The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display - Religion (5) - Nairaland
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| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by Enigma(m): 6:47pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
@Pebcak You might find another post I made earlier helpful. Note a major difference between Roman Catholics and others --- others even including Eastern Orthodox. These others believe that the Apocrypha is not part of the canon even though its books can be useful secondarily. On the other hand Roman Catholics say anyone that does not accept the Apocrypha as part of the canon is ---- anathema! (Roman Catholics too like to dey swear for people, I tell you!)  So, here is that one I made earlier ......... 1. Jerome ('church father'), Gregory ('pope'), Cajetan ('cardinal') --- all Roman Catholics; all major Roman Catholics (all speaking before the Roman Catholics finally set their own canon) ---- all AGREE with the so-called "Protestants" about the books of the canon! 2. To clarify further, the King James version (originally and for a long time and still in some editions) took the same approach as Jerome, Gregory I, Cajetan as well as Athanasius that the books of the Apocrypha are not in the canon but can be useful in a secondary role. Thus the KJV used to include the Apocrypha but place them in a different part to mark their distinction from the main canonical books. A further note of interest, even today, there are still "protestants" who use books of the Apocrypha in this secondary role. The Roman Catholics like to muddy the waters, throw confusion and hope people will not notice their lies if they are not familiar with or clear on the history and development of the canon (or even canons) of the Bible.  |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by katsim(m): 6:51pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
We don`t ask Abraham to pray for us. Where in the bible did God tell you to ask Mary to pray for you I want to know so please my dear tell me |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by Nobody: 6:53pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
Resolution 24 of the council of carthage in 419CE Canon 24. (Greek xxvii.) That nothing be read in church besides the Canonical Scripture Item, that besides the Canonical Scriptures nothing be read in church under the name of divine Scripture. But the Canonical Scriptures are as follows: Genesis. Exodus. Leviticus. Numbers. Deuteronomy. Joshua the Son of Nun. The Judges. Ruth. The Kings, iv. books. The Chronicles, ij. books. Job. The Psalter. The Five books of Solomon. The Twelve Books of the Prophets. Isaiah. Jeremiah. Ezechiel. Daniel. Judith. Esther. Ezra, ij. books. Macchabees, ij. books. The New Testament. The Gospels, iv. books. The Acts of the Apostles, j. book. The Epistles of Paul, xiv. The Epistles of Peter, the Apostle, ij. The Epistles of John the Apostle, iij. The Epistles of James the Apostle, j. The Epistle of Jude the Apostle, j. The Revelation of John, j. book. Let this be sent to our brother and fellow bishop, Boniface, and to the other bishops of those parts, that they may confirm this canon, for these are the things which we have received from our fathers to be read in church http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/3816.htm |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by Pebcak: 6:54pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
Thats a good point it depends on how you look at it lets check this out and let the timeline explain your answer Creation - B.C. 2000 - Originally, the earliest Scriptures are handed down from generation to generation orally. Circa B.C. 2000-1500 - The book of Job, perhaps the oldest book of the Bible, is written. Circa B.C. 1500-1400 - The stone tablets of the Ten Commandments are given to Moses at Mount Sinai and later stored in the Ark of the Covenant. Circa B.C. 1400–400 - The manuscripts comprising the original Hebrew Bible (39 Old Testament books) are completed. The Book of the Law is kept in the tabernacle and later in the Temple beside the Ark of the Covenant. Circa B.C. 300 - All of the original Old Testament Hebrew books have been written, collected, and recognized as official, canonical books. Circa B.C. 250–200 - The Septuagint, a popular Greek translation of the Hebrew Bible (39 Old Testament books), is produced. The 14 books of the Apocrypha are also included. Circa A.D. 45–100 - Original 27 books of the Greek New Testament are written. Circa A.D. 140-150 - Marcion of Sinope's heretical "New Testament" prompted Orthodox Christians to establish a New Testament canon. Circa A.D. 200 - The Jewish Mishnah, the Oral Torah, is first recorded. Circa A.D. 240 - Origen compiles the Hexapla, a six-columned parallel of Greek and Hebrew texts. Circa A.D. 305-310 - Lucian of Antioch's Greek New Testament text becomes the basis for the Textus Receptus. Circa A.D. 312 - Codex Vaticanus is possibly among the original 50 copies of the Bible ordered by Emperor Constantine. It is eventually kept in the Vatican Library in Rome. Enigma: |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by Enigma(m): 6:57pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
A propos Carthage, here is one I made earlier.  https://www.nairaland.com/1478018/why-churches-different-doctrines-denominations/23#19111959So our friends like to claim that they "ratified" Carthage. They hang this on a quotation allegedly included in the acts of Carthage. But that is the very one that experts said (two posts above edit follow link on first line of this post) is probably not original. What is more, our friends have their own way of translating the passage to English as if the Africans were subjecting their canon to the "authority" of Rome. That is: "However, the sentence "Let this be made known also to our brother and fellow-priest Boniface, or to other bishops of those parts, for the purpose of confirming that Canon" cannot belong to either of these councils." Meanwhile a late leading Roman Catholic historian (and bishop to boot), i.e. Hefele, admits (in agreement with other experts) that the true translation of the passage is not as the #masterforgers like to claim! Again, from here http://www.bible-researcher.com/carthage.html "In connection with this, it has been observed that at least one manuscript indicates that the original wording of the sentence was “De confirmando isto canone transmarina ecclesia consulatur” (“For the confirmation of this canon the church across the sea shall be consulted”). This is the reading adopted by Hefele for his reconstruction of the council of Hippo, and Westcott mentions it in a note. 9 More recent authors tend to present the canon of the third council of Carthage with this emendation." Again, #masterforgers we salute!  |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by Nobody: 7:02pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
The catholic church has already compiled the bible as it exists in today's catholic bible since the fourth century. The first church council that produced the current catholic bible was the council of hippo in 393CE,this was later followed by the councils of carthage 397CE,419CE and finally trent in 1546. Prior to this heretics like Marcion of sinope and catholics like Origen,Athanasius etc have tried to articulate their own personal view of what they consider to be the canon which was contradictory consequently these views were later rejected by the aforementioned Church councils |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by mystical10: 7:02pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
ayoku777:see this one. But u do go to man of god 4 him to pray for u.st peter is in heaven he can pray for someone pls. Hw can u say robsh outof hatred. |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by Enigma(m): 7:07pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
Pebcak: Thats a good point it depends on how you look at it lets check this out and let the timeline explain You see the bit in your own timeline that I've bolded? It knocks out any lies by Roman Catholics that they "compiled" the Bible. 1. The Old Testament was written and compiled before there was the Roman Catholic Church 2. The Septuagint which also included the Apocrypha was made before there was the Roman Catholic Church 3. The most crucial New Testament was at least written before there was any such thing as the Roman Catholic Church NOTE All the above is based on your own timeline. Now the New Testament I add the following 4. We know from the Bible that the books of the New Testament started to be compiled even during the era of the apostles 5. We know by the time of Polycarp that most of the books of the New Testament had already been compiled Again all these before there was the Roman Catholic Church We know by the time of the Origen that Christians did not regard the Apocrypha as canonical Then came the Roman Catholics some 1400 years later and "canonised" the Apocrypha and declaring as anathema more sensible Christians who remain faithful to Christian practice through the ages. And you expect us to take them seriously? |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by hardbody: 7:08pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
chukwudi44: I give up on you. 1 Like |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by Nobody: 7:09pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
THANK GOD I AM A CATHOLIC! 1 Like
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| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by mystical10: 7:09pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
ayoku777:everytin is not in bible some are remove. Go and read abt translation of bible and co, u will see that catholics are the orignator of bible, whenever i see ppl talking tht catholic dnt read bible i laugh |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by komek(m): 7:13pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
chukwudi44: Then what is the Job of ur Reverend Father who is still alive? |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by Enigma(m): 7:14pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
When the Roman Catholics have been exposed and the fact revealed that they made their own Bible only in the 16th century at Trent without even being able to secure majority support, they revert to the traditional lies about the 4th century and Hippo and Carthage. First they cannot find any list from Hippo --- except they are trying to gerrymander one from Carthage back into Hippo! Second, it has been pointed out by scholars that even the list from Carthage might have been gerrymandered. Most importantly as late as the 16th century just before Trent a leading Roman Catholic confirmed that Carthage was merely a provincial i.e. regional affair. In any event, that "pope" Gregory I in the 6th/7th centuries believed that the Apocrypha was not part of the canon already refutes attempts by Roman Catholics to claim Carthage. Anyhoooos, here again is one I made earlier .............................. Meanwhile let us hear what the chief Roman Catholic theological opponent of Luther, during the Reformation, himself said about the Apocrypha. Per "Cardinal" Cajetan "Here we close our commentaries on the historical books of the Old Testament. For the rest (that is, Judith, Tobit, and the books of Maccabees) are counted by St Jerome out of the canonical books, and are placed amongst the Apocrypha, along with Wisdom and Ecclesiasticus, as is plain from the Prologus Galeatus. Nor be thou disturbed, like a raw scholar, if thou shouldest find anywhere, either in the sacred councils or the sacred doctors, these books reckoned as canonical. For the words as well of councils as of doctors are to be reduced to the correction of Jerome. Now, according to his judgment, in the epistle to the bishops Chromatius and Heliodorus, these books (and any other like books in the canon of the Bible) are not canonical, that is, not in the nature of a rule for confirming matters of faith. Yet, they may be called canonical, that is, in the nature of a rule for the edification of the faithful, as being received and authorised in the canon of the Bible for that purpose. By the help of this distinction thou mayest see thy way clearly through that which Augustine says, and what is written in the provincial council of Carthage." Note a few things: 1. Apocrypha books are not truly canonical for confirming matters of faith; they may only be for edification 2. He suggests this is what Council of Carthage decided; which means that what the Roman Catholics did hundreds of years later at Trent does not even agree with Carthage. Yet the Roman Catholics declared "anathema" those who take the position of Cajetan! Is Cajetan now also "anathema"? What irony! 3. Cajetan completely contradicts the lie that Roman Catholics spread today by confirming what some of us have been saying: Carthage was merely a provincial council! 4. If Carthage was authoritative or had truly been "ratified" by Rome, why then did Rome need Trent to finalise its "canon"? 5. If Rome already had a settled canon in the 4th century how come it needed to establish a canon hundreds of years later in the 16th century? 6. Was any of Rome's claimed canons ever binding on the other people who set out canons e.g Athanasius etc? 1 Like |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by mystical10: 7:14pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
Ajibam:hehehe. If u say so, wht can u say abt ppl tht takes muoka, adeboye, t.b joshua etc as God and wen to them for prayers. Live mater 4 mathias |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by macof(m): 7:17pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
mystical10: everytin is not in bible some are remove. Go and read abt translation of bible and co, u will see that catholics are the orignator of bible, whenever i see ppl talking tht catholic dnt read bible i laugh Don't mind them they have no idea that catholics own the Bible and all doctrines in catholism that are diff. From others is because the Romans love their culture and traditions, even when they made catholism. It's still The best and longest standing Christian denomination |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by Ukutsgp(m): 7:29pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
Catholic is really a joke |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by chefdoeuvre: 7:34pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
Mehn..its nt gud 2b blindly fanatical... 'Enigma' has been downloading sm really interesting facts ryt here n many of u guys who r jes dwnryt bigots have neither commented, refuted factually nor accepted.. There's a thin line btwn fanaticism n realism pips... Let d show cntinue.. #continues drinkin gari |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by Infomaz(m): 7:37pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
Mystery Babylon @ work. This is Necromancy, Spiritism & Occultism. This is Paganised Christianity. |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by mystical10: 7:40pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
vivacious vivi: I am sorry but all you catholics that are here trying to justify why a bunch of old bone fragments should be displayed and worshiped need to be have a serious rethink about their faith. I was born catholic like so many others here in my generation so I am not speaking as a "hater" bust someone who saw through the misguided doctrines of the catholic church and got saved. Virgin Mary, St. Peter and all the "saints" wont save you but the Lord Jesus Christ and He alone. Its never to late.we dn hear live us alone.but T.b joshua picture save ur burning house other day 1 Like |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by Nobody: 7:48pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
I was at CAC this afternoon and met team of lawyers compiling lists of churches in Nigeria only to be told that they v bn doing it for d past 2months!! People coming to register their church are being turned back simply becos the name they want to give to their church have bn used! One man became frustrated and chose to name his church ' FLYING TO GREATER HEGHTS CHURCH OF CHRIST!! This isn't just a joke but madness!! Churches bn registered as bizness with a whole family as board of trustees! Shame on u protestants cuz u have made mockery and huge joke of christianity! Ukuts gp: Catholic is really a joke 1 Like |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by Nobody: 7:54pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
U dey mind them ...even those that go to church to look for bf and husband have turned preachers lol mystical10: we dn hear live us alone.but T.b joshua picture save ur burning house other day |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by anochuko01(m): 7:55pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
when Jesus ressurected, all the SAINTS who died b4 him all arose together with Him. Matthew 27:52-53 "and the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose, and came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many." .............................................. while those who died after the resurection of Christ will all ARISE only at His second coming. 1thessalonians 4:16 "For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first" .............................................. So, mary, paul and all other souls are all in HADES or SHEOL (where souls await the second coming of Christ). However, Jesus is the FIRST BORN AMONG THE DEAD. HE'S ALIVE AND HE'S THE ONLY MEDIATOR BTW MEN AND GOD. |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by mademoiselle(f): 8:05pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
ayoku777: U believe what u believe n we believe what we believe. 2 Likes |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by frankdrek(m): 8:16pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
Matthew 16:18 And I tell you that you are Peter,[a] and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades[b] will not overcome it. ...........All you scientist and philosophers ..... Go to CAC ....and get ur new church registered...don't voice what u not clear about.... Only God Judge. Proud to b a catholic. peace. 1 Like |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by Enigma(m): 8:24pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
^^^ Listen to Augustine of Hippo "Now this name of Peter was given him by the Lord, and that in a figure, that he should signify the Church. For seeing that Christ is the rock (Petra), Peter is the Christian people. For the rock (Petra) is the original name. Therefore Peter is so called from the rock; not the rock from Peter; as Christ is not called Christ from the Christian, but the Christian from Christ. "Therefore," he says, "You are Peter; and upon this Rock" which you have confessed, upon this Rock which you have acknowledged, saying, "You are the Christ, the Son of the living God, will I build My Church;" that is upon Myself, the Son of the living God, "will I build My Church." I will build you upon Myself, not Myself upon you." Like say na after Trent and Vatican I, dem for don anathematise, excommunicate, apostasise Augustine tay tay! And no be only him oh! I still dey come with Jerome dem and co. 1 Like |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by Cashio(m): 8:32pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
texanomaly:which one be catholic bible again? |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by Joshthefirst(m): 8:35pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
Enigma: ^^^ Listen to Augustine of Hippoblessed be the name of the lord |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by frankdrek(m): 8:40pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
frankdrek: Matthew 16:18 |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by Enigma(m): 8:47pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
Per Ambrose of Milan {Roman Catholic "church father"}: "He, then, who before was silent, to teach us that we ought not to repeat the words of the impious, this one, I say, when he heard, ‘But who do you say I am,’ immediately, not unmindful of his station, exercised his primacy, that is, the primacy of confession, not of honor; the primacy of belief, not of rank. ... This, then, is Peter, who has replied for the rest of the Apostles; rather, before the rest of men. And so he is called the foundation, because he knows how to preserve not only his own but the common foundation. ... Faith, then, is the foundation of the Church, for it was not said of Peter’s flesh, but of his faith, that ‘the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.’ But his confession of faith conquered hell. And this confession did not shut out one heresy, for, since the Church like a good ship is often buffeted by many waves, the foundation of the Church should prevail against all heresies." |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by mu2sa2: 8:50pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
texanomaly:And the inconsistent passages are both "word of god"? Ur god said one thing in kjv and contradicts itself in Catholic bible? 1 Like |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by moderatorr: 8:53pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
chukwudi44:was it not the same catholic church that compiled those 73 books in the 1st place? you and this ur coconut head sef. |
| Re: The Bones Of St Peter Go On Display by Enigma(m): 8:57pm On Nov 14, 2013 |
^ It is not even correct to say that the Roman Catholics "compiled" the Bible as my posts above have argued; it is neither correct to say that the first Bible had 73 books. It is in fact a lie. |
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