chrisd, you should read a course in historical criticism and modern historiography. The Bible is far from being historically correct, it is loosely based on some historical facts, but greatly exaggerated. There is some evidence pointing to an exile of the Jewish people in Babylon, the story of Moses though does not have any credible archaeological evidence behind it and a lot of evidence against.

chrisd:

About 1500 years. Anyway, the Bible is not supposed to be error free, but it is supposed to be accurate.

Far more than that.
How do you define accuracy in this context?

chrisd:

About 1500 years. Anyway, the Bible is not supposed to be error free, but it is supposed to be accurate.

accuracy is by definition error free - or with minimal error

precision - a series of measurements that are very close but off by some baseline amount.

So, I guess we should expect the bible to be precise, not accurate. . . but its not even that

Was talking about new testament

Accurate in the sense of how much it is away from the original – 4 or 5.

@ chrisd

Maybe you should read the book The Incredible Shrinking Son of Man by Robert M. Price. I just received it. Mightily interesting.
see: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1591021219/qid=1136577212/sr=8-1/ref=sr_8_xs_ap_i1_xgl14/102-8137714-3567327?n=507846&s=books&v=glance

There are many things we can learn from the Bible if one uses it sometimes though.

Who was Christ?

1)A cultural and social revolutionary who disregarded the conventions of polite society.
2)Broke the religious laws regularly.
3)Associated with the "wrong crowd.
4)Challenged the emptiness and superficiality of societies traditions and beliefs.
5)Christ was crucified, at least partly, for being a modernist and an ethical relativist.
6)If Christ came to live among us now, fundamentalists would have him crucified again, not because they hate Christ, but because they would not recognize him.

Is not a far fetched idea though.

The Reformation and Renaissance began the modern period. It was then that words became more important than symbol, sacrament, and mystery, probably because of the advancement of empirical science. At this point the accuracy of the message of the Bible became tied to the absolute inerrancy of the Bible to the letter.

That got them into more problems then they solved.

Allonym, I think I am authority on the matter of measurement.

You can question Moses if you like. One thing is for sure, he did not part the red sea.

---- OFF TOPIC RANT ---

allonym vs. chrisd, an engineer vs. a physicist
Let's get this party started

I always like the part where the physcist calls the civvie shallow Maybe it's a dimensional problem

nferyn:

---- OFF TOPIC RANT ---

allonym vs. chrisd, an engineer vs. a physicist
Let's get this party started

I always like the part where the physcist calls the civvie shallow Maybe it's a dimensional problem

And where do you fit into this? What field are you in?

B.t.w. - i didn't know that you (chrisd) were a physicist

nferyn - if you use b.t.w. without the separators (in this case, dots), it gets expanded into "between"

chrisd:

Allonym, I think I am authority on the matter of measurement.

by being the authority on measurement. . . is this a reference to being a physicist?

can there be a reason why everyone on this page have totally gone off topics............

Christians: Can a Non-Christian Go to Heaven?

not what everyone has turn the thread into.......

Who is sure, that him or her is going to heaven? Just curious

I am, any reason why you want to know?

thats ur faith and not ours.....u are the one to make heaven to urself alone not me.....when u are due for it.....your qualification does not suit in for the two of us......its one man one visa to heaven

Iwould am a Bible believing Christian and I have asked God this
question many times,first of all we do not know God full thoughts on this matter but He does say
that He looks at are hearts. This is all we need to know
a meciful God will not condemn a man for the same reasons we would

What happens to all ur grand fathers, great grand fathers etc that were traditionalists?

Are you more interested in what happens to them than what happens to you and the people you can affect their lives now? no man is a judge, Jesus told peter to strive to enter in himself instead of asking how many will make it to heaven; in yourba it is called _{"so igba e" (watch your load)}

bro Nicetohave.......do explain more to em all...

First of all, God created this life that we have going on
He created everything in diversity and I think he loves his hand work

No one race or creed can claim ownership of God, or is our salvation in the hands
one man that most people don't even know about.

God is a God of All , and those who did right will get his Blessings
You don't need to be a Christian or Come to him through his "only Son"

The only son by which you need to be saved is YOU,
You are the son of God , the day you realize your self as the son of God and start to live like one,
You will begin to make that journey into the Kingdon of God your father

For the Christian fanatics, i must tell you that [b]there are no more Christians left
the last one was JESUS[/b]What we have no are bunch of hypocrites and confused, and stubborn souls who have
refused to see the light and shy away from real truth.

open your eyes and open your mind

Karine:


Iwould am a Bible believing Christian and I have asked God this
question many times,first of all we do not know God full thoughts on this matter but He does say
that He looks at are hearts. This is all we need to know
a meciful God will not condemn a man for the same reasons we would

Merciful? Can we really say things like God is good, merciful, kind, etc? Aren't we ascribing human emotions to God. Isn't God so beyond our capabality to understand. And if we must say God is merciful and kind, then why do babies that die without ever turning away from their sin and accepting their lord and savior jesus christ immediately goto hell?

In the Sermon on the Mount Jesus shows us a curious relationship between Christianity and suffering.
Consider it pure joy...whenever you face trials of many kinds, because you know that the testing develops perseverance. Perseverance must finish its work so that you will be mature and complete, not lacking anything. We also rejoice in our suffering because we know that suffering produces perseverance; perseverance, character, character, hope.

As emerson said about war and suffering:
War educates the senses, calls into action the will, perfects the physical constitution, brings men into such swift and close collision in critical moments that man measures man.

The cause of peace is not the cause of cowardice. If peace is sought to be defended or preserved for the safety of the luxurious and the timid, it is a sham. War is better, and the peace will be broken. If peace is to be maintained, it must be by brave men, who have come up to the same height as the hero, namely, the will to carry their life in their hand, and stake it at any instant for their principle, but who have gone one step beyond the hero, and will not seek another man's life;—men who have, by their intellectual insight, or else by their moral elevation, attained such a perception of their own intrinsic worth, that they do not think property or their own body a sufficient good to be saved by such dereliction of principle as treating a man like a sheep.

allonym:

Merciful? Can we really say things like God is good, merciful, kind, etc? Aren't we ascribing human emotions to God. Isn't God so beyond our capabality to understand. And if we must say God is merciful and kind, then why do babies that die without ever turning away from their sin and accepting their lord and savior jesus christ immediately goto hell?

Let me get you right, are you saying babies that die without the age of accountability go to hell? if that is what you mean, can you let me know what informed this insight of yours.

God is merciful, it is not a human attribute man in himself cannot demonstrate mercy, love, joy, longsuffering, kindness etc, all those are fruits of the spirit, imparted to us by God, hence you have gotten it backwards forward, it is an attribute of God imparted to men.

nicetohave:

Let me get you right, are you saying babies that die without the age of accountability go to hell? if that is what you mean, can you let me know what informed this insight of yours.

God is merciful, it is not a human attribute man in himself cannot demonstrate mercy, love, joy, longsuffering, kindness etc, all those are fruits of the spirit, imparted to us by God, hence you have gotten it backwards forward, it is an attribute of God imparted to men.

It is impossible for God to have any attributes we can describe other than with words which mean - this is so great we cannot possibly ever comprehend it.

Everyone knows what being merciful is. People can be said to be merciful. Why can't I demonstrate the fruits of the spirit? That doesn't make sense.

Now, as far as babies going to hell, well, the bible says that all are BORN in sin and shaped in iniquity.
- This means, as soon as you are born, you are a sinner.
- Only sinners who repent and accept Jesus Christ as their lord and savior can (does not neccessarily mean they will) goto heaven.
- This means babies that die before making this decision are going to hell.

Is there something YOU are misunderstanding?

What i am seeing is something you are not comprehending:

Lets start this way; the bible is written by the inspiration of God, the spirit of God moved men to write as he wills.

No sir, man does not know what being merciful is, and neither do you...........you only think you do

Why cant you manifest the fruit of the spirit?...........because you are spiritually dead, and dead things do not bear fruits!

I'll give you an example, in the day which you eat of the fruit, the same you shall die.......did adam and eve die that same day? absolutely!!! how? spiritually? how can we be revived? by the act of regeneration........that is what being born again is all about, it is your spiritual genes that is being revived, not the physical one, in the act of salvation..........and whosoever is not born of the water and the spirit shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

We are all shapen in iniquity, and it is amazing how you read the word of God with blind/dead spiritual eyes..........is that statement conclusive that those that dies as babies go to hell? or you just extrapolated? do you understand what the great white throne judgement signifies? i doubt!!! you "tear out" portions of the bible and interpret in isolation to the rest, the entirety of the word of God, no sir!!!

you still haven't answered this issue of "age of accountability".

There is no such thing in the bible.

Therefore, I still stand on my proclamation. All babies that die, goto hell.

[size=8pt][/size]Christianity is not a religion it is beliveing in God that he has died for us so one day we may live with him!!! [img][/img][center][/center]


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Jos boy email me at Tropicalgirl132@yahoo.com i sent a reply My reply is on page 9

Christianity is a Religion and it is believing that Jesus Christ died to wash away the sin of the earth. co ya?
But that doesnt mean that only christians go to Heaven, at least i dont think so, but i mentioned that and i cant remember which page, ?