and KEPT MEDIATED(justified), but if we do something wrong, we cease to be mediated(justified) before him until we ask jesus to mediate us back. THAT IS A TOTAL LIE!!!

Why? Because this is pointing to the fact that we are saved(justified) by faith, kept by good works and abandoned because we did something wrong.

WE ARE SAVED BY GRACE THROUGH FAITH, LIVE AND KEPT BY GRACE THROUGH FAITH AND NEVER BY WORKS.

Eph 2:8-9;"8 FOR BY GRACE ARE YE SAVED THROUGH FAITH(believing); and that not of yourselves: IT IS THE GIFT OF GOD:
9 NOT OF WORKS(right living), lest any man should
boast."

1peter 1:4-5;"4 To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,
5 WHO ARE KEPT by the power of God THROUGH FAITH(grace and not by works) unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time."

WE ARE NOT KEPT BY DOING WHAT IS RIGHT AND WE ARE NOT ABANDONED BECAUSE WE DID SOMETHING WRONG. RATHER WE ARE KEPT BY FAITH IN THE FINISHED WORK OF CHRIST THROUGH THE POWER OF GOD.


WE ARE BEING RECONCILED BOTH IN OUR GOOD DOINGS AND BAD DOINGS. The worst of all is that you made look like our reconciliation is MOMENTAL, please that's a heresy.

Because, our right living is such a filthy rag to keep us justified before God, we are mediated through out our life, we are in faith(believing) and not momental.

Our mediation, reconciliation and justification took place at the cross but has a EVER CONTINOUS EFFECT on believers.

Rom 4:5;"But to him that WORKETH NOT, but
BELIEVES on him that JUSTIFIES the ungodly, HIS
FAITH is counted for righteousness."

The ungodly is not only people who commit sin, but state of ungodliness is a state adam put us to. Our mediation is continuous.

2cor 5:19;"19 To wit, that God was in Christ, RECONCILING(present-continuous) the world unto himself, NOT IMPUTTING(present-continuous) their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation."

This reconciliation takes place whether you are living rightly or not, by FAITH. WE ARE SUSTAINED BY FAITH.


The greek word for advocate is paraklétos which means intercessor.

Please, you have to note that Jesus' intercession that takes place on our behalf is not only when we do something wrong, but when we do something right as well.

What you have to understand is; how does jesus work as our advocate/intercessor? How does he advocates for us?


Jesus DOES NOT INTERCEED or ADVOCATE FOR US by always begging God the father to accept us but when God sees the faith we have in the punishment Jesus took on our behalf we are mediated, justified and reconciled!!! And this takes place whether we are doing good works or not.

And bear in mind that if we are living rightly, but do not rely on the faith of christ's finished work we are no more reconciled and mediated before God.

How does Jesus' intercession on our behalf works?

To understand how it works you have to know that we were ONCE AND FOR ALL interceded for, when jesus took the position of our sinful nature and FREELY declared us innocent by the faith we have in him and this took place ONCE. Now, by our steadfast faith in the perfect interceding work he did at the cross, we are steadfastly interceded as well in our life.


So, 1john 2:1 is only informing us that when we sin, we should REMEMBER that we have an advocate whose's atoning blood speaks for us both in good doings and bad doings. So that it will be to our notice that we are still justified in him. I am I saying this to promote sin? No, but to promote freedom from condemnation which has been FREELY given to us.

At the end of your no.3 you said this "...we come by faith and repentance."

We don't come by faith, because we are still having our faith(believing). The faith we are saved by is not a religion or right living but an act of BELIEVING on the finished work of christ which STEADFASTLY JUSTIFIES us. So far the person hasn't stopped BELIEVING on the punishment Jesus took for him on his behalf, HE HAS NOT LOST HIS FAITH(believing).

So, in a better way, we don't come by faith rather justification and God's righteousness is STILL IMPUTED on us by the faith we are STILL HAVING in our punishment which he took at the cross.

In the case of repentance, the biblical repentance is "change of mind" and not prayer of forgiveness.

"Repentance of a believer is the recognition that I committed— and changing my mind from works I have to do to stand right with God to STANDING STEADFAST IN BELIEVING WHAT JESUS HAS DONE FOR ME ON MY BEHALF TO ENJOY RIGHT STANDING WITH GOD even without the deed of the law."




4. We are not meant to live a sin-repent vicious life. But even if christians babes who are not yet matured in faith do it, they are justified for the sake of the atoning blood of jesus that was shed on their behalf.


5. In your no.5 I agree with you ,but1john 3:6 is never saying that christians are sinless perfect. Never, as I have potentially talked about that on a separate answer.

Promise10, can one loose his salvation? If yes, how? If no why?

Bible reference will be appreciated. Kindly keep it short too. Thanks

Scholar8200:
Yield to the temptation

Lol... at your call Mister.

Gombs:
Promise10, can one loose his salvation? If yes, how? If no why?

Bible reference will be appreciated. Kindly keep it short too. Thanks

CAN A CHRISTIAN LOOSE HIS SALVATION? YES and
NO.


YES, only if he starts to rely on works of
righteousness which comes through obedience to
law or if he REJECTS the grace as a source of
righteousness and start to look for it by works of
righteousness.


Gal 5:4;"Christ is BECOME OF NO EFFECT unto you,
whosoever of you are JUSTIFIED(seeking
righteousness) by the law; YE ARE FALLEN FROM
GRACE"

Romans 9:30-33;"30 What shall we say then? That
the Gentiles, which FOLLOWED NOT after
righteousness, HAVE ATTAINED to righteousness,
even the RIGHTEOUSNESS WHICH IS OF FAITH(not
works of right living).
31 But Israel, which followed after the law of
righteousness, HATH NOT ATTAINED to the law of
righteousness.
32 WHEREFORE? Because they sought it NOT BY
FAITH, but as it were by the works of the law. FOR
THEY STUMBLE at that stumblingstone;
33 As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a
stumblingstone and rock of offence: and whosoever
BELIEVETH(faith) on him shall not be ashamed."



NO, HE WILL NOT LOOSE IT even when he committed sin because his sins have been judged and atoned for by the death of jesus christ at the cross.

If he is STEADFASTLY trusting and relying on Jesus who has been declared the PERFECT righteousness of God


1cor 3:12-15;"12 Now if any man build upon this
foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay,
stubble;
13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for
the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed
by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of
what sort it is.
14 If any man's work abidewhich he hath built
thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer
loss: BUT HE HIMSELF SHALL BE SAVED; yet so as
by fire"

NOTE: the man who will suffer loss is the person
whose works were bad and as such got burnt. The
person will suffer loss of his reward but HE HIMSELF
SHALL BE SAVED. Why? Because eternal life is a GIFT we receive by faith.


Eph 2:8-9;"8 For by grace are ye saved THROUGH
FAITH(believing); and that not of yourselves: IT IS
THE GIFT OF GOD:
9 NOT OF WORKS(right living), lest any man should
boast."


Romans 6:23;"23 For the wages of sin is death; BUT
THE GIFT OF GOD IS ETERNAL LIFE through Jesus
Christ our Lord."

Our wages has been paid by Jesus' death which took place on our behalf, therefore offering us the free gift of God which is eternal life even without the deed of the law, romans 3:28.


Romans 4:25;"WHO WAS DELIVERED FOR OUR
OFFENCES, and was raised again for our
justification."


Stay in grace.

bmeworld:
I want to read and learn... my heart pricks me everynow and then about my salvation

Jesus doesn't want you to be in a position where you are CLEARLY UNSURE whether he totally saved you or not.

Start reading your bible, it will help a lot.

There is a certain someone who has been spamming this beautiful thread with all manner of false doctrines. But pls, do not be carried away.

I stand with scholar8200.

promise10:

Jesus doesn't want you to be in a position where you are CLEARLY UNSURE whether he totally saved you or not.

Start reading your bible, it will help a lot.

I will make sure i start reading my bible. thanks alot

Image123:

Who is candiru?

It's candour , corrected thanks

Candour:

No wahala. Make i dey harvest dey go while Jo and him crew dey teach us

Pls it's open for us all to to teach or to challenge a teaching or doctrine .