..
watching TV and wearing earrings were worldy, but riding a sweet limo isn't..

Kobojunkie:
Well, the fact is different religions have different truths and so rather than have these contradictory truths in one space, they are best separated and maintained in their own space.

What one religion refers to as HS is not what the biblical religion refers to as Holy Spirit. What one religion refers to as God differs from what another religion does. The elementary indicators in one religion don't necessarily overlap with others and that's OK..

When I mention the Holy Spirit, I mean the very one presented in the Christian religion. Other call it Logos, the Word,we call it ECK in ECKANKAR.

Note the God in Christianity is not what we look up to in ECKANKAR. I need to mention this so you do not assume I am faking an affinity to gain acceptance.

No need to argue. Like Kumuyi, we are all work in progress and some doctrines, beliefs and wild assumptions rounded up as "Scripture" will be refuted by unmistakable reality and events to happen soon.

chieveboy:
1. Like I said, there is God and there is God. They made laws and men also made laws put into 'scripture'

This is very funny statement to make indeed. This is caused by a syndrome found in people who are bent on going by the Letters ignoring the spirit of it.

2. You only need to look around you. Karma makes it possible for your house to remain there, food to digest, eat, speak reap and sow etc. I even mentioned the study of this in Physics, but you seem to miss it. It's a psychological abberation to want to deny the divinity of this law merely because it is not written in a very limited book (scripture).

3. It's right there in your Bible from Jesus himself. You can use this to Case-study that syndrome I didn't give you it's name. It makes you sleep by a river searching for water. Same thing Kumuyi suffered and here you are.

4. Since you reap what you sow, no one sins against God. God takes no offence at all lol. You only 'sin' against yourself. A lie being touted by religion is that God (the supreme one) gets angry or may encounter sadness, regret and other negative or low emotions and states. That's coming from a lot of ignorance.

1. There are two major Laws of God detailed in the Bible and each Law define sin for a separate set of people and in a particular Kingdom. God's Law is not to be confused with man's laws and the consequences of disobedience of God's Law not to be confused in any way with consequences of breaking man's laws.

2. Karma or whatever else you claim is studied in Physics has little to nothing to do with what is stated in God's Law as contained in scripture.

The physics idea you are trying to associate with Karma is the Law that stipulates that for every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction, is it not? What is wrong with this is that the physics law state that the reaction to said action would apply in an opposite direction. So for example if good/positive energy is applied in one direction, bad/negativity is the reward that follows it from the opposite direction. Is that really the idea behind your law of Karma?

3. Again, you mistake your thoughts with that which is in the bible. Jesus Christ certainly did not teach anything remotely close to your Karmic Laws.

4. Here we go again, trying to digest that which you didn't pay close attention to. The entire idea behinh the scriptural teaching that concerns 'reaping what you sow' has to do with Sin and God. Those who sow wickedness while here on earth - they may prosper on earth aa they do so - will be rewarded by God with punishment He has for the wicked in the here after. And those who sow obedience and good works while here on earth - though many of of suffer for it while here on earth- will be rewarded afterwards with good, this by God.

It has everything to do with God's Law/Contract with men, and sin as defined within said Contract. God God indeed not a wrath-filled entity as portrayed by many religious bigots out there but God is a faithful God and He sticks to the details of His Contract with you just as He expects us to do the same..

chieveboy:
1. When I mention the Holy Spirit, I mean the very one presented in the Christian religion. Other call it Logos, the Word,we call it ECK in ECKANKAR.

Note the God in Christianity is not what we look up to in ECKANKAR. I need to mention this so you do not assume I am faking an affinity to gain acceptance.

2. No need to argue. Like Kumuyi, we are all work in progress and some doctrines, beliefs and wild assumptions rounded up as "Scripture" will be refuted by unmistakable reality and events to happen soon.

1. Again, the HS you describe has no resemble in any shape or form to the Holy Spirit as mentioned and taught of in biblical scripture. So it can't be the same entity.

2. Wrong! According to Jesus Christ, you either belong to God or you belong to the devil. There is no in-between there. You cannot serve two masters or serve lies and God's Truth at the same time - that is a contradiction.

chieveboy:
It will interest you that the teachings of Jesus if presented today in their original form, many Christians would look for another religion.

Jesus Christ did say that many are called but few are chosen, right? So, what matters at the end of the day is the Truth of God,and not the many adulterated digests floating around.

Kobojunkie:
Jesus Christ did say that many are called but few are chosen, right? So, what matters at the end of the day is the Truth of God,and not the many adulterated digests floating around.

I gave you a truth of God in another language and you wouldn't have it because it's not "scriptural"

What if you're presented with the Masters who groomed Jesus, the Charges words he sung to I create his vibration, the groups he belonged to before "starting his ministry", I am sure you would bind and cast me

Kobojunkie:
1. Again, the HS you describe has no resemble in any shape or form to the Holy Spirit as mentioned and taught of in biblical scripture. So it can't be the same entity.

2. Wrong! According to Jesus Christ, you either belong to God or you belong to the devil. There is no in-between there. You cannot serve two masters or serve lies and God's Truth at the same time - that is a contradiction.

This is very hilarious considering...

chieveboy:
1. I gave you a truth of God in another language and you wouldn't have it because it's not "scriptural"

2. What if you're presented with the Masters who groomed Jesus, the Charges words he sung to I create his vibration, the groups he belonged to before "starting his ministry", I am sure you would bind and cast me

Do you know what God's Truth refers to in scripture? If you did, you would know that it can't be added to, changed or deleted from by any man. But obviously, you don't understand what God's Law is about hence the reason why you proclaim yourself able to add to it from your "another language" that is not scriptural.

Again, maintain that boundaries between beliefs. It is essential so you don't keep running up against these conflicts especially since you don't seem to understand much of what is presented in scripture. My guess is you have never in fact taken time to read through scripture of your own is why.

2. Groomed Jesus Christ? At what particular stage in His 30-somethings years on the earth was He groomed by these so-called masters? Were all the other prophets in the bible also groomed by these very same masters? Or don't you think you are yet another religion taking a page from the quranic playbook here?

chieveboy:
This is very hilarious considering...

Considering what?

Kobojunkie:
1. There are two major Laws of God detailed in the Bible and each Law define sin for a separate set of people and in a particular Kingdom. God's Law is not to be confused with man's laws and the consequences of disobedience of God's Law not to be confused in any way with consequences of breaking man's laws.

2. Karma or whatever else you claim is studied in Physics has little to nothing to do with what is stated in God's Law as contained in scripture.

Let's bring it home to you: All the laws of nature/creation which physics discovered are the laws of God. That the bible didn't capture that says why it's a very limited compendium of Truth hence we do not study it to become physicists and biologists (who are all studying the laws of God).

The physics idea you are trying to associate with Karma is the Law that stipulates that for every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction, is it not? What is wrong with this is that the physics law state that the reaction to said action would apply in an opposite direction. So for example if good/positive energy is applied in one direction, bad/negativity is the reward that follows it from the opposite direction. Is that really the idea behind your law of Karma?

In everyday words: "Do not be deceived (a very big DO NOT BE), whatever a man sows, that shall he reap". Einstein merely found out about this law and Christened it 'The Law of Relativity' which says there cannot be smoke without fire. Buddhists and Hindus called it the Law of Karma. This law would exists whether Einstein, Jesus, Budhists etc mention it or not. Gerrit? There are hundreds of such laws mentioned and not mentioned in your scripture.

3.

Again, you mistake your thoughts with that which is in the bible. Jesus Christ certainly did not teach anything remotely close to your Karmic Laws.

There you go. "Remotely"?

4.

Here we go again, trying to digest that which you didn't pay close attention to. The entire idea behinh the scriptural teaching that concerns 'reaping what you sow' has to do with Sin and God. Those who sow wickedness while here on earth - they may prosper on earth aa they do so - will be rewarded by God with punishment He has for the wicked in the here after. And those who sow obedience and good works while here on earth - though many of of suffer for it while here on earth- will be rewarded afterwards with good, this by God.

Sowing= Action, Causation
Reaping= Reaction, Effect. Gerrit?

It has everything to do with God's Law/Contract with men, and sin as defined within said Contract. God God indeed not a wrath-filled entity as portrayed by many religious bigots out there but God is a faithful God and He sticks to the details of His Contract with you just as He expects us to do the same..

"Contract", nothing like that beyond the self-executing and sustaining law of Karma.

Kobojunkie:
Considering what?

See, you are a Christian. Your sources are restricted hence your capacity to explore the deeper things of God. You may not be in position to assimilate certain truths considering your position on where it must come from.

If you must know, they Holy Spirit bypasses any with such mentality. It does not force itself to find believers. One must be ready and able to receive...

Kobojunkie:
Do you know what God's Truth refers to in scripture? If you did, you would know that it can't be added to, changed or deleted from by any man. But obviously, you don't understand what God's Law is about hence the reason why you proclaim yourself able to add to it from your "another language" that is not scriptural.

Again, maintain that boundaries between beliefs. It is essential so you don't keep running up against these conflicts especially since you don't seem to understand much of what is presented in scripture. My guess is you have never in fact taken time to read through scripture of your own is why.

2. Groomed Jesus Christ? At what particular stage in His 30-somethings years on the earth was He groomed by these so-called masters? Were all the other prophets in the bible also groomed by these very same masters? Or don't you think you are yet another religion taking a page from the quranic playbook here?

You wouldn't be asking these if you stop to think the prophets, disciples etc weren't Christians while today's christians reject these same religions. Please try to understand what I just wrote.

chieveboy:
1. Let's bring it home to you: All the laws of nature/creation which physics discovered are the laws of God. That the bible didn't capture that says why it's a very limited compendium of Truth hence we do not study it to become physicists and biologists (who are all studying the laws of God).

2. In everyday words: "Do not be deceived (a very big DO NOT BE), whatever a man sows, that shall he reap". Einstein merely found out about this law and Christened it 'The Law of Relativity' which says there cannot be smoke without fire. Buddhists and Hindus called it the Law of Karma. This law would exists whether Einstein, Jesus, Budhists etc mention it or not. Gerrit? There are hundreds of such laws mentioned and not mentioned in your scripture.

3. There you go. "Remotely"?

4. Sowing= Action, Causation
Reaping= Reaction, Effect. Gerrit?

5. "Contract", nothing like that beyond the self-executing and sustaining law of Karma.

1. Wrong! God's Law as described in scripture have absolutely nothing to do with the Laws of nature or Laws or phsycis, all of which guide existence as observed in the physical sense and from a perspective that is man's.

2. Again, your Karmic Laws and the Law of relativity has nothing to do with God's Law as defined and detailed in scripture.

3. So?

4. Switching out words won't change any of what I stated there about the biblical law as given by God where sin is concerned..

5. And as I already stated, your Karmic Laws has absolutely nothing to do with what is presented there in scripture.

chieveboy:
1. See, you are a Christian. Your sources are restricted hence your capacity to explore the deeper things of God. You may not be in position to assimilate certain truths considering your position on where it must come from.

2. If you must know, they Holy Spirit bypasses any with such mentality. It does not force itself to find believers. One must be ready and able to receive...

1. I don't even understand what you mean at all. Again, pay attention. The only Truth that exists is God's Word, and everything else is a lie. If you have ever taken a math logic course, you might understand why any claim that contradicts Truth cannot be Truth..

2. Stop trying to pass your contradictions as Truths abeg! I already explained that your HS idea has no bearing or relationship to the Holy Spirit described in scripture so I am not sure why you keep going on with this.

chieveboy:
You wouldn't be asking these if you stop to think the prophets, disciples etc weren't Christians while today's christians reject these same religions. Please try to understand what I just wrote.

The Old Covenant prophets were not Christians because they were callee according to the Old Covenant.

The disciples were however Christians because they were followers of Jesus Christ,I.e. the Christ in the word "Christian".

Many of Today's Christians may reject many of the Old teachings but that does not in anyway change the teachings more render them obsolete. Again, the one doing the choosing here is God whose standard was made known to men through Jesus Christ. Men are free to live up to His standard or choose their own path. That has no impact on God's standard.

Kobojunkie:
The Old Covenant prophets were not Christians because they were callee according to the Old Covenant.

The disciples were however Christians because they were followers of Jesus Christ,I.e. the Christ in the word "Christian".

Many of Today's Christians may reject many of the Old teachings but that does not in anyway change the teachings more render them obsolete. Again, the one doing the choosing here is God whose standard was made known to men through Jesus Christ. Men are free to live up to His standard or choose their own path. That has no impact on God's standard.

Have you heard of ancient Sumerians? They predate the old covenant itself. Abraham and Melchidezek are from that era. You want check that out.

Kobojunkie:
1. I don't even understand what you mean at all. Again, pay attention. The only Truth that exists is God's Word, and everything else is a lie. If you have ever taken a math logic course, you might understand why any claim that contradicts Truth cannot be Truth..

2. Stop trying to pass your contradictions as Truths abeg! I already explained that your HS idea has no bearing or relationship to the Holy Spirit described in scripture so I am not sure why you keep going on with this.

You wouldn't understand--but of course
If physics says the earth is not the center of the universe when scripture says so, who are we to argue against the almighty lorde?

If scripture says a "a second light" was created to shine by night when infact nothing I the universe exists for that function, we keep shut right?

I cannot believe you said this.

Matheusmartin:
..
watching TV and wearing earrings were worldy, but riding a sweet limo isn't..

LoL, we can all cut him some slack now can't we

chieveboy:
Have you heard of ancient Sumerians? They predate the old covenant itself. Abraham and Melchidezek are from that era. You want check that out.

Yes, I have read of the sumerians. What about them?

chieveboy:
1. You wouldn't understand--but of course
If physics says the earth is not the center of the universe when scripture says so, who are we to argue against the almighty lorde?

If scripture says a "a second light" was created to shine by night when infact nothing I the universe exists for that function, we keep shut right?

I cannot believe you said this.

Scripture does not say the earth is the center of the universe though.

Again scripture is not meant as a science book or book about the laws of nature or physics, nor is it a replacement of such. Instead it is a collection of writings that presents God's Law to man. And everything written in it is meant to be processed in the context on man's relationship with God, and no other way.

LAS LAS NA SCAM

Kobojunkie:
1. I don't even understand what you mean at all. Again, pay attention. The only Truth that exists is God's Word, and everything else is a lie. If you have ever taken a math logic course, you might understand why any claim that contradicts Truth cannot be Truth..

2. Stop trying to pass your contradictions as Truths abeg! I already explained that your HS idea has no bearing or relationship to the Holy Spirit described in scripture so I am not sure why you keep going on with this.

U believe all this tinz?

chieveboy:


LoL, we can all cut him some slack now can't we

. we will.
It's not as if we have any other option..
Do we?

Kobojunkie:
Scripture does not say the earth is the center of the universe though.

Again scripture is not meant as a science book or book about the laws of nature or physics,

From where you stand, the laws of nature and physics are the laws of man right?

nor is it a replacement of such. Instead it is a collection of writings that presents God's Law to man. And everything written in it is meant to be processed in the context on man's relationship with God, and no other way.

Which God? you need to make a distinction. The laws of nature (which the ten commandments where derived from) existed before scripture. This then does not make ANY book it is written on an authority.

Kobojunkie:
Yes, I have read of the sumerians. What about them?

Good. I previously asked you "which God right"?
Are you aware of the deities they worshipped?
Are you aware the Torah which the Old Testament is derived from originates from the records of the Sumerians?

Can you piece these together?

Kobojunkie:
1.
4. Switching out words won't change any of what I stated there about the biblical law as given by God where sin is concerned..

Did you understand what you just wrote? I actually used the words of Jesus Christs himself o ("sowing and Reaping" ) and you still tried to turn it upside down. Or should enlighten you that Jesus was not talking about agriculture per say but meant 'Action and Reaction' (being equal) ? Boy!
You so live in a state of denial don't you?

chieveboy:


I am tempted to tell you there is no such thing as Sin, but who is to bell the cat?

We are ruled by a more stricter or Just law. The law of Karma or what physicists call Cause and Effect. It returns to you whatever you do good or bad. This differs from Sin where you can make a plea or perform an oral ritual and its gone. That is a whole setup! It MUST be paid in cash and kind and as invested. Even death does clean this off. The person is sent back in a fresh body to enjoy the music good or bad.

Even from human (carnal) point of view Sin and forgiveness is injustice.

If people are returned after death how come human population is increasing? Shouldn't it remain steady?

LordReed:


If people are returned after death how come human population is increasing? Shouldn't it remain steady?

A misconception is that humans are the only sentient beings that exist in the universe or multiverse. Their a gazillions of Souls in other planets, galaxies and dimensions which the church calls "heaven". A lot of them yearn for a slot to incarnate on earth as humans. Some have been here before and others a new comers.

So the population is not being recycled. in fact given the amount of negativity or hardship on this planet, more souls jostle for a chance to come here.

chieveboy:
1.From where you stand, the laws of nature and physics are the laws of man right?

2. Which God? you need to make a distinction. The laws of nature (which the ten commandments where derived from) existed before scripture. This then does not make ANY book it is written on an authority.

1. From where I stand, the Laws of Nature and Laws of Physics are not God's Law - Law that defines the relationship between God and man..

2. I have more than made myself clear as far as the God that I speak of from the beginning of this debate. The 10 commandments are not laws of nature but instead a part of an agreement that comprised instead of a total of 613 commandments and statutes, given by God to the children of Israel..

Kobojunkie:
1. From where I stand, the Laws of Nature and Laws of Physics are not God's Law - Law that defines the relationship between God and man..

2. I have more than made myself clear as far as the God that I speak of from the beginning of this debate. The 10 commandments are not laws of nature but instead a part of an agreement that comprised instead of a total of 613 commandments and statutes, given by God to the children of Israel..

1: You invariably just said another entity is running the show behind God's backyard. Very wow!

chieveboy:
1. Good. I previously asked you "which God right"?
Are you aware of the deities they worshipped?
Are you aware the Torah which the Old Testament is derived from originates from the records of the Sumerians?

Can you piece these together?

1. In every culture on this planet, you will find that people's worship several gods, so it matters little to nothing what other deities where worshipped by whom and why.

Abraham, as far as scripture is concerned chose, and worshipped the God that later became the God of Israel. The God of Israel then gave to the Israelites, through Moses, a Law book that contains, not 10 but 613 commandments and statutes, which they refer to as the Torah.

I am not certain what you hope to gain by deviating from the subject here but I hope you don't intend to push this past this post.

chieveboy:
Did you understand what you just wrote? I actually used the words of Jesus Christs himself o ("sowing and Reaping" ) and you still tried to turn it upside down. Or should enlighten you that Jesus was not talking about agriculture per say but meant 'Action and Reaction' (being equal) ? Boy!
You so live in a state of denial don't you?

Again, I believe I sufficiently explained the idea of sowing and reaping as expressed in the New Covenant to you earlier. It has to do with the Law of Sin and God's promise/ punishment .

The entire idea behind the scriptural teaching that concerns 'reaping what you sow' has to do with Sin and God.
■ Those who sow wickedness while here on earth - they may prosper on earth aa they do so - will be rewarded by God with punishment He has for the wicked in the here after.
■ And those who sow obedience and good works while here on earth - though many of of suffer for it while here on earth- will be rewarded afterwards with good, this by God