@joagbaje. I am also a member of CE but I don't deify Pastor Chris. He is but a man with all our flaws. So it is not everything that comes out of his mouth that is the gospel. So I make God the focus of my worship and not the priest. Then I reject the prosperity gospel that is the foundation of the church. I think this fuels greed and not genuine love for God. It is about what's in
It for me. If I give a prado jeep, what will God give me? This is not what Christ or Paul preached. It is not about self, or what God will give us. But most people in CE get this wrong. Their desire to give is driven by what they hope to get. This makes God seem like an investment banker, looking out to bless people that have given(sown). This is not God. It Is Mormon!

Then Joagbaje if you gave a car, how come you are boasting about it here? Are you not aware that the left hand should not know what the right has given? Well according to the bible, you have already gotten your reward. Then show love and humility even to those who spite you. That is the Christian attitude. As it is,
your (online) attitude can not preach to anyone let alone encourage them to attend CE. god bless you brother.

Joagbaje:

Being rich is different from materialism. He is rich,and he use it for the gospel all over the world and  the world Cant deny that dude.I never boast about that . pastor chris taught us not to move into a big house until our present house is full
Get a life old man.

My pastor, never had his own house until early last year. He was a tenant paying rent. My pastor is not poor but stinkily rich.
Why didn't he buy a house then, even at that, he had over 8people staying with him and you know that if people stay with you, you are obligated to feed them, clothe them and educate them(which he was doing)

Now he has moved into a bigger apartment and he still moved with these same persons and added some other orphans, staff members,workers e.t.c
So you see houses don't mean anything to us, rather it's the people that fill the houses that matter

You really need to get a life grandpa(Kunle oshobi)

[quote][/quote]

March man:

@joagbaje. I am also a member of CE but I don't deify Pastor Chris. He is but a man with all our flaws. So it is not everything that comes out of his mouth that is the gospel. So I make God the focus of my worship and not the priest. Then I reject the prosperity gospel that is the foundation of the church. I think this fuels greed and not genuine love for God. It is about what's in
It for me. If I give a prado jeep, what will God give me? This is not what Christ or Paul preached. It is not about self, or what God will give us. But most people in CE get this wrong. Their desire to give is driven by what they hope to get. This makes God seem like an investment banker, looking out to bless people that have given(sown). This is not God. It Is mormon

You are not a committed member obviously
If you don't agree with the doctrines of your church,you are not his sheep, so , what are you still doing there
How do you gain satisfaction

Pastor Chris is a false prophet, as simple as ABC.

Why is anyone afraid to say this

first time I will ever find myself in agreement with Mabell the old witch

CE members are usually violent, myopic and so so SO dedicatedly money minded yet here is this gentleman speaking like someone who still has brains not yet corrupted by yaks yaps.

mabell:

The percentage of the poor is reducing by the day

The percentage of the poor is not reducing by the day. Seems the Obasanjo school of economics is gaining converts. Prosperity has increased in Nigeria in recent years as seen in the boom in the property market but it is largely in the hands of a few due to poor growth in the real sector and the fact Nigeria is the land of colossal public looting and patronage which makes a mess of the normal workings of the "free market" economics. People have been lifted out of poverty due to the growth in sectors like telecoms and the opening up brought about by the internet which has had the effect of liberalising such things as international scamming. But would you, ma'am, like to compare the rate at which Nigeria is reducing poverty with those of Brazil, China and even Mozambique or Ghana? Look around you and you will see desperately poor people.

And you people need to stop mouthing the lie that when you become born again you become rich!

mabell:
Why and how you may ask. It's because when a man becomes born again and walks in the true revelation of God's word, he walks in his inheritance in Christ and refuses to recognise the world's system.

Finally, the system did not create him, he is creating a system

You are partially right. Pastors tend to create their churches in their own image. Tonye-t once told about a pastor whose followers slap people. Why? Because their leader is belligerent. But these systems are created within an existing system, a system that appears to be anti-human, anti-cultural and anti-commonsense to most objective observers, the Pentecostal movement. Mr Oyakhilome is not the only one who "receives cars almost everyday" around. If what one hears is correct, Mr Adeboye does. Same for Mr Oyedepo. There is something horribly wrong with a system that creates people who go on COLLECTING like a medieval Morrocan king while 70% of the people live in varying degrees of privation.

mabell:

You are not a committed member obviously
If you don't agree with the doctrines of your church,you are not his sheep, so , what are you still doing there
How do you gain satisfaction 

Sheep being the operative word here, yes? 

By the way, your post is perhaps the most ridiculous post I've read on this section and trust me, I've read a lot. . .mostly from CE members but yours takes the cake.

You people are so blinded and brainwashed, it's amazing you are able to find your way out of the paper bag used to cover your heads. The post you quoted says everything a TRUE christian ought to be, yet you dismiss it because he doesn't edify your pastor? Because he doesn't think one should be boastful of what they give? Because he believes people shouldn't treat God as an investment bank? Because he believes laying too much emphasis on prosperity breeds greed? Do you reason at all. . . oh wait, scratch that, I forgot your brains are no longer yours, so of course you don't. . .you can't reason.

Just so you know, posts like yours are partly the reason why CE is always attacked. . .no sane human being would let stupidity displayed so blatantly slide.

Now be a good CE member and go meer meer at the wind.

frosbel:

Pastor Chris is a false prophet, as simple as ABC.

Why is anyone afraid to say this

What has he stolen from you?

nuclearboy:

first time I will ever find myself in agreement with Mabell the old witch

Hello nuke! You have long refused to grow into a man
You mean you can agree with a witch
OMG!

Mabell mabell! Mabell the no-brainer the 1st!

Shey na dat one dey pain you ?

But you don lose your brain totally O - shebi you breathe. And donkeys breathe! - does that make you a donkey? Abi why do you agree with donkeys over breathing?

So why can I not agree with a clueless witch like you over the fact that most CE members as represented "here" are full time m0r0ns!

You want to know what ought be painful to you? "SisiiKill's" post above - she totally killed you and showed the difference between your motley gang of greed-mongrels and what Christians are like!

So stop getting your dirty knickers in a twist!

PRAISE THE LORD!! Jesus would be proud!!

Below is a picture of Oyak's house and some of his over thirty jeeps. I really admire the well manicured lawn he uses as parking lot for his jeeps. The man has taste sha. But the kweshun arises, what does this man do for a living to justify such an opulent and vulgar lifestyle? What would a sane man be doing with over thirty Jeeps when half of his church members he claims to love are jumping from okada to molue like newmi?

March man:

@joagbaje. I am also a member of CE but I don't deify Pastor Chris

Has anyone said otherwise but I doubt your membership.

He is but a man with all our flaws. So it is not everything that comes out of his mouth that is the gospel. So I make God the focus of my worship and not the priest. Then I reject the prosperity gospel that is the foundation of the church. I think this fuels greed and not genuine love for God. It is about what's in
It for me.

I really  doubt your membership. Because you don't even understand the ministry. The focus u
Is Jesus , eternal life,new creation. God life at work in us. How many times have you heard pastor chris on tv teaching money money money. He teaches on the life in the spirit. Money matter is only once in a long while.

If I give a prado jeep, what will God give me? This is not what Christ or Paul preached. It is not about self, or what God will give us. But most people in CE get this wrong. Their desire to give is driven by what they hope to get. This makes God seem like an investment banker, looking out to bless people that have given(sown). This is not God. It Is Mormon!

You are wrong,I doubt if you're a member of CEC except you're new or not very committed.  We give as a way of life. We give to meet needs, and we get blessed. We don't give prado to get a hummer. When I gave the prado, I began drive a bus without a/c . For some months. I'm teaching truth here .A giver must recieve. I'm presently using a jeep wrangler, Its even a deeper life member that was led to give me. I recieve strange things. This things looks crazy but that's the life we live  The I can't deny the power of giving. This truths works for anyone who believes. There are things God has ordained you to get free. If you don't practice giving ,They may not come. If a man does not give he is missing a lot.  . Somebody is making noise over 30 jeeps . Just 30 jeep not even a jet . ? Will you blame a man for what he receives? Does he know how pastor chris gives . Why not do your own giving.

Then Joagbaje if you gave a car, how come you are boasting about it here?

We were discussing the benefit of sowing seed in a thread , so it was inline  it was an illustration.

Are you not aware that the left hand should not know what the right has given? Well according to the bible, you have already gotten your reward.

That has to do with motive. It's only God that sees the motive of the heart .didn't Jesus talk about how he fed 5,000.? If the motive is for the praise of men,that praise is all we get,but if the motive is to give glory to God. Nothing wrong with it.Didn't paul talk about how he laboured more than other apostles? It depends the motive.

1 Corinthians 15:10
10 But by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me.

Joagbaje:

[size=14pt]There are things God has ordained you to get free. If you don't practice giving ,they may not come.[/size]

If a man does not give he is missing a lot.  . Somebody is making noise over 30 jeeps. Just 30 jeep not even a jet. Does he know how pastor chris gives? .

Another God demeaning whist man glorifying post!

So God has decided to give you, but if you don't give, God cannot deliver?

And though rubbish in itself within the "Ministry", 1 Jet for 1 person makes much MORE sense than 1 man having 30 jeeps! That is what is called real "POVERTY MENTALITY" - to see success as how many of the same useless adornments you have!

Joagbaje:

Has anyone said otherwise but I doubt your membership.


I really  doubt your membership. Because you don't even understand the ministry. The focus u
Is Jesus , eternal life,new creation. God life at work in us. How many times have you heard pastor chris on tv teaching money money money. He teaches on the life in the spirit. Money matter is only once in a long while.


You are wrong,I doubt if you're a member of CEC except you're new or not very committed.  We give as a way of life. We give to meet needs, and we get blessed. We don't give prado to get a hummer. When I gave the prado, I began drive a bus without a/c . For some months. I'm teaching truth here .A giver must recieve. I'm presently using a jeep wrangler, Its even a deeper life member that was led to give me. I recieve strange things. This things looks crazy but that's the life we live  The I can't deny the power of giving. This truths works for anyone who believes. There are things God has ordained you to get free. If you don't practice giving ,They may not come. If a man does not give he is missing a lot.  . Somebody is making noise over 30 jeeps . Just 30 jeep not even a jet . ? Will you blame a man for what he receives? Does he know how pastor chris gives . Why not do your own giving.

We were discussing the benefit of sowing seed in a thread , so it was inline  it was an illustration.

That has to do with motive. It's only God that sees the motive of the heart .didn't Jesus talk about how he fed 5,000.? If the motive is for the praise of men,that praise is all we get,but if the motive is to give glory to God. Nothing wrong with it.Didn't paul talk about how he laboured more than other apostles? It depends the motive.

1 Corinthians 15:10
10 But by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me.

Joagbje don vex na

nuclearboy:

Another God demeaning whist man glorifying post!

So God can be "demeaned" Terrible
Ask yourself WHO IS GOD?
Because l think that if you ever got to know who He is such expression

@ Newmi:

Hey, what's up? You've not been as active of recent!

Hope you are good (even if you think I'm your enemy)

PS: had typed above only to "post" and see you had written your normal brainless stuff above!

Go get a dictionary - if I say you are "stewpid" (NL no gree me spell rightly but u understand), that would normally be considered as demeaning. But that's in other people's cases, cos in yours, its just true talk

Have a nice day and pls don't fall off a Okada today

nuclearboy:

So God has decided to give you, but if you don't give, God cannot deliver?

Luke 6:38
"Give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall men give into your bosom. For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again"
Jesus Himself said "GIVE" and the resultant outcome will be "IT SHALL BE GIVEN UNTO YOU" meaning that He ties and anchors "BE GIVEN UNTO YOU" to your "GIVING"
l think that is simple enough for everybody to understand. . . . no Greek no Hebrew

Ha Newmi,

Why do you have a comprehension problem?

WHO said it is wrong to give? What everyone is saying here is "what is a follower of Christ, especially one "supposedly" devoted to shepherding His Flock, doing with 30 SUVs?"!

The designer suits? The extra and unneeded cars? The greed these expose? What do they add to God's Kingdom?

Okay, you wish to say he gives them out, right? To whom? Is it to the unemployed university graduate?? How will he maintain it? Is it to the poor widow struggling to feed her 3 children? Will she not be exploited when selling it so she can buy food and start a small biz?

So you, Newmi, gets 20Million then buy yaks yaps a 7 million jeep cos it must be new. Then he gives it to a hungry family who take it to one of the car dealers in "autos" who sells it (shebi na tokunbo\used now) for 3 million and gives them 2.5M - is this sensible?? And this is the BEST your posturing implies can happen!

Think! Your brain was meant for use!

@joagbaje @mabell

I am. Member of CE. Been a member of since 2006 in Lagos.

You don't get the gist of my post, do you? It is that giving to church or to people is a confidential thing, nothing to boast about on Nairaland! How come we all know that you gave a prado jeep and now you are driving a wrangler? Be true to yourself, is this a Christian attitude? If Christ were to be alive, would he boast about his big Mercedez Benz?

Again, you make it sound as if God is a business man looking for people who will invest ( sow) in his business so that he would give them returns on their investments. And the larger the investments, the greater the returns. My brother, God is not man. This is the system of the World and not of God. If it were so all CE members would be billionaires. But I know many that are struggling no job, no food, can't pay school fees or house rents because of money challenges. Yet they are givers, spending their last dime on the church for all kinds of programs, yet their finances are in a terrible shape. They are encourage to continue to give and give as if that's is the fulcrum of the Christian message. It is not. Don't get me wrong. I am not saying giving is wrong. It is good. But that is not all Christ preached about and he didn't condition God's blessings on how much we can give. He didnt tell anyone that if they gave black and white tv, he would get a plasma. He preached love, which would spur you to give according to what you decide in your heart, and not out of necessity or target (of the church or pastor). And he chooses who to bless because he sees the heart. That's why Christ picked the widow who gave her last mite out of the thousands giving in the synagogue on the day he visited. If it was CE, the widow would not even be noticed. It's all those giving in 'millions' who catch the fancy of the pastor. And they actually get rewarded with awards at the end of the year for their giving. CE looks at the Church record, but God looks at the heart. I used to joke with my wife that if I stole my organisation's money and gave it to the church, that I will definitely get several awards at IPPC. Reason is that the church would see a brother giving millions, while God will see a thief. Who should I please? God or the Church?
@mabell. I am member of CE. Really I am. But even in church, I have learnt to make God the focus of my worship. On the day of resurrection, I will account for my life and will not stand behind Pastor Chris or Rev Anita. Two issues made me to re evaluate my relationship with the Church. First I gave some money to my then Fiancee to keep for me. She gave it all to the church. Let me not be diplomatic. She stole it and gave to the church. I was mad and that almost destroyed our relationship. But me being me, I started asking myself, why she did what she did. I arrived at the conclusion that the church put too much slant on giving. Giving huge targets and implying that you only move to the next level when meet these targets. This belief has created people who will give their last dime on the church, but will not help their family friends or even themselves. My then Fiancee was a case in point. She spent all the money on the church and did not even buy a lipstick for herself. Meanwhile she had great need. So was her family. In fact you can't mention CE where her father is. He believes the church has created very selfish people who don't help their family.

Secondly, I visited a church in Abuja where the pastor divide the church into four, according to how members are giving. No comment.

I have a flight to catch. I wish you all above every thing else that you reason this post according to what Christ preached. Ciao!

March man:

If it were so all CE members would be billionaires. But I know many that are struggling no job, no food, can't pay school fees or house rents because of money challenges. Yet they are givers, spending their last dime on the church for all kinds of programs, yet their finances are in a terrible shape. They are encourage to continue to give and give as if that's is the fulcrum of the Christian message. It is not.

This is the untold story of CE (I used to be a member) and indeed many other places with an undue emphasis on giving and prosperity.

From interaction with many people in CE I had a first hand experience of their financial situation. Many would be struggling with their rent payment and still be encouraged to give and would give only to carry on struggling. Some were secretly in debt (in the U.K. where there's easier access to consumer credit), but outwardly would want to display signs that their giving was working. Yet they would quietly confide in me about their debt problem because they know I work in Finance.

The illusion was too much.

^^

Perfect example of the above was when 1st Newmi and then later Azibulua in fits of forgetfulness, mistakenly disclosed they preach to the riders of the Okadas that transport them around while they make it a point to call people like "pastor Kun" (wey fit buy their meat for him dog) "poverty striken". At that same time btw, lying "pastor" jo was telling some of us that "Okadaic-Azibulua" is Goodluck Jonathans 1st cousin rolling and dancing in money!

illusion PLUS delusion

---sighs-------


I wonder what Sigmund Frued would make of the Brain-damage some posters portray here. It is enormously sad and  I seriously pity the African continent. Progress is much farther than we think.


Miss Mabel, no offence but where does your loyalty lie?

In Man, in Church or in God.

The very mention of Pastor Chris raises a lot of blood pressure, his loyal members rush out with guns blazing to defend him, yet several threads has been opened on this site to challenge the divinity of Christ, yet this vigour displayed to defend this pastor is absent in [b]some [/b]of those threads.

Hypocrites.

@ Post

If true,  What does a sane person need 30 cars for? ( Dont care if it is Adeboye, Babangida, Sultan of Brunei, MC Hammer or Oyedepo)


It beggars belief. Yet some ignorant minds scream "poverty mentality", seriously

How does that wasteful attribute affect humanity? Does it make Jesus happy wherever he is?

People are dying in East Africa when a couple of [b]biscuits [/b]can prolong their lives for a few more hours, when people that claim to speak with God are flying around in [b]Jets [/b]and driving in convoys of luxurious cars.

I agree with the poster that said most of these pastors are atheists. How can you believe in God and yet be unsympathetic to human deprivation. The hypocrisy is astounding and people wonder why there are atheists.

Shameful.

@dare2think:

No need to go as far as East Africa! Just go into ANY of their own parishes and you will see hopelessness being compounded because their lunch money will again be "invested" just in case that day will be their "own" day.

This is why some of us have taken it to this extreme especially when we discuss with such as Joagbaje outside and see a different person who understands just how dangerous the teachings are but vacillitates between sanity and greed since he doesn't know what honest business holds for him- which is all the more tragic considering the noise he makes about faith here on NL. You'll notice he totally avoids some of us!

Pitiful to be a pastor who is scared that telling the truth will make his daughters go hungry!

Well, assuming photo is true as/and Chris Embassy people have not denied it as far as I can see:

[s]This is the Lord's doing and it is marvellous in our sight[/s]

Naaaaah, more like

This is the fruit of mugus' tithes and Offer 7 and it is marvellous in Oyakhilome's sight!


Meanwhile the people in East Africa and other poor people everywhere don't know what is good for them; the way to get out of their poverty is by giving --- especially to Oyakhilome (and maybe Joagbaje) in the form of tithes, "voluntary" offering, Offer 7 etc.

Edit I forgot to add: this giving to become rich thing - especially through tithes and Offer 7 etc - is a law, a principle, a spiritual principle; obedience of this law brings blessing and the pastor collecting it carries blessing.

Meanwhile remember importantly: apart from obeying the law to give to pastors, nowhere in the New Testament are we told to obey God!

I fall ma pastor hand 4church yday. Afta we don drop our offering, ma Pastor just cum out nd said let sombodi do somtin crazy 4 de Lord. Everybodi jumped n screamed. pastor say u dont undastand i mean sometin vry crazy, pple begin roll 4floor, pastor say u ar nt der yet i said do somtin more crazzzzy 4d lord, d tin just vex me na im I run 2 d altar grab d offering bowl run comot 4church.

^^^^^Lmao!!

@ March Man
Please you don't have to prove CE membership to anyone because ultimately, it is your relationship with God that really matters.

March man:

@joagbaje @mabell

I am. Member of CE. Been a member of since 2006 in Lagos.

Maybe you visit dude. Well all manner of people come and go. Like the 419 who may give a church bad name . You don't undertand the faith message in CEC so I seriously doubt your membership.

You don't get the gist of my post, do you? It is that giving to church or to people is a confidential thing, nothing to boast about on Nairaland!

Leave me and Jesus . It's a religious forum and , I can share a testimony . To inspire others .if you don't like it. Just move on.

Again, you make it sound as if God is a business man looking for people who will invest ( sow) in his business so that he would give them returns on their investments. And the larger the investments, the greater the returns.

Satan hates the truth and he will fight it. What do you say about these scriptures.

2 Corinthians 9:6
6 But this I say, He which soweth sparingly shall reap also sparingly; and he which soweth bountifully shall reap also bountifully.


Galatians 6:7-9
7 Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. . . 9 And let us not be weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not.

My brother, God is not man. This is the system of the World and not of God.

That's the problem . You see spiritual principles as of the world. Would you rather have peasants in the church who will always need assistance or make a giant out of them by teaching them truth. On how to prosper.

If it were so all CE members would be billionaires. But I know many that are struggling no job, no food, can't pay school fees or house rents because of money challenges.

Do all practise it? If you claim you're there and yet you don't believe. Are there not others like you as well.

Yet they are givers, spending their last dime on the church for all kinds of programs, yet their finances are in a terrible shape.

You can't speak for another person. Faith will always produce result. If a man gives by faith ,he will have result. Except the bible is not true.

I am not saying giving is wrong. It is good. But that is not all Christ preached about and he didn't condition God's blessings on how much we can give.

So have I said otherwise? We are already blessed, but your giving creates atmosphere to recieve.

He didnt tell anyone that if they gave black and white tv, he would get a plasma.

So who's talking about plasma , we don't recieve by arithmetic. But there's RECIEVING for a giving.  You won't have harvest if you don't sow. It's a principle .That's the point.

Luke 6:38
38 Give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall men give into your bosom. For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again.

He preached love, which would spur you to give according to what you decide in your heart, and not out of necessity or target (of the church or pastor).

So who says other wise? Everybody give without a gun on their head. Can someone force you to give? You give for yourself, and if you don't give, who loses? But if you don't have to give today, God sees your heart , if you desire to give , you will have .

And he chooses who to bless because he sees the heart. That's why Christ picked the widow who gave her last mite out of the thousands giving in the synagogue on the day he visited.

He chose her because she gave the most! . That was a dangerous sacrifice . She gave God everything ,without wondering what to eat next. That's faith!

If it was CE, the widow would not even be noticed. It's all those giving in 'millions' who catch the fancy of the pastor. And they actually get rewarded with awards at the end of the year for their giving. CE looks at the Church record,

That's why I said you're not a member. Because pastor chris teaches otherwise. He even address pastors to be careful not to judge a man by his seed. Because that person may just be giving his last dime by faith.

but God looks at the heart. I used to joke with my wife that if I stole my organisation's money and gave it to the church, that I will definitely get several awards at IPPC. Reason is that the church would see a brother giving millions, while God will see a thief. Who should I please? God or the Church?

You're definately an outsider. Youve just exposed yourself. How can you be so carnal in your imagination. Of course  you may win award if that's your focus. But nemesis will catch up with you. Some have tried it and we saw what happened.If you dont be I've in the teaching and structure of CEC, why not find your place. Instead of being in the limbo .

I have gotten further confirmation from the guy who took the picture and I can boldly confirm that the pic in the OP is Oyakhilome's house and the Jeeps in the pic are just a few of his over thirty Jeeps. How won't false preachers abound when they stand to scam so much money without efcc chasing them around it's high time we examine our laws and see how we can use it to prosecute all these con men committing fraud using the name of God.

March man:

@joagbaje @mabell


@mabell. I am member of CE.
Secondly, I visited a church in Abuja where the pastor divide the church into four, according to how members are giving. No comment.

You are so not saying the truth. There is no church in the whole of CE that can do that

Leave the guy abegi. He is one of those people. Isn't it crazy , a church will divide people to sit according to giving. .
What are we not going to hear on this forum.

i still dont see any need for us to keep criticizing others. i have said it here sometime last year that the bible says we shouldnt judge. the bible also says we should allow the seed and the weed/pest grow together till the day of harvest. why arent christians reading and taking heed to what the scripture says?