Willzkid:
If you know this, then what is the essence of this thread?
why not open a thread to expound the fatherhood of Abraham from your own perspective?
why resort to sensationalism, and thereby negate a Bible truth?
This thread and its title smacks of conceit ..there are better ways of expressing knowledge

My bro...i wonder o..i thot i was the only one that noticed it.

Bidam: So by your analogy Enoch died abi? What about Elijah? If you mean spiritual death Abel was righteous before he was killed by his brother.By faith Abel brought God a better offering than Cain did. By faith he was commended as righteous, when God spoke well of his offerings. And by faith Abel still speaks, even though he is dead. heb 11:4. also Men live up to a thousand years before they died as is the case with Methuselah. Can you explain that?

it seems christem didnt just jump galatians he also jump hebrew too. You claim abraham was governed by death yet he was reckoned righteous.
Alleluia

Goshen360: New International Version (©2011)
And do not think you can say to yourselves, 'We have Abraham as our father.' I tell you that out of these stones God can raise up children for Abraham.

◄ Matthew 3:9 ►

New International Version (©2011)
What then shall we say that Abraham, our forefather according to the flesh, discovered in this matter?

New Living Translation (©2007)
Abraham was, humanly speaking, the founder of our Jewish nation. What did he discover about being made right with God?

English Standard Version (©2001)
What then shall we say was gained by Abraham, our forefather according to the flesh?

New American Standard Bible (©1995)
What then shall we say that Abraham, our forefather according to the flesh, has found?

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
What shall we say then that Abraham our father, as pertaining to the flesh, hath found?
◄ Romans 4:1 ►
New Living Translation (©2007)
Circumcision was a sign that Abraham already had faith and that God had already accepted him and declared him to be righteous--even before he was circumcised. So Abraham is the spiritual father of those who have faith but have not been circumcised. They are counted as righteous because of their faith.
◄ Romans 4:11 ►
We shall pick up from here! We must understand the perspective of 'fatherhood' to which Abraham belongs. I will build from those three scriptures that points the 'fatherhood' of Abraham. Abraham is a two-fold meaning man - a spiritual father of them that are of faith and a natural (according to the flesh) father of the Jewish nation.

now you are talking.

christemmbassey: One mistake leads to the others. The problem of the church today is, many peole who occupy leadership positions are ppl 'who dont know' and this shows up in the life of assumptions in the body of Christ. Ppl still feel obligated to pay tithe, do child dedication, do 'church' wedding, go to mountain/Jerusalem or other special places to pray , and most of the time do or say something that will connect them to Abraham for them to be blessed, some say, i pay my tithe because my father Abraham paid tithe and was blessed by Melchizedek. Well , my fellow christians, Abraham is the father of the jews AND NOT OUR(CHRISTIANS) father. .....to be continued

i dnt know where u dug this info from,but lemma just state this.

When the bible said we are children of abraham,it meant we are children of abaraham by COVENANT AND OBEDIENCE,nt in the litrally sense of ancestorship or lineage.
The covenant first startd with abraham, read ur bible,it is through that covenant made with abraham that the children of iseral also tap into,

when a foreigner,sinner, etc ,accepts christ he/she tap into that covenant ,cause it is through that covenant that CHRIST came.

So in a sense ,i guess ur right,i neva bothered reading down ur post,so nt rilly sure what ur saying,just attacking the topic.

Ubenedictus: yeah, it seems they draged d arguement out of the tithe thread. I don't understand how their anti tithing doctrine has lead them to deny that abraham is our father in faith.

That's what's at the back of their minds. That's the subtle goal/end of this 'reveletion'.

Goshen360:

Go & sit somewhere if you have nothing meaningful to contribute. What's head knowledge you people scream about sef? If you can speak about the word without looking at the bible, isn't that a function of your mind that also works with your brain in your head?

Rather have nothing to contribute than contribute poison, and remove from the word of God just to get attention. Even a sinner knows that God is our Father so i seriously wonder what you're trying to convey. Ask the average person on the street, the secular musicians and the nollywood actor/actress and they'll tell you about 'Baba God'. Everyone sane person knows God is our Father. The Bible clearly teaches that Abraham is the father of every believer. It is expedient as that's the way to be blessed by the seed Jesus Christ. Go and learn what it means to say that the letter killeth, it is the Spirit that gives life.

Image123:
Rather have nothing to contribute than contribute poison, and remove from the word of God just to get attention. Even a sinner knows that God is our Father so i seriously wonder what you're trying to convey. Ask the average person on the street, the secular musicians and the nollywood actor/actress and they'll tell you about 'Baba God'. Everyone sane person knows God is our Father. The Bible clearly teaches that Abraham is the father of every believer. It is expedient as that's the way to be blessed by the seed Jesus Christ. Go and learn what it means to say that the letter killeth, it is the Spirit that gives life.

Again, you're still quoting this your unlearned "the letter killeth and the Spirit gives life". I have told you on the other thread, you're yet to leave religious interpretation and what was passed down to you. Get out of religion and start afresh. That letter that killeth is the same LAW OF MOSES that you strongly hold onto and MIX with Grace. Indeed, it becomes a little leaven in the Gospel of Grace. Again, read 2 Corinthians 3:6 in all other translations and you see, the "letter" is the LAW OF MOSES, that kills.

First, you jump to conclusion so quickly. Didn't you read what I wrote up there? Abraham is a 2-fold meaning man. Go read what I wrote up there because I'm not ready to repeat myself. If the OP said, "Christians, Abraham is NOT your father". That might means NOT our natural father according to the flesh - what do you say in that case? Off course he is right! That's why I was asking those and as we know, Abraham is the father of those who are of faith, then what does that mean? None of you have given a biblical answer yet and you're here talking but saying nothing.

@Image123,
I have been wanting to undertand your views on the law and the prophets which many struggle to understand.
Remember when Jesus said to His disciples, beware of the leaven of the Pharisees, his disciples did not understand as they saw that literarily instead of the spirit behind the word of Jesus. Indeed the letter killeth.

From your discussion above, could you expantiate further on this seeing that the law is holy and is not sin.

If you read the continuation of Goshen scripture post above, this is exactly what Christ meant when He said the Spirit giveth life:

II Corinthians 3:14-18
14 But the people’s minds were hardened, and to this day whenever the old covenant is being read, the same veil covers their minds so they cannot understand the truth. And this veil can be removed only by believing in Christ.
15 Yes, even today when they read Moses’ writings, their hearts are covered with that veil, and they do not understand.
16 But whenever someone turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away. 17 For the Lord is the Spirit, and wherever the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom.
18 So all of us who have had that veil removed can see and reflect the glory of the Lord. And the Lord—who is the Spirit—makes us more and more like him as we are changed into his glorious image.


Personally I think this explains a lot of why the children of Israel could not obey the law as they followed the letter, instead of the intent and spirit behind why God instituted the law. What is your take?

frosbel: Thank you Jare.

Our Father is GOD , end of...

if god is your father, who is your mother?

Alfamann:

if god is your father, who is your mother?

are u a muslim? your post sounds like one.

Alfamann:

if god is your father, who is your mother?

go and ask the DEPUTY POLICE OFFICER.

Bidam: are u a muslim? your post sounds like one.

no. i'm not a muslim.

frosbel: Thank you Jare.

Our Father is GOD , end of...

If you could endorse all that he said without picking out the wrong ones then am afraid. Me thinks you can do better than this going by the way you analyze the scriptures. Pls read through OP again. thanks.

striktlymi: Good morning Christem,

As a member of the mystical body of Christ, I have to say that the way some of you pass of your private interpretations of sacred scriptures as truths is becoming very alarming.

If you as an individual want to go without having a Christian wedding, not pay tithe, decides that Abraham is not your father in faith, then I won't have an ish with it but to attempt to present these as something that should be applicable to every Christian is not appropriate.

I am a Christian, I am a Catholic Christian and I believe firmly that anyone who WANTS to, can pay tithe without feeling any obligation, I believe firmly that supporting the church with our time, talents and treasures is very important, I believe firmly that going to bless a union in Church is a very good practice and I believe firmly that Abraham is my father in faith.

#Its high time we taught love of God an neighbour and not some personal interpretation of sacred scriptures.


Thank you!

My dear you are very correct. Its like we have here a gang of people who are feeling that they read the bible perfectly well and have perfect understanding of it and can interpret it perfectly. They dont want you to believe your pastor yet they are forcing you to believe them. They accuse you of falling mugu to your pastors teaching and on the other hand force you to believe them( as per say them be Holy Spirit that guides you into all truth) See human beings o?? This is why i keep advising that whatever anybody reads here, pls pray God for proper guidance o. Dont be carried away by anybody's bible quoting mechanism because Satan also quoted bible when he tempted Jesus. MAY GOD HELP US ALL(including me) NOT TO DECEIVE PEOPLE TO HELL WITH OUR TEACHINGS. Amen. I dont want to miss heaven because of giving a false teaching or for any reason whatsoever.

Uhmmmnn!
If you've been forced to pledge large sums of money in your church or pay tithe via c/card and so on, u r on ur own!
but dont go about spreading such info. and quoting bible passages like 'idont knw wat'

'Christians' are believers/followers of Christ - Jesus Christ okay? u can become a Christian regardless of whom ur 'Father' is. . .'cause if u dispute this, then there r a lot more things u should be disputing wiv ur misinterpretationzzzz

Oh well! iKnow it as "God's portion" and how you opt to give it depends on you & it doesn't have to be 'money'. . . and if you decide not to give it, knowing fully well that u should. . . again u r on ur own!

alexleo:

My dear you are very correct. Its like we have here a gang of people who are feeling that they read the bible perfectly well and have perfect understanding of it and can interpret it perfectly. They dont want you to believe your pastor yet they are forcing you to believe them. They accuse you of falling mugu to your pastors teaching and on the other hand force you to believe them( as per say them be Holy Spirit that guides you into all truth) See human beings o?? This is why i keep advising that whatever anybody reads here, pls pray God for proper guidance o. Dont be carried away by anybody's bible quoting mechanism because Satan also quoted bible when he tempted Jesus. MAY GOD HELP US ALL(including me) NOT TO DECEIVE PEOPLE TO HELL WITH OUR TEACHINGS. Amen. I dont want to miss heaven because of giving a false teaching or for any reason whatsoever.

You have said it all. You will NOT miss Heaven my bro..God has marvelously helped us.

Alwaystrue: @Image123,
I have been wanting to undertand your views on the law and the prophets which many struggle to understand.
Remember when Jesus said to His disciples, beware of the leaven of the Pharisees, his disciples did not understand as they saw that literarily instead of the spirit behind the word of Jesus. Indeed the letter killeth.

From your discussion above, could you expantiate further on this seeing that the law is holy and is not sin.

If you read the continuation of Goshen scripture post above, this is exactly what Christ meant when He said the Spirit giveth life:

II Corinthians 3:14-18
14 But the people’s minds were hardened, and to this day whenever the old covenant is being read, the same veil covers their minds so they cannot understand the truth. And this veil can be removed only by believing in Christ.
15 Yes, even today when they read Moses’ writings, their hearts are covered with that veil, and they do not understand.
16 But whenever someone turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away. 17 For the Lord is the Spirit, and wherever the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom.
18 So all of us who have had that veil removed can see and reflect the glory of the Lord. And the Lord—who is the Spirit—makes us more and more like him as we are changed into his glorious image.


Personally I think this explains a lot of why the children of Israel could not obey the law as they followed the letter, instead of the intent and spirit behind why God instituted the law. What is your take?

I'd respond to this in due time, sorry i'm on phone.

alexleo:

My dear you are very correct. Its like we have here a gang of people who are feeling that they read the bible perfectly well and have perfect understanding of it and can interpret it perfectly. They dont want you to believe your pastor yet they are forcing you to believe them. They accuse you of falling mugu to your pastors teaching and on the other hand force you to believe them( as per say them be Holy Spirit that guides you into all truth) See human beings o?? This is why i keep advising that whatever anybody reads here, pls pray God for proper guidance o. Dont be carried away by anybody's bible quoting mechanism because Satan also quoted bible when he tempted Jesus. MAY GOD HELP US ALL(including me) NOT TO DECEIVE PEOPLE TO HELL WITH OUR TEACHINGS. Amen. I dont want to miss heaven because of giving a false teaching or for any reason whatsoever.

word.

Wao, amazing, God bless you all. 1st, i have to apologize to all of you for my suden disapearance after pleading for a chance to conclude the Op. The reason is this, some brethren lost their lives as they were returning from a crusade on satday morning, young believers full of dreams for the Lord. Uptill now its very hard for me.

christemmbassey: Wao, amazing, God bless you all. 1st, i have to apologize to all of you for my suden disapearance after pleading for a chance to conclude the Op. The reason is this, some brethren lost their lives as they were returning from a crusade on satday morning, young believers full of dreams for the Lord. Uptill now its very hard for me.

sorry. Accept my condolences.

Image123:
sorry. Accept my condolences.

Seconded.

Goshen360:

Seconded.

"thirded", is that good english?

because of what happened on satday, which completly unsetles me, i will just sumarise as follows. 1. Christ advent was to fulfilll God's promise to redeem man in Gen 3:15. 2. God promised to make Abraham father of many nations was fulfiled in the nations of Isreal and did not include christianity, however Christ had to be born from thn nation of Isreal for obvious reasons.(GEN 12:3) 3. Abraham is called the father of faith, because he was the 1st person to display God kind-of faith. Coming from an idol worshiping background, he just head a voice and he obeyed in faith(Gen 12). 4. When God said, "....and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed"Gen12:3,Gal:3:8 WHAT WAS THIS BLESSING?, did this statement meant that Abraham is going to be made the father of ALL families of the eath? No. 5. Now what is the connection between the christian and Abraham? The anser is very simple-FAITH. Abraham believed God and it was imputed unto him for righteousness Jm2:23,Gal3:6 with the same faith the christian believes in his heart that God raised Christ from the dead. "with the heart man believeth unto righteousness...." Rm10:9-10, thats the only thing that conects us with Abraham.-faith, Gal3:9 says "SO THEN THEY WHICH BE OF FAITH ARE BKLESSED WITH THE FAITHFUL ABRAHAM. You see, its because we accept Christ by faith(seed) of Abraham but he is not our projenitor, we were not born of Abraham. 6. Now, who is a christian?, simple, 'a christian is someone who is BORN-AGAIN, 1Peter1:23 says, "being born again, not of coruptible seed, but of incoruptible, BY THE WORD OF GOD, which liveth and abided forever", (kjv) Abraham died, now i will ask, when Christ said, " i am the way the truth and the life, no man cometh unto the FATHER, but by me" jn14:6(kjv) was it Abraham he was refering to? 7. Abraham is the FATHER of the Jews and NOT of the christians. Matt3:9,Luke13:16, 16:22-30, 19:9, jn 8:37-39 acts 3:25, acts 7:2, acts 13:26. Continues in a moment....

^ ^ Please continue and finish your OP man of God. I will follow up to expand on it when you're done. Many Christians are very quick to speak against you even when you have not concluded yet and they don't even understand what it means that "Abraham is the father of them that are of faith". I hope I do have time today so I will expand the truth\revelation you're sharing. Thank you man of God.

he has said it yet again. Oh God, deliver us from evils this time in Jesus name.

Pls this post is not to rob anyone of their Abrahamic paternity neither is it an attempt to force anyone to accept anything, the jast i checked, this is a forum where we all come to share with love as ppl who have recieved liked precious faith, nobody is here to force anybody but to share and i think if you feel strongly against any point the best is to mashall out urs with scriptures and questions, i dont supports this proclivity of throwing away the baby with the bath water. I never said anything about spiritual father(for what so ever that is) or father of faith, i saith, "christians, Abraham is not your FATHER". Christianity did not come as a fulfilment of God's promise to Abraham, but it cam as Gods plan for the restoration of man into his rightful position as the son of the living God, just like the pre-fall Adam who did not need to give God anything to enjoy God's blessings and rule as God intended. We are the children of God and not Abraham and stop singing 'Abraham blessings are mine', for what God has given to us is far more than what he promised or gave to Abraham. Concluded.

Image123: he has said it yet again. Oh God, deliver us from evils this time in Jesus name.

Becoming a troll on threads and saying nothing reasonable is irritating. Keep shut if you are on phone until you have something to say.

@ christemmbassey,

Thanks for the conclusion. I will follow up today, hopefully and allow others too to follow up. God bless you.

christemmbassey: because of what happened on satday, which completly unsetles me, i will just sumarise as follows. 1. Christ advent was to fulfilll God's promise to redeem man in Gen 3:15. 2. God promised to make Abraham father of many nations was fulfiled in the nations of Isreal and did not include christianity, however Christ had to be born from thn nation of Isreal for obvious reasons.(GEN 12:3) 3. Abraham is called the father of faith, because he was the 1st person to display God kind-of faith. Coming from an idol worshiping background, he just head a voice and he obeyed in faith(Gen 12). 4. When God said, "....and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed"Gen12:3,Gal:3:8 WHAT WAS THIS BLESSING?, did this statement meant that Abraham is going to be made the father of ALL families of the eath? No. 5. Now what is the connection between the christian and Abraham? The anser is very simple-FAITH. Abraham believed God and it was imputed unto him for righteousness Jm2:23,Gal3:6 with the same faith the christian believes in his heart that God raised Christ from the dead. "with the heart man believeth unto righteousness...." Rm10:9-10, thats the only thing that conects us with Abraham.-faith, Gal3:9 says "SO THEN THEY WHICH BE OF FAITH ARE BKLESSED WITH THE FAITHFUL ABRAHAM. You see, its because we accept Christ by faith(seed) of Abraham but he is not our projenitor, we were not born of Abraham. 6. Now, who is a christian?, simple, 'a christian is someone who is BORN-AGAIN, 1Peter1:23 says, "being born again, not of coruptible seed, but of incoruptible, BY THE WORD OF GOD, which liveth and abided forever", (kjv) Abraham died, now i will ask, when Christ said, " i am the way the truth and the life, no man cometh unto the FATHER, but by me" jn14:6(kjv) was it Abraham he was refering to? 7. Abraham is the FATHER of the Jews and NOT of the christians. Matt3:9,Luke13:16, 16:22-30, 19:9, jn 8:37-39 acts 3:25, acts 7:2, acts 13:26. Continues in a moment....

I don't agree sir.
I believe everything God did in the Old Testament was pointing to the new.
I believe Abrahams role is part of the mystery been revealed in Ephesians 3
The title of being the father of all nations can only be an attribute of God.
God made Abraham a shadow of himself on earth.
Abraham in himself is not faithful but He had faith in the faithfulness of God.
If u read the story properly. You will see Abraham as a shadow of God.
Isaac his only begotten son, a shadow of Jesus.
Jacob a shadow of the spirit.

Phone things thus the summary
I hope to learn from this topic

@OP, Sorry about the death. May the Lord comfort you and the families.

christemmbassey: We are the children of God and not Abraham and stop singing 'Abraham blessings are mine', for what God has given to us is far more than what he promised or gave to Abraham. Concluded.

Galatians 3:14
That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.

Galatians 3:7-8
7 The real children of Abraham, then, are those who put their faith in God.
8 What’s more, the Scriptures looked forward to this time when God would declare the Gentiles to be righteous because of their faith. God proclaimed this good news to Abraham long ago when he said, “All nations will be blessed THROUGH you.”.

Galatians 3:29
And now that you belong to Christ, you are the true children of Abraham. You are his heirs, and God’s promise to Abraham belongs to you.


Sorry christembassy, what you preached in your post above is your message not God's.

Ubenedictus: "thirded", is that good english?

one of the brethren who died led in praise and worship throughout the crusade and was about to release his debute gospel album, the womam who was his sponsore went to the hospital and pleaded with him not to die but come and fulfil his dream to the Lord, he said no that he want to be with the Lord, and he died in her hands. *tears wont allow me, bro Goshen pls help respond to odas posts*

christemmbassey: one of the brethren who died led in praise and worship throughout the crusade and was about to release his debute gospel album, the womam who was his sponsore went to the hospital and pleaded with him not to die but come and fulfil his dream to the Lord, he said no that he want to be with the Lord, and he died in her hands. *tears wont allow me, bro Goshen pls help respond to odas posts*

oooohh!!! Have faith in the mercy of the Almighty. Paul once wished to died so he'll be with christ. It's the pascha season, its time to ask death Where is ur victory, where is your sting.
Praise be to the father thru christ Jesus who has willed that by the death of christ death (in d spirit) may be distroyed, and by his resurrection we may hope for eternal live.
Amen.